A600 Motorola 68010 cpu.

lolafg · 20 January 2009, 09:52

Hello ,I will probably buy a Motorola 68010 cpu to replace the 68000 in my A600...Is that a good idea ?Will it be very difficult to unsolder the 68000 to then solder the 68010?Will i need a software or will the new 68010 be recognised automaticaly ?Thanks for your answers .

laser · 20 January 2009, 09:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by lolafg

Hello ,I will probably buy a Motorola 68010 cpu to replace the 68000 in my A600...Is that a good idea ?Will it be very difficult to unsolder the 68000 to then solder the 68010?Will i need a software or will the new 68010 be recognised automaticaly ?Thanks for your answers .

I do not recommend u that invent
you can damage the motherboard or you only will gain 0.0001 % speed
main difference between both chips is that VBR can be allocated to fast ram

Paul_s · 20 January 2009, 09:57

I've heard that there can be problems associated with some games running from a 68010. It's not really worth the hassle imo and I doubt you'd see that much of an improvement. I'd be more inclined on looking at the 8MB fast ram add-on (do a search) or try and hunt down an accelerator of some kind if you want to see a real improvement on speed (i know there's an Apollo board for the 600, although it's quite rare).

spock-79 · 20 January 2009, 09:58

Hi,

I have build me a adaptor to use an 68010.

Here you can take a look on it: http://www.a1k.org/forum/showthread.php?t=13635

sorry, only in german....

StingRay · 20 January 2009, 10:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by lolafg

Hello ,I will probably buy a Motorola 68010 cpu to replace the 68000 in my A600...Is that a good idea ?Will it be very difficult to unsolder the 68000 to then solder the 68010?Will i need a software or will the new 68010 be recognised automaticaly ?Thanks for your answers .

Not worth the hassle as already mentioned. Go for a real accelerator (020-060) or keep the 68000.

lolafg · 20 January 2009, 10:44

Ok ,
thank you for your answers , so i won't buy it !!
Thanks again.

DoogUK · 20 January 2009, 19:44

actualy, people have reported 10-12% increases in speeds using 68010's in a500's and a2000's so why not the a600?

Thorham · 20 January 2009, 19:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by DoogUK

actualy, people have reported 10-12% increases in speeds using 68010's in a500's and a2000's so why not the a600?

True, but a simple 4mb ram board will not only give you extra memory, but it will also double the 68000's speed!

DoogUK · 20 January 2009, 20:46

Thats for sure, i'm wondering what the results would be both combined.

Thorham · 20 January 2009, 20:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by DoogUK

Thats for sure, i'm wondering what the results would be both combined.

Probably about 220% as opposed to 200% for just the mem board. But how much money and effort does it cost to change the cpu to an '010? If it's not much, then in combination with a mem board it might be worth it

Amiga1992 · 20 January 2009, 21:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thorham

True, but a simple 4mb ram board will not only give you extra memory, but it will also double the 68000's speed!

Why would it double the speed?]
That sounds like nonsense, the CPU's clock speed will be the same.
Also, you wouldn't have 2MB of Chip if you put there a 4MB Fast board,. If you are talking about megaslow PCMCIA RAM, I don't know what you are talking about anymore ;P

Thorham · 20 January 2009, 21:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by Akira

Why would it double the speed?]
That sounds like nonsense, the CPU's clock speed will be the same.
Also, you wouldn't have 2MB of Chip if you put there a 4MB Fast board,. If you are talking about megaslow PCMCIA RAM, I don't know what you are talking about anymore ;P

I mean proper fast ram boards (not the fake fast ram boards like those 512 kb A500 boards, and neither pcmcia).

The cpu doesn't share the data bus to the ram on these cards with the custom chips, and thus the cpu can access that ram at full speed. For example, when you have a chipmem only ECS Amiga with only chipmem and you run your Workbench in 16 color highres, the whole machine slows down, including the cpu to chipmem bandwith, so that not only the gfx are slower, but non-gfx software also runs slower. Fastmem has the opposite effect. Although gfx will still be slower in 16 color highres, non-gfx software is unaffected.

