Kickflash OS4: noob question! - Page 2

alexh · 08 June 2009, 17:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by Calgor

Where is this anti-piracy protection to force buying a real KS3.1 ROM documented?

I had heard it before and then Doobrey wrote:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Doobrey

#2. Does your A3000 have real 3.1 Kickstarts ? (There's a 'feature' of the KickFlash firmware, it won't remap if the first 16 bytes of the ROM image match that found in the physical ROMs)

woody.cool · 08 June 2009, 18:12

I've no idea at all now!
I bought the thing from AmigaKit ..... do you reckon their support line will know?

hit · 08 June 2009, 18:13

woody has 1.3 and 2.04. so a flashed 3.1 should get started by the firmware. otherwise the device is really useless :/

Jope · 08 June 2009, 18:14

The kickflash's remapping feature only works on A3640, CS1, CS2, CS3, CSPPC.. It uses the special maprom function of these cards, just like Piru's Blizkick.

There is no anti piracy, it will remap 3.1 onto a machine that has 3.0 ROMs, but only with one of those CPU cards.

If you don't have one of the aforementioned cards, you must get the machine to 3.1 by other means and then just have your modules on the kickflash and make sure that you configure the kickflash to only offer modules if 3.1 is detected.

I'm sure it would be possible to code a custom firmware that supported skick/mkick style relocation, but at the moment that doesn't exist.

hit · 08 June 2009, 18:23

cant find kickflash at amigakit store. did the product description mentioned the above restriction - aka turnkey solution?! i only can recall of a "zorro II" driven amiga is needed and mentioned. nothing about a special accelerator :/

woody.cool · 08 June 2009, 18:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by hit

woody has 1.3 and 2.04

Actually, I only have 2.04 ..... my A3000 just has 2.04 chips (37.175) .... it's not a SuperKickstart machine.

Quote:

Originally Posted by hit

so a flashed 3.1 should get started by the firmware. otherwise the device is really useless :/

My thoughts exactly

Quote:

Originally Posted by hit

cant find kickflash at amigakit store. did the product description mentioned the above restriction - aka turnkey solution?! i only can recall of a "zorro II" driven amiga is needed and mentioned. nothing about a special accelerator :/

That's the annoying thing .... there was no mention of this 'issue' at all.
I wish I'd have known before I spent the money.

Oddly, they seem to have removed the product from their website.

hit · 08 June 2009, 18:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by woody.cool

Oddly, they seem to have removed the product from their website.

google cache still had a copy of the advert. Lets see, if amigakit.com (eab account) will say something about that - for not fullfilling the advertised possibilities ("any amiga with zorro slot") i'd say - money back!

Edit: its still at amigakit.com, as of today, even not to be found while searching for "kickflash":
http://amigakit.leamancomputing.com/...roducts_id=268

Jope · 08 June 2009, 21:33

As you will note, they made no mention of a softkicking feature. It does all that they advertised even in a Zorro II machine.

The kickflash will show the modules that you installed in there when you plug it in and turn on the power.

It wasn't until 2004 when the Kickflash started to support kickstart remapping.

You can read all about that here: http://amiga.think42.com/news/news98_e.htm

woody.cool · 08 June 2009, 22:14

OK, so if that's the case, if I was to say ..... just upload an updated scsi.device into the Kickflash, is there a way I can tell if it's happened or not?
(does the Kickflash display some kind of confirmation message?)

Doobrey · 08 June 2009, 23:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by woody.cool

if I was to say ..... just upload an updated scsi.device into the Kickflash, is there a way I can tell if it's happened or not?

Open a shell/CLI and type:
version scsi.device

If it says 'scsi.device 37.19' then something went wrong (such as you tried to install a scsi.device for a different Amiga) and it's still using the one from your 2.04 ROM

Or you could use a program like LoadModule, again at the CLI type:
LoadModule LIST
and it should print out a list of all residents added to the KickTag list.

hit · 08 June 2009, 23:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jope

As you will note, they made no mention of a softkicking feature. It does all that they advertised even in a Zorro II machine.

yeah and they missed to mention the fact of 3.1 requierements for "ROM updates" while the thing actually is called "-AmigaOS ROM Update-". "Rom Updates" is missleading IMHO.

fryguy · 08 June 2009, 23:42

@Doobrey: i presume the first 16 bytes of the ROM is important and can't be changed to fool it ?

(i.e using the first 16 bytes from a 3.0 rom in a 3.1 romimage.)

Doobrey · 09 June 2009, 20:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by alexh

Quote:

Originally Posted by Calgor
Where is this anti-piracy protection to force buying a real KS3.1 ROM documented?

I had heard it before and then Doobrey wrote:

Nooo, if that was true, it'd be the most stupid copy protection in the world.
(why stop you kicking a 3.1 image when it finds real 3.1 ROMs,but allow you to kick a 3.1 image when it only finds 2.04?)

It looks like it's more of a safety check to see if it's already remapped the ROM.
IMHO, it's a stupid way of doing it. They should have checked the ROM checksum (at the end of the ROM) vs that of the ROM image instead of looking at the first 16 bytes ...which can be the same if you make a custom ROM image!

