Black Boarder on the left of display

Steve C · 23 May 2004, 00:56

I have installed Classic WB on my A4000ec030, but have problems getting a good display on my 1942 monitor. I use Multiscan/Productivity.

The problem is that I cant get the full window to use the leftmost part of the display - there's an area about an inch wide that I can't use. I can't shift the image far enough to the left when in overscan prefs program - it's a black area I can't use, and this becomes a grey area at the side of my desktop.

I used the 1942 setup disk that came with the monitor to update the screenmodes and overscan prefs. but no joy. This didn't happen before using normal install, Magic WB etc.

It seems to do the same thing in WinUAE as well...........

I hope you can help with this one, I'd hate to have to dump Classic WB.

Steve.

Amiga1992 · 23 May 2004, 02:09

i'm not sure but I think this is a normal behaviour you will have to correct using your monitor's h-size and h-pos settings. My A1200 outputs too far to the right in any resolution!

Bloodwych · 23 May 2004, 11:55

I've never been happy with the black boarders in productivity/dblpal/ntsc etc - my Microvitec multisync always has boarders due to no horizontal size.

The picture should still be centred however, without the need to mess around with anything other than your monitor controls as Akira mentioned. I haven't touched the default prefs from workbench 3. What it sounds like is the display positioning problem when using copperdemon. Have you installed the copper update? If so, that could be the cause. In the copper readme file, you'll find the following comment:

Quote:

Since Copper Demon is a commodity (as seen in the WB3 "exchange" program) running in ScalOS, it won't allow screenmodes to be altered or the workbench to be shut down without exiting it first. That's why I've included its icon in the bottom right hand corner. Before changing Workbench screenmodes (public screens ie brand new screens opened by programs are unaffected) please exit copper demon to avoid errors. One of these errors may be display positioning problems when stepping up from PAL/NTSC modes to productivity/DBL-PAL/NTSC. In order to confirm this I'll need to do some testing on my A1200 in the near future.

While testing on my A1200, I never did find a solution to this problem apart from disabling copperdemon. Since I don't have access to a real A1200 at the moment and WinUAE can't reproduce the problematic screenmodes, I don't know if I'll be able to help further at this time. I think UnknownK might have some experience on the matter as he installed the ClassicWB with the same monitor, but didn't mention any issues. Not sure if he used CopperDemon however.

You said it does the same thing in WinUAE??

WinUAE can't use those screenmodes and always has a default off-center display unless you use the centering/opengl/direct3d options. If any issue is reproducible in WinUAE, I'll look into it straight away.

Paul · 23 May 2004, 12:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bloodwych

Akira, is it possible to move this thread onto the end of the Support Thread ?

Done

Bloodwych · 23 May 2004, 12:08

Thanks Paul.

Steve C · 29 May 2004, 09:52

....so I'll back it all up to CD. Instead of an age re-installing the tweaking, it will be 10 minutes of a job to start again.

Transfer everything back to PC (via serial port - overnight job!). Compile CD with everything I may need. Burn with Nero. Back to Amiga, boot from floppy. Format DH0: Copy WB files to DH0: - All present and correct. So far so good.

Reboot. Won't boot! Eh??? Everything works, I've run programs off the HD they're fine. Just won't boot. Amiga DOS screen with a 1> prompt.

Any ideas anyone?

Bloodwych · 29 May 2004, 10:47

Sounds like you're missing the "startup-sequenece" file found in the S directory. Check it's there. If not, copy it from your Workbench 3 disk.

Best thing would have been to zip the tweaked workbench up first Amiga side, then trasferred it over to the PC and eventually CDROM. Reason being that perhaps some of the files names have been truncated or altered in the process if you didn't archive them Amiga side first.

What was the cause of the display positioning issue? CopperDemon?

Steve C · 29 May 2004, 15:14

No, all files seem to have retained their integrity, I've run some programs off the HD having booted from floppy. I did burn one CD in the wrong mode, and ended up with 8.3 filenames, so I,m pretty sure it's not that.

I'm just re-installing in the normal manner, I might give the zipping thing a try later - after wrestling with it all morning and half the afternoon I'm running short on time and enthusiasm TBH.

As for the display issue, never solved it, guess I'm learning to live with it. It's definately not copperdemon tho' - i didn't install it.

Thanks for your interest though.

Bloodwych · 29 May 2004, 15:49

I know how frustrating it is not getting something to work - I'm currently having issues with hardware that's nearly sent me over the edge.

Since those positioning problems don't occur on a fresh Workbench install, I'm really interested in fixing it. So you didn't get positioning issues when performing a fresh Workbench 3 install? (no 1942 setup disk used)

Are these positioning problems in certain screenmodes, or the default PAL also?

When you mentioned problems in WinUAE, is it the reason I mentioned above? You'll notice adf games are positioned in the same place without changing the centering/opengl/direct3d options - far right of the display.

