Sid Chips, which one to get?

ElectroBlaster · 07 November 2005, 15:40

I have found a place selling sid chips so which is the best one to get? the original or the later one fitted to the cheese/wedge 64c?

FromWithin · 07 November 2005, 18:40

That depends on what you are going to do with it. Although the difference is negligible thanks to the design of the HardSID cards, you're better going with the older 6581 if you are only going to be using it for listening to SID files. For use as a stand-alone synthesizer, however, you're better off with the newer 8580 as it has a few extra waveforms in there.

stainy · 07 November 2005, 18:51

I got a 6581 recently because of the sample playback!

the newer chip can`t play them back apparently. I love my SID

also the Catweasel that uses it !

ElectroBlaster · 07 November 2005, 19:18

Ah poosticks lol

The samcoupe website only has 8580's in stock, with no likelyhood of getting 6581's in stock! Ah well I will be happy with 8580's, im only going to be emulating the c64 and amiga anyway... I wouldnt mind using the 8580's for music creation at a later date tho!

FromWithin · 07 November 2005, 20:07

When used in a HardSID/Catweasel, the 8580 are perfectly capable of playing samples. That was why I said that the difference was negligible.

ElectroBlaster · 07 November 2005, 20:31

Thats made me even more happy now

im itching to get this stuff installed...

stainy · 07 November 2005, 20:38

AHhh maybe it`s Acid64 that doesn`t perform samples with the newer chips!!

and DAMN!! that Acid64 is heavy on the CPU when playing SID`s with samples!!

FromWithin · 07 November 2005, 21:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by stainy

AHhh maybe it`s Acid64 that doesn`t perform samples with the newer chips!!

No, they play fine on mine. The HardSIDs have a bit of extra circuitry to allow the 8580s to play samples back correctly. The problem lies with bug fixing. The 6581s have a nasty click when presented with severe volume changes. It is this click that is utilized to playback samples. The 8580 had this click smoothed out, causing samples to come out extremely quietly. Again, this is catered for on the HardSID cards.

However, I've been doing some teste and have changed my mind on the difference between the 6581 and 8580. Definitely get a 6581 if you are mostly listening to SIDs. Although not disastrous, there is quite a tonal difference on some tunes between the two chips because of some alternate waveforms on the 8580. Also, because the 8580 has a corrected filter, most tunes sound a bit wrong. Of course, most tunes sound wrong on any SID because the filter strength is pretty random on the 6581s, but the 8580 has a logarithmic sweep whereas the 6581 has a linear one. The 8580 is more like the original design spec of the SID, but of course the C64 musicians wrote for the 6581, thus filter sweeps are thinner when using the 8580 for tunes designed for the 6581.

Get one of each if your card has two slots.

Avanze · 07 November 2005, 23:17

Go for the 6581.

FromWithin · 08 November 2005, 02:15

Quote:

Originally Posted by Avanze

Go for the 6581.

Have a listen to the Prophet64 demos to hear why an 8580 is good for music creation.

Jope · 09 November 2005, 08:00

The 6581 sounds better to my ear, having grown up listening to one.

The differences in the waveforms are more than neglible, it's very easy to spot a 8580.

Avanze · 09 November 2005, 14:17

It is all about the difference in the filter.

high-5 · 18 November 2005, 08:52

got a 6581 and a 8580 in my catweasel and i also prefere the 6581 for sounding like an original c64.

the 6581 seems to be alot louder than the 8580.
would that mean, if acid64 will ever support stereo-sid-play you need to have two sids of the same model to have the same volume on both channels?

ElectroBlaster · 18 November 2005, 19:43

I put in two 8580's

Is there any way of creating music with these sid chips? in stereo aswell!

07 November 2005, 15:40	#1
ElectroBlaster Junior Member Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Exeter, Devon, UK Age: 49 Posts: 1,714	Sid Chips, which one to get? I have found a place selling sid chips so which is the best one to get? the original or the later one fitted to the cheese/wedge 64c?

07 November 2005, 18:40	#2
FromWithin Music lord Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Liverpool, UK Age: 50 Posts: 630	That depends on what you are going to do with it. Although the difference is negligible thanks to the design of the HardSID cards, you're better going with the older 6581 if you are only going to be using it for listening to SID files. For use as a stand-alone synthesizer, however, you're better off with the newer 8580 as it has a few extra waveforms in there. Last edited by FromWithin; 07 November 2005 at 20:08.

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07 November 2005, 18:51	#3
stainy Zone Friend Join Date: Mar 2001 Location: Concord, NC, USA Age: 52 Posts: 1,714	I got a 6581 recently because of the sample playback! the newer chip can`t play them back apparently. I love my SID also the Catweasel that uses it !

07 November 2005, 19:18	#4
ElectroBlaster Junior Member Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Exeter, Devon, UK Age: 49 Posts: 1,714	Ah poosticks lol The samcoupe website only has 8580's in stock, with no likelyhood of getting 6581's in stock! Ah well I will be happy with 8580's, im only going to be emulating the c64 and amiga anyway... I wouldnt mind using the 8580's for music creation at a later date tho!

07 November 2005, 20:07	#5
FromWithin Music lord Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Liverpool, UK Age: 50 Posts: 630	When used in a HardSID/Catweasel, the 8580 are perfectly capable of playing samples. That was why I said that the difference was negligible.

07 November 2005, 20:31	#6
ElectroBlaster Junior Member Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Exeter, Devon, UK Age: 49 Posts: 1,714	Thats made me even more happy now im itching to get this stuff installed...

07 November 2005, 20:38	#7
stainy Zone Friend Join Date: Mar 2001 Location: Concord, NC, USA Age: 52 Posts: 1,714	AHhh maybe it`s Acid64 that doesn`t perform samples with the newer chips!! and DAMN!! that Acid64 is heavy on the CPU when playing SID`s with samples!!

07 November 2005, 23:17	#9
Avanze Amiga User Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Pennsylvania Age: 47 Posts: 565	Go for the 6581.

09 November 2005, 08:00	#11
Jope - Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Helsinki / Finland Age: 43 Posts: 9,910	The 6581 sounds better to my ear, having grown up listening to one. The differences in the waveforms are more than neglible, it's very easy to spot a 8580.

09 November 2005, 14:17	#12
Avanze Amiga User Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Pennsylvania Age: 47 Posts: 565	It is all about the difference in the filter.

18 November 2005, 08:52	#13
high-5 Zone Friend Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Cologne, Germany Age: 50 Posts: 52	got a 6581 and a 8580 in my catweasel and i also prefere the 6581 for sounding like an original c64. the 6581 seems to be alot louder than the 8580. would that mean, if acid64 will ever support stereo-sid-play you need to have two sids of the same model to have the same volume on both channels?

18 November 2005, 19:43	#14
ElectroBlaster Junior Member Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Exeter, Devon, UK Age: 49 Posts: 1,714	I put in two 8580's Is there any way of creating music with these sid chips? in stereo aswell!

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