A-590 questions ( ROMs, power, HD limits, etc. )

Overdoc · 27 May 2005, 17:07

Hi folks !

Ok, now I haven had a little time to deal with my A-590 HDs

I opened them all up and checked the autoboot ROMs. I have 3 different ones: Rev. 4.6, 6.1 and 6.6

Question: How many revisions exist ? And what's the exact difference bewteen them ? I have heard about 6.6 and 7.0 and Guru-Rom V6, but is the only difference that they can accept bigger HDs ? Or is there more to it ?

Another thing I'd like to know is how can I turn off the HD ? It powers up automatically when I power up the A-500, so it must be running all the time at least to sense the power-on signal from the A-500.
But when I just wamt to play a game from disk and don't want the A-590's spinning and cooler sound, what can I do except disconnecting it ? Simply pulling the A-590's psu plug will only kill my A-500 psu, but it will not keep the A-590 from running...

Hope someone here can help me ?
Thanks a lot !

DrBong · 04 June 2005, 19:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by Overdoc

Ok, now I haven had a little time to deal with my A-590 HDs

I opened them all up and checked the autoboot ROMs. I have 3 different ones: Rev. 4.6, 6.1 and 6.6

Question: How many revisions exist ? And what's the exact difference bewteen them ? I have heard about 6.6 and 7.0 and Guru-Rom V6, but is the only difference that they can accept bigger HDs ? Or is there more to it ?

That's pretty much the size of it according to the Big Book of Amiga Hardware

Quote:

Another thing I'd like to know is how can I turn off the HD ? It powers up automatically when I power up the A-500, so it must be running all the time at least to sense the power-on signal from the A-500.
But when I just wamt to play a game from disk and don't want the A-590's spinning and cooler sound, what can I do except disconnecting it ?

Perhaps you could make use of a utility like QuietSCSI.

alexh · 05 June 2005, 12:13

Guru rom offers a greater xfer rate.

DrBong · 06 June 2005, 19:35

Sorry, I didn't read the question properly. My first answer is only correct for differences between Rev 6.6 and 7.0. Alexh is probably right about the Guru rom offering greater transfer over the C= rom revisions for the A590.

T_hairy_bootson · 08 April 2006, 13:38

Could anyone out there possibly burn me some 7.0 roms for the A590?

I picked another one up today and it has 6.0 roms.

alexh · 08 April 2006, 15:03

Got anything to swap? I have an EPROM programmer.

T_hairy_bootson · 08 April 2006, 15:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by alexh

Got anything to swap? I have an EPROM programmer.

Need any amiga mice?

Seriously I have varioius bits and pieces, is there anything in particular you were after? Keep in mind postage to the UK would be steep for heavier items.

Some examples of things I have that I could part with:
Action Replay cart (boxed)
Various amiga books
Golden image scanner (boxed)
Various boxed and loose games
Original amiga mice
etc..

Or I can paypal you a fair price + postage if that works.

alexh · 08 April 2006, 17:44

I will see if I can find some 27C64 (8k) EPROM's in my bag of bits and get back to you.

Pitty no-one knows the schematic for the GURU ROM PCB

Before I do any more work... can you do the research and confirm that you dont need a particular SCSI chip or DMAC to use a v7 ROM?

T_hairy_bootson · 09 April 2006, 00:53

http://www.amiga-hardware.com/downlo...inside_big.jpg

According to that picture I should be good to go as I have both the 390563-01 DMAC chip and the WD33C93A SCSI chip in this particular A590.

coze · 09 April 2006, 03:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by alexh

Pitty no-one knows the schematic for the GURU ROM PCB

A few days ago I sent an e-mail to Mr R. Babel about the pcb. He told me that it was designed by Ossowski's Schatztruhe, so I tried to contact them through their website . No answer so far. But I think if we put enough pressure (especially someone who knows german) maybe we can get a result.

alexh · 09 April 2006, 11:40

If Mr.Bable can remember what it did then I could make a new one.

patrik · 09 April 2006, 19:59

Atleast with the adaptor for the GVP GuruROM, there is a GAL mounted under the EPROM which acts as a bank-switcher, to enable the GuruROM to be larger than the 16kB ROM-size the GVP cards supports.

The switcher works so that on a read, when A13-A5 all are zeroes, it will set A15:A14 on the EPROM to what A1:A0 is. This enables the EPROM to be 64kB (four 16kB banks), but if I dont remember wrong, the GuruROM only utilizes the two first banks - ie it is 32kB large.