The same applies to the A1200 as well. Plug a ram board in the cpu slot, and the cpu can do it's job faster.

Amiga1992 · 20 January 2009, 22:05

Interesting!
So, it would actually be better to have 4MB of Fast RAM on the slot rather than 1MB of extra chip?
That's brilliant. Are there any 8MB boards? I am kind of interested in this
(there's always Fblit, too

)

Thorham · 20 January 2009, 22:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by Akira

Interesting!
So, it would actually be better to have 4MB of Fast RAM on the slot rather than 1MB of extra chip?

Depends, if you want to speed up software, then a fast mem board would be better. However, for normal ECS games I don't see 2mbs of chipmem making much of an improvement. Probably only usefull with software that uses lots of chipmem.

Also, aren't chipmem and true fastmem boards hooked up to an A600 differently? It may just be possible to get both chipmem and fast mem, but I'm not sure. Anyone care to confirm?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Akira

That's brilliant. Are there any 8MB boards? I am kind of interested in this
(there's always Fblit, too

)

Can't help you there. Anyone?

rkauer · 21 January 2009, 07:45

Chip memory is installed on the trapdoor or directly soldered over the existing RAM chips.

Fast RAM controller or accelerators are plugged over the original A600 68000 CPU.

You can use both at the same time.

Zetr0 · 21 January 2009, 07:53

@Akira

PCMCAI SRAM is aproximately 150-220 this is fast enough for a standard 68000 cpu, its only when on an 020 that it cripples any real speed benefit.

Fast ram, even PCMCIA Sram will remove the wait state of CPU to Chip Ram for its calculations, thus freeing it from the shared 7Mhz bus.

Fast Ram will near enough double the CPU performace alone, although I am still undercided if a 68010 is the right way to go to be honest, other than a couple of tight instruction loops its not all that compatible... I would like to have a switch to choose between CPU

@lolafg

you can get a 14Mhz CPU upgrade, these are quite easy to build for the A500, so for the A600 not to much re-work. If you combine this with the PCMCIA Sram or 4/8MB fast ram boards like LDV's project then this should REALLY fly!!!! (for a 68000 atleast)

Andymiga · 10 February 2009, 17:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zetr0

@Akira
you can get a 14Mhz CPU upgrade, these are quite easy to build for the A500, so for the A600 not to much re-work. If you combine this with the PCMCIA Sram or 4/8MB fast ram boards like LDV's project then this should REALLY fly!!!! (for a 68000 atleast)

That 14MHz CPU upgrade (for an A600), is there any info here on EAB on that? I have this A600 I'm pimping (as Zetr0 knows), and I would want to look into that -- how much work is it and what kind of soldering skills it requires...

I tried the forum search function but to no avail...

Cheers

Fingerlickin_B · 11 February 2009, 00:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by Andymiga

That 14MHz CPU upgrade (for an A600), is there any info here on EAB on that? I have this A600 I'm pimping (as Zetr0 knows), and I would want to look into that -- how much work is it and what kind of soldering skills it requires...

I tried the forum search function but to no avail...

Cheers

Me want info too!

PZ.

rkauer · 18 September 2009, 04:58

Another comment: using PCMCIA RAM on the A600 will improve the speed around 30% !!!

Self experience

, and Sysinfo don't lie to me, do it?

alexh · 19 September 2009, 11:54

16-bit PCMCIA FastRAM only got the moniker of being "slow" on A1200 because it was compared to trapdoor FastRAM expansions which are zero-wait state and 32-bit.

PCMCIA RAM is not to be considered "slow" on A600 as there is really nothing to compare it to and there is not the 32-bit/16-bit bottle neck.