Steve C · 30 May 2004, 19:54

Bloodwych your suggestion about zipping things up Amiga-side gave mixed results, to wit:-

the file is unzipped after having been copied to DH0: - SUCCESS!

the file is unzipped on the PC, burned to CD then COPIED to DH0: no boot. Every last file is present, down to the last embedded directory. Go figure.

For the sake of speed, I'd prefer to copy the files over rather than unzip them, but I'm happy with things as they are.

As for the display problem here's a couple of screenshots, WinUAE w/Classic WB. Screenmode is PAL/HIRES LACED.The first shows how this appears in Overscan Prefs. the black area to the left is obviously the problem bit. Although these screenies are in PAL the effect is the same on my real Amiga in Multiscan/Productivity. As mentioned before, I've always used this mode on my A4000 after installing the 1942 setup. It doesn't seem to affect PAL screenmodes.

TBH I haven't played any games using your setup, on emulated or real Amiga, so I'll not comment on that.

Steve C · 30 May 2004, 19:59

This one shows Workbench, you'll notice the title bar goes all the way to the right hand edge of the screen, but there's a significant gap on the left. Also, I think it may be relevant that this is the same colour as the rest of the screen.

Bloodwych · 30 May 2004, 23:11

The reason is to do with possible filesystem incompatibility - more info in the readme files. Zipping negates any possible problem occurring, which is why it works. You can always zip without compression, then decompression time is non-existent.

As for the non-centred WinUAE screen, that's normal. WinUAE shows the complete amiga display including the available overscan area - more info on this can be found by doing a search. By using direct3d/opengl/centering options provided by WinUAE, the display can be centred.

It's the same on a completely fresh install - see below. The border is always grey unless you use a program/commodity that turns it black. One such program probably comes on your 1942 disk.

I'm really not sure why your monitor can't centre the productivity display - my Microvitec had no problems last time I checked. All I can suggest is trying the original display drivers I use which are the default ones included with workbench 3. Copy the following files from storage/monitors/ to devs/monitors/. Make sure you have no other files in that folder apart from the ones you copy - PAL, NTSC, Multiscan and DBL-PAL, DBL-NTSC.

If there is a problem with the ClassicWB and productivity, I'm afraid it'll have to wait until I can test again on my real A1200.

Amiga1992 · 15 June 2004, 02:59

I don't get those borders but I did have to set my monitor to centre the image in H, V and their sizes too. I'm not using Overscan on my productivity screen.

As for the drive not booting... dunno, the PC probably screwed up the file modes and that's why nothing works, OR you need to install a bootblock in the HD (I dont think so). It shouldn't work that way, you would of have to make an image in WinUAE of your whole setup and then burn it as an image from Nero, I guess. Never tried this,.

23 May 2004, 00:56	#1
Steve C Junior Member Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Burnley, Lancs Posts: 62	Screenmode problem in Classic WB I have installed Classic WB on my A4000ec030, but have problems getting a good display on my 1942 monitor. I use Multiscan/Productivity. The problem is that I cant get the full window to use the leftmost part of the display - there's an area about an inch wide that I can't use. I can't shift the image far enough to the left when in overscan prefs program - it's a black area I can't use, and this becomes a grey area at the side of my desktop. I used the 1942 setup disk that came with the monitor to update the screenmodes and overscan prefs. but no joy. This didn't happen before using normal install, Magic WB etc. It seems to do the same thing in WinUAE as well........... I hope you can help with this one, I'd hate to have to dump Classic WB. Steve. Last edited by Steve C; 23 May 2004 at 00:59. Reason: Forgot to mention screenmode I'm using.

29 May 2004, 09:52	#6
Steve C Junior Member Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Burnley, Lancs Posts: 62	....I've got it set up just lovely.... ....so I'll back it all up to CD. Instead of an age re-installing the tweaking, it will be 10 minutes of a job to start again. Transfer everything back to PC (via serial port - overnight job!). Compile CD with everything I may need. Burn with Nero. Back to Amiga, boot from floppy. Format DH0: Copy WB files to DH0: - All present and correct. So far so good. Reboot. Won't boot! Eh??? Everything works, I've run programs off the HD they're fine. Just won't boot. Amiga DOS screen with a 1> prompt. Any ideas anyone?