I suspect the A590-adaptor is similar, but I dont know if they are interchangable.

Toni Wilen · 30 May 2007, 08:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by patrik

The switcher works so that on a read, when A13-A5 all are zeroes, it will set A15:A14 on the EPROM to what A1:A0 is. This enables the EPROM to be 64kB (four 16kB banks), but if I dont remember wrong, the GuruROM only utilizes the two first banks - ie it is 32kB large.

Confirmed. (only A14=A0 part, A15 is not used in GuruROM)

(and also resurrecting ancient thread)

alexh · 09 August 2013, 12:01

Resurrecting an old thread :

Looking at the WinUAE source code for a2091.cpp I see that the GURU ROM's GAL algorithm seems to be slightly different than listed here?

Am I right in thinking that the actual algorithm is that A14 latches A1 on a read if A13 = 1 and A12-A5 = 0?

Code:

if (A[13] == 1 && A[12:5] == 0 && !CE)
  A14 = A1;
else
 A14 = A14;

Toni Wilen · 09 August 2013, 14:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by alexh

Am I right in thinking that the actual algorithm is that A14 latches A1 on a read if A13 = 1 and A12-A5 = 0?

Yes, it is A1 (No idea where the A0 came from), A13=1 is UAE-only requirement because UAE addr is offset from board's base, not "rom chip base".

alexh · 09 August 2013, 15:53

Thanks for the reply. I'm going to make my own adapter board with GAL next weekend.

Code:

output_A[13:0] = input_A[13:0]

if (input_A[13:5] == 0 && !CE)
  output_A[14] = input_A[1];
else
 output_A[14] = output_A[14];

Yulquen74 · 20 August 2013, 22:08

if (input_A[13:5] == 0 && !CE)
output_A[14] = input_A[1];
else
output_A[14] = output_A[14];

Can we consider the if statement, when true, a clock pulse for clocking
in the state of A1 to A14, like a D-type register?
And A14 stays in this state (0 or 1) until the if-statement is true again with A1 changed?

Yulquen74 · 30 August 2013, 21:05

nevermind.

the equations above are all wrong for use in an A590.
found out the hard way by trying it on a gal equivalent.

just found the right way by using discrete logic on a breadboard and testing
different combinations.

alexh · 10 September 2013, 13:08

Yulquen74 are you sure? I thought the GURU ROM GAL was version agnostic? That the same adaptor would work with either a GVP Guru ROM or an A590/A2091 GURU ROM?

How about posting details of your findings?

Here is a reverse engineered version of the GAL code which is confirmed working with a GVP HD8+

Code:

;---------------------------------- Declaration Segment ------------
TITLE GVP.PDS
PATTERN GVP
REVISION 2.0
AUTHOR Unknown
COMPANY Unknown
DATE 11/11/78

CHIP _GVP PALCE16V8

;---------------------------------- PIN Declarations ---------------

PIN 1 Clk
PIN 2..9 A[12,7..5,13,8,1..0]
PIN 10 GND

PIN 11 nOE_PAL
PIN 12 nCS
PIN 13 A[10]
PIN 14 nOE
PIN 15..16 A[11,9]
PIN 17 Clk_Out
PIN 18 A[15] REG
PIN 19 A[14] REG
PIN 20 VCC

;----------------------------------- Boolean Equation Segment ------
EQUATIONS

CASE (A[13..5])
BEGIN
#h000:
BEGIN
Clk_Out = /nOE * /nCS
END
OTHERWISE:
BEGIN
Clk_Out = GND
END
END

A[14] := A[0]
A[15] := A[1]

;----------------------------------- Simulation Segment ------------
SIMULATION

;-------------------------------------------------------------------

Yulquen74 · 10 September 2013, 23:23

Hi,

the adapter is slightly different for A590/A2091.

for the A590, when A13 & A11:5 is 0, and A12 is 1, along with OE#=0 & CE#=0, whatever A0 is, is clocked out to A14 output of pal.

gvp version is almost the same, just that A12 have to be 0.