Doobrey · 09 June 2009, 20:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by fryguy

@Doobrey: i presume the first 16 bytes of the ROM is important and can't be changed to fool it ?

There are a couple of fields you could change, the ROM revision is the one you want.

Looking at the start of the ROM..

Code:

OFFSET VALUE
0000: 1114      512K ROM ID
0002: 4EF9      OPCODE FOR 'JMP'
0004: 00F800D2  ADDRESS OF THE INIT CODE
0008: 0000FFFF  ?????
000C: 0028      ROM VERSION
000E: 0044      ROM REVISION

In this example,it's 40.68 ($28,$44) you could bump the revision to 69($45).
Remember to recalculate the ROM checksum afterwards. (SumKick from the MKick archive is quick and easy)

fryguy · 10 June 2009, 01:05

@Doobrey: thanks might try it out, but i just ordered real 3.1 roms.

rkauer · 11 June 2009, 08:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by woody.cool

<SNIP>

I've tried the A500/A600/A2000 one, it works, but does not boot the hard drive (I just get the purple 'insert disk' screen) which is what I expected, because they don't have scsi.device built in!

Any ideas?

A minor correction: the 40.063 ROM have a SCSI.device, but intended for the IDE of the A600 or another Amiga (1000/500/2000)with the IDE Gayle "emulator".

woody.cool · 11 June 2009, 09:03

Quote:

Originally Posted by rkauer

A minor correction: the 40.063 ROM have a SCSI.device, but intended for the IDE of the A600 or another Amiga (1000/500/2000)with the IDE Gayle "emulator".

Fair enough!
Either way, it don't boot from HD on an A3000

rkauer · 11 June 2009, 19:16

Of course not! The A3000 have a real SCSI controller, not a IDE one transvestite on SCSI...

woody.cool · 11 June 2009, 19:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by rkauer

Of course not! The A3000 have a real SCSI controller, not a IDE one transvestite on SCSI...

exactly!

Still not got round to seeing if my Kickflash is actually working
I'm gonna flash just an update of scsi.device and check with the version command if it even works or not.

macce2 · 26 September 2019, 21:36

How about eFlash 4000 card(-s) ?

08 June 2009, 21:33	#28
Jope - Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Helsinki / Finland Age: 43 Posts: 9,866	As you will note, they made no mention of a softkicking feature. It does all that they advertised even in a Zorro II machine. The kickflash will show the modules that you installed in there when you plug it in and turn on the power. It wasn't until 2004 when the Kickflash started to support kickstart remapping. You can read all about that here: http://amiga.think42.com/news/news98_e.htm Last edited by Jope; 08 June 2009 at 21:39.

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08 June 2009, 18:12	#22
woody.cool Registered User Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Wakefield UK Age: 41 Posts: 119	I've no idea at all now! I bought the thing from AmigaKit ..... do you reckon their support line will know?

08 June 2009, 18:13	#23
hit Registered User Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: planet earth Posts: 1,115	woody has 1.3 and 2.04. so a flashed 3.1 should get started by the firmware. otherwise the device is really useless :/

08 June 2009, 18:14	#24
Jope - Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Helsinki / Finland Age: 43 Posts: 9,866	The kickflash's remapping feature only works on A3640, CS1, CS2, CS3, CSPPC.. It uses the special maprom function of these cards, just like Piru's Blizkick. There is no anti piracy, it will remap 3.1 onto a machine that has 3.0 ROMs, but only with one of those CPU cards. If you don't have one of the aforementioned cards, you must get the machine to 3.1 by other means and then just have your modules on the kickflash and make sure that you configure the kickflash to only offer modules if 3.1 is detected. I'm sure it would be possible to code a custom firmware that supported skick/mkick style relocation, but at the moment that doesn't exist.

08 June 2009, 18:23	#25
hit Registered User Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: planet earth Posts: 1,115	cant find kickflash at amigakit store. did the product description mentioned the above restriction - aka turnkey solution?! i only can recall of a "zorro II" driven amiga is needed and mentioned. nothing about a special accelerator :/

08 June 2009, 22:14	#29
woody.cool Registered User Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Wakefield UK Age: 41 Posts: 119	OK, so if that's the case, if I was to say ..... just upload an updated scsi.device into the Kickflash, is there a way I can tell if it's happened or not? (does the Kickflash display some kind of confirmation message?)

08 June 2009, 23:42	#32
fryguy Registered User Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Skarabörg, Sweden Age: 44 Posts: 1,020	@Doobrey: i presume the first 16 bytes of the ROM is important and can't be changed to fool it ? (i.e using the first 16 bytes from a 3.0 rom in a 3.1 romimage.)

10 June 2009, 01:05	#35
fryguy Registered User Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Skarabörg, Sweden Age: 44 Posts: 1,020	@Doobrey: thanks might try it out, but i just ordered real 3.1 roms.

11 June 2009, 19:16	#38
rkauer I hate potatos and shirts Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Sao Leopoldo / Brazil Age: 58 Posts: 3,482	Of course not! The A3000 have a real SCSI controller, not a IDE one transvestite on SCSI...

26 September 2019, 21:36	#40
macce2 Retro maniac Join Date: May 2005 Location: Finland Age: 49 Posts: 1,220	How about eFlash 4000 card(-s) ?

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