20 January 2009, 09:52	#1
lolafg Registered User Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Tours/France Age: 52 Posts: 1,233	A600 Motorola 68010 cpu. Hello ,I will probably buy a Motorola 68010 cpu to replace the 68000 in my A600...Is that a good idea ?Will it be very difficult to unsolder the 68000 to then solder the 68010?Will i need a software or will the new 68010 be recognised automaticaly ?Thanks for your answers .

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20 January 2009, 09:57	#3
Paul_s Registered User Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Amigaville Age: 46 Posts: 3,338	I've heard that there can be problems associated with some games running from a 68010. It's not really worth the hassle imo and I doubt you'd see that much of an improvement. I'd be more inclined on looking at the 8MB fast ram add-on (do a search) or try and hunt down an accelerator of some kind if you want to see a real improvement on speed (i know there's an Apollo board for the 600, although it's quite rare).

20 January 2009, 09:58	#4
spock-79 Registered User Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Bremen Posts: 66	Hi, I have build me a adaptor to use an 68010. Here you can take a look on it: http://www.a1k.org/forum/showthread.php?t=13635 sorry, only in german....

20 January 2009, 10:44	#6
lolafg Registered User Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Tours/France Age: 52 Posts: 1,233	Ok , thank you for your answers , so i won't buy it !! Thanks again.

20 January 2009, 19:44	#7
DoogUK Doogster Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Dorset Posts: 1,069	actualy, people have reported 10-12% increases in speeds using 68010's in a500's and a2000's so why not the a600?

20 January 2009, 20:46	#9
DoogUK Doogster Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Dorset Posts: 1,069	Thats for sure, i'm wondering what the results would be both combined.

20 January 2009, 22:05	#13
Amiga1992 Registered User Join Date: May 2001 Location: ? Posts: 19,656	Interesting! So, it would actually be better to have 4MB of Fast RAM on the slot rather than 1MB of extra chip? That's brilliant. Are there any 8MB boards? I am kind of interested in this (there's always Fblit, too )

21 January 2009, 07:45	#15
rkauer I hate potatos and shirts Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Sao Leopoldo / Brazil Age: 58 Posts: 3,482	Chip memory is installed on the trapdoor or directly soldered over the existing RAM chips. Fast RAM controller or accelerators are plugged over the original A600 68000 CPU. You can use both at the same time.

21 January 2009, 07:53	#16
Zetr0 Ya' like it Retr0? Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: United Kingdom Age: 49 Posts: 9,768	@Akira PCMCAI SRAM is aproximately 150-220 this is fast enough for a standard 68000 cpu, its only when on an 020 that it cripples any real speed benefit. Fast ram, even PCMCIA Sram will remove the wait state of CPU to Chip Ram for its calculations, thus freeing it from the shared 7Mhz bus. Fast Ram will near enough double the CPU performace alone, although I am still undercided if a 68010 is the right way to go to be honest, other than a couple of tight instruction loops its not all that compatible... I would like to have a switch to choose between CPU @lolafg you can get a 14Mhz CPU upgrade, these are quite easy to build for the A500, so for the A600 not to much re-work. If you combine this with the PCMCIA Sram or 4/8MB fast ram boards like LDV's project then this should REALLY fly!!!! (for a 68000 atleast)

18 September 2009, 04:58	#19
rkauer I hate potatos and shirts Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Sao Leopoldo / Brazil Age: 58 Posts: 3,482	Another comment: using PCMCIA RAM on the A600 will improve the speed around 30% !!! Self experience , and Sysinfo don't lie to me, do it?

19 September 2009, 11:54	#20
alexh Thalion Webshrine Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Oxford Posts: 14,463	16-bit PCMCIA FastRAM only got the moniker of being "slow" on A1200 because it was compared to trapdoor FastRAM expansions which are zero-wait state and 32-bit. PCMCIA RAM is not to be considered "slow" on A600 as there is really nothing to compare it to and there is not the 32-bit/16-bit bottle neck.

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