I made an adapter on veroboard, using an ATF16V8 chip, being able to do both variations by the means of a jumper. I have successfully tested it on both A590 and GVP, using proms with the respective software.

heres my equations, written in wincupl:

Name GURU ROM ;
PartNo 00 ;
Date 20.08.2013 ;
Revision 01 ;
Designer Engineer ;
Company - ;
Assembly None ;
Location ;
Device g16v8ms ;

/* *************** INPUT PINS **********************/

PIN 2 = A12 ;
PIN 3 = A7 ;
PIN 4 = A6 ;
PIN 5 = A5 ;
PIN 6 = A13 ;
PIN 7 = SEL ;
PIN 8 = A0 ;
PIN 9 = A1 ;
PIN 12 = CE ;
PIN 13 = A10 ;
PIN 14 = OE ;
PIN 15 = A11 ;
PIN 16 = A9 ;
PIN 17 = A8 ;

/* *************** OUTPUT PINS *********************/

PIN 18 = LAT_A14 ;
PIN 19 = A14_OUT ;

/* *************** LOGIC EQUATIONS *****************/

LAT_A14 = !A13 & A12 & !A11 & !A10 & !A9 & !A8 & !A7 & !A6 & !A5 & !CE & !OE & !SEL #
!A13 & !A12 & !A11 & !A10 & !A9 & !A8 & !A7 & !A6 & !A5 & !CE & !OE & SEL ;

A14_OUT.D = A0 ;

/* *************** NOTES **************************************/
/* */
/* Connect pin 1 to pin 18 */
/* Connect pin 7 to +5V for GVP devices, otherwise ground. */
/* Connect pin 19 to A14 of (E)PROM. */
/* Connect pin 10 and 11 to ground */
/* Connect pin 20 to +5V */
/* Connect a 100nF cap between pin 10 and 20 */

Quote:

Originally Posted by alexh

Yulquen74 are you sure? I thought the GURU ROM GAL was version agnostic? That the same adaptor would work with either a GVP Guru ROM or an A590/A2091 GURU ROM?

How about posting details of your findings?

Here is a reverse engineered version of the GAL code which is confirmed working with a GVP HD8+

Code:

;---------------------------------- Declaration Segment ------------
TITLE GVP.PDS
PATTERN GVP
REVISION 2.0
AUTHOR Unknown
COMPANY Unknown
DATE 11/11/78

CHIP _GVP PALCE16V8

;---------------------------------- PIN Declarations ---------------

PIN 1 Clk
PIN 2..9 A[12,7..5,13,8,1..0]
PIN 10 GND

PIN 11 nOE_PAL
PIN 12 nCS
PIN 13 A[10]
PIN 14 nOE
PIN 15..16 A[11,9]
PIN 17 Clk_Out
PIN 18 A[15] REG
PIN 19 A[14] REG
PIN 20 VCC

;----------------------------------- Boolean Equation Segment ------
EQUATIONS

CASE (A[13..5])
BEGIN
#h000:
BEGIN
Clk_Out = /nOE * /nCS
END
OTHERWISE:
BEGIN
Clk_Out = GND
END
END

A[14] := A[0]
A[15] := A[1]

;----------------------------------- Simulation Segment ------------
SIMULATION

;-------------------------------------------------------------------

27 May 2005, 17:07	#1
Overdoc Commodore Collector Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Austria Age: 53 Posts: 944	A-590 questions ( ROMs, power, HD limits, etc. ) Hi folks ! Ok, now I haven had a little time to deal with my A-590 HDs I opened them all up and checked the autoboot ROMs. I have 3 different ones: Rev. 4.6, 6.1 and 6.6 Question: How many revisions exist ? And what's the exact difference bewteen them ? I have heard about 6.6 and 7.0 and Guru-Rom V6, but is the only difference that they can accept bigger HDs ? Or is there more to it ? Another thing I'd like to know is how can I turn off the HD ? It powers up automatically when I power up the A-500, so it must be running all the time at least to sense the power-on signal from the A-500. But when I just wamt to play a game from disk and don't want the A-590's spinning and cooler sound, what can I do except disconnecting it ? Simply pulling the A-590's psu plug will only kill my A-500 psu, but it will not keep the A-590 from running... Hope someone here can help me ? Thanks a lot !

08 April 2006, 17:44	#8
alexh Thalion Webshrine Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Oxford Posts: 14,357	I will see if I can find some 27C64 (8k) EPROM's in my bag of bits and get back to you. Pitty no-one knows the schematic for the GURU ROM PCB Before I do any more work... can you do the research and confirm that you dont need a particular SCSI chip or DMAC to use a v7 ROM? Last edited by alexh; 08 April 2006 at 17:51.