30 May 2004, 19:54	#10
Steve C Junior Member Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Burnley, Lancs Posts: 62	Update... Bloodwych your suggestion about zipping things up Amiga-side gave mixed results, to wit:- the file is unzipped after having been copied to DH0: - SUCCESS! the file is unzipped on the PC, burned to CD then COPIED to DH0: no boot. Every last file is present, down to the last embedded directory. Go figure. For the sake of speed, I'd prefer to copy the files over rather than unzip them, but I'm happy with things as they are. As for the display problem here's a couple of screenshots, WinUAE w/Classic WB. Screenmode is PAL/HIRES LACED.The first shows how this appears in Overscan Prefs. the black area to the left is obviously the problem bit. Although these screenies are in PAL the effect is the same on my real Amiga in Multiscan/Productivity. As mentioned before, I've always used this mode on my A4000 after installing the 1942 setup. It doesn't seem to affect PAL screenmodes. TBH I haven't played any games using your setup, on emulated or real Amiga, so I'll not comment on that. Attached Thumbnails Last edited by Steve C; 30 May 2004 at 19:57. Reason: attacment problems

30 May 2004, 19:59	#11
Steve C Junior Member Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Burnley, Lancs Posts: 62	...cont This one shows Workbench, you'll notice the title bar goes all the way to the right hand edge of the screen, but there's a significant gap on the left. Also, I think it may be relevant that this is the same colour as the rest of the screen. Attached Thumbnails

30 May 2004, 23:11	#12
Bloodwych Moderator Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: I'm behind you! Posts: 3,763	The reason is to do with possible filesystem incompatibility - more info in the readme files. Zipping negates any possible problem occurring, which is why it works. You can always zip without compression, then decompression time is non-existent. As for the non-centred WinUAE screen, that's normal. WinUAE shows the complete amiga display including the available overscan area - more info on this can be found by doing a search. By using direct3d/opengl/centering options provided by WinUAE, the display can be centred. It's the same on a completely fresh install - see below. The border is always grey unless you use a program/commodity that turns it black. One such program probably comes on your 1942 disk. I'm really not sure why your monitor can't centre the productivity display - my Microvitec had no problems last time I checked. All I can suggest is trying the original display drivers I use which are the default ones included with workbench 3. Copy the following files from storage/monitors/ to devs/monitors/. Make sure you have no other files in that folder apart from the ones you copy - PAL, NTSC, Multiscan and DBL-PAL, DBL-NTSC. If there is a problem with the ClassicWB and productivity, I'm afraid it'll have to wait until I can test again on my real A1200. Attached Thumbnails Last edited by Bloodwych; 30 May 2004 at 23:48.

23 May 2004, 02:09	#2
Amiga1992 Registered User Join Date: May 2001 Location: ? Posts: 19,646	i'm not sure but I think this is a normal behaviour you will have to correct using your monitor's h-size and h-pos settings. My A1200 outputs too far to the right in any resolution!

23 May 2004, 12:08	#5
Bloodwych Moderator Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: I'm behind you! Posts: 3,763	Thanks Paul.

29 May 2004, 10:47	#7
Bloodwych Moderator Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: I'm behind you! Posts: 3,763	Sounds like you're missing the "startup-sequenece" file found in the S directory. Check it's there. If not, copy it from your Workbench 3 disk. Best thing would have been to zip the tweaked workbench up first Amiga side, then trasferred it over to the PC and eventually CDROM. Reason being that perhaps some of the files names have been truncated or altered in the process if you didn't archive them Amiga side first. What was the cause of the display positioning issue? CopperDemon?

29 May 2004, 15:14	#8
Steve C Junior Member Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Burnley, Lancs Posts: 62	No, all files seem to have retained their integrity, I've run some programs off the HD having booted from floppy. I did burn one CD in the wrong mode, and ended up with 8.3 filenames, so I,m pretty sure it's not that. I'm just re-installing in the normal manner, I might give the zipping thing a try later - after wrestling with it all morning and half the afternoon I'm running short on time and enthusiasm TBH. As for the display issue, never solved it, guess I'm learning to live with it. It's definately not copperdemon tho' - i didn't install it. Thanks for your interest though.

29 May 2004, 15:49	#9
Bloodwych Moderator Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: I'm behind you! Posts: 3,763	I know how frustrating it is not getting something to work - I'm currently having issues with hardware that's nearly sent me over the edge. Since those positioning problems don't occur on a fresh Workbench install, I'm really interested in fixing it. So you didn't get positioning issues when performing a fresh Workbench 3 install? (no 1942 setup disk used) Are these positioning problems in certain screenmodes, or the default PAL also? When you mentioned problems in WinUAE, is it the reason I mentioned above? You'll notice adf games are positioned in the same place without changing the centering/opengl/direct3d options - far right of the display.

15 June 2004, 02:59	#13
Amiga1992 Registered User Join Date: May 2001 Location: ? Posts: 19,646	I don't get those borders but I did have to set my monitor to centre the image in H, V and their sizes too. I'm not using Overscan on my productivity screen. As for the drive not booting... dunno, the PC probably screwed up the file modes and that's why nothing works, OR you need to install a bootblock in the HD (I dont think so). It shouldn't work that way, you would of have to make an image in WinUAE of your whole setup and then burn it as an image from Nero, I guess. Never tried this,.

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