09 April 2006, 19:59	#12
patrik Registered User Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Umeå Age: 43 Posts: 925	Atleast with the adaptor for the GVP GuruROM, there is a GAL mounted under the EPROM which acts as a bank-switcher, to enable the GuruROM to be larger than the 16kB ROM-size the GVP cards supports. The switcher works so that on a read, when A13-A5 all are zeroes, it will set A15:A14 on the EPROM to what A1:A0 is. This enables the EPROM to be 64kB (four 16kB banks), but if I dont remember wrong, the GuruROM only utilizes the two first banks - ie it is 32kB large. I suspect the A590-adaptor is similar, but I dont know if they are interchangable. Last edited by patrik; 10 April 2006 at 21:42.

09 August 2013, 12:01	#14
alexh Thalion Webshrine Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Oxford Posts: 14,357	Resurrecting an old thread : Looking at the WinUAE source code for a2091.cpp I see that the GURU ROM's GAL algorithm seems to be slightly different than listed here? Am I right in thinking that the actual algorithm is that A14 latches A1 on a read if A13 = 1 and A12-A5 = 0? Code: if (A[13] == 1 && A[12:5] == 0 && !CE) A14 = A1; else A14 = A14; Last edited by alexh; 09 August 2013 at 12:12.

09 August 2013, 15:53	#16
alexh Thalion Webshrine Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Oxford Posts: 14,357	Thanks for the reply. I'm going to make my own adapter board with GAL next weekend. Code: output_A[13:0] = input_A[13:0] if (input_A[13:5] == 0 && !CE) output_A[14] = input_A[1]; else output_A[14] = output_A[14]; Last edited by alexh; 09 August 2013 at 16:07.

05 June 2005, 12:13	#3
alexh Thalion Webshrine Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Oxford Posts: 14,357	Guru rom offers a greater xfer rate.

06 June 2005, 19:35	#4
DrBong HOL / AMR Team Member Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Australia Posts: 2,632	Sorry, I didn't read the question properly. My first answer is only correct for differences between Rev 6.6 and 7.0. Alexh is probably right about the Guru rom offering greater transfer over the C= rom revisions for the A590.

08 April 2006, 13:38	#5
T_hairy_bootson Workbitch 1.3 Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: Melbourne, Australia Age: 46 Posts: 2,084	Could anyone out there possibly burn me some 7.0 roms for the A590? I picked another one up today and it has 6.0 roms.

08 April 2006, 15:03	#6
alexh Thalion Webshrine Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Oxford Posts: 14,357	Got anything to swap? I have an EPROM programmer.

09 April 2006, 00:53	#9
T_hairy_bootson Workbitch 1.3 Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: Melbourne, Australia Age: 46 Posts: 2,084	http://www.amiga-hardware.com/downlo...inside_big.jpg According to that picture I should be good to go as I have both the 390563-01 DMAC chip and the WD33C93A SCSI chip in this particular A590.

09 April 2006, 11:40	#11
alexh Thalion Webshrine Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Oxford Posts: 14,357	If Mr.Bable can remember what it did then I could make a new one.

20 August 2013, 22:08	#17
Yulquen74 Registered User Join Date: May 2013 Location: Kleppe / Norway Posts: 258	if (input_A[13:5] == 0 && !CE) output_A[14] = input_A[1]; else output_A[14] = output_A[14]; Can we consider the if statement, when true, a clock pulse for clocking in the state of A1 to A14, like a D-type register? And A14 stays in this state (0 or 1) until the if-statement is true again with A1 changed? Last edited by Yulquen74; 20 August 2013 at 22:57.

30 August 2013, 21:05	#18
Yulquen74 Registered User Join Date: May 2013 Location: Kleppe / Norway Posts: 258	nevermind. the equations above are all wrong for use in an A590. found out the hard way by trying it on a gal equivalent. just found the right way by using discrete logic on a breadboard and testing different combinations.

Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)

Similar Threads
Thread	Thread Starter	Forum	Replies	Last Post
A4000 HD Limits	mbeason	support.Hardware	11	23 October 2009 09:40
Amiga 1200 UK-US Power Supply Questions.....	batfatty	New to Emulation or Amiga scene	11	04 December 2008 21:34
Power Computing fastATA questions.	Charlie	support.Hardware	3	17 September 2007 14:56
Some A-590 questions... (kick 2.0 ???, pass-thru-port ??, attach CF-card ?? )	Overdoc	support.Hardware	5	30 May 2006 07:30
A 590 questions	coze	support.Hardware	9	07 April 2006 15:38