Trying to get my head around accelerators...

[AB Positive]

So, I've been researching on accelerators, seeing if it's feasable to soup up my increasingly mutant-looking A500

My main question is... what am I looking for?

I assume that getting a higher 680*0 number is overall a better thing, also having a higher mhz rating is better.

But is a 68000 x 28 mhz better than say...

68020 x 14 mhz?

I ask as I have a shot at a relatively cheap A500 accelerator - but it's 680HC00 @ 28 mhz.

The second number is nice, but it's essentially the chip I have on the board now, right?

Would that, plus a HDD and FastRAM get me near WHDLoad/programming app level speed or would I be better off searching out a higher 680*0 chip?

[Rabbit80]

I used to have a SupraTurbo28 on my old A500+ (680HC00) + 8Mb Fast RAM - All I can say is that it was faster than my A1200 without any accelerator, although at times I missed the 68020 functionality - some games, demos and applications require a 68020+ to run.

It is pretty pointless to have ANY accelerator unless you have some fast RAM as well. These accelerators make little difference unless you have some.

[Graham Humphrey]

You are definitely much better off with an '020 for sure, it is more advanced than a 68000 - and as Rabbit says Fast RAM is pretty essential.

[Toni Wilen]

Supraturbo 28 can be faster than 14MHz 68020 because Supraturbo has big built-in (64k?) cache. It is very nice accelerator if you don't need 68020 compatibility.

[meega]

The 68000 has a 16-bit data path (it is 32-bit internally), 68020/68030 have a 32-bit data path - so they run about twice as fast (at the same clock speed) anyway.

I.e. 28MHz 68000 and 14MHz 68020 should be *roughly* the same in performance - but Fast RAM makes all the difference. Adding any Fast RAM at all and nothing else to an A500/500+ will double the processor's effective speed (it also does the same in an A1200), as the CPU in an unexpanded Amiga is always being sat on by the custom chips (which have priority over the Chip RAM space) and the CPU never has more than half the cycles available to it. When using expansion RAM the processor achieves full potential.

If you can find one I recommend a 68030 card with RAM - some hard drives have all this built in to their cases, they tend to be pricey...

[Toni Wilen]

Yeah but supraturbo's extra cache will make huge difference and it also caches all non-chip ram/io accesses, including rom, and even action replay rom

Of course "real" 68020/030 accelerator will be better but A500 compatible models are rare and expensive.

[AB Positive]

Hmmm, I guess I should look at what apps I want to run before deciding. Frankly, it'd just be nice to be able to get it up to AmigaOS 3.1 and running WHDLoad. With a hard drive then I could work with some C programming too but that's essentially it.

AOS 3.9 would be neat but I think i'd have to really beef up the processor to have a shot.

[keropi]

for games get a 030 accelerator with an MMU if possible... for speed get a 060 , if you use one you will never want a lower cpu (ofcourse with whdload games play nice with the 060)

[Toni Wilen]

It is much easier and cheaper to get an A1200 + 68030 accelerator than to accelerate an A500.

(I can buy the supraturbo if it is still available )

[AB Positive]

Originally Posted by Toni Wilen

It is much easier and cheaper to get an A1200 + 68030 accelerator than to accelerate an A500.

(I can buy the supraturbo if it is still available )

Not in America it isn't. Hell, just try to FIND one around here!

I'd ideally like an A600 which I could mod to the moon but again - you just can't find them here. It's stupid hard to find. So - A500 route

Did they even make 060 accelerators for an A500?

[TCD]

Why the heck don't you go for an A1200 (or A4000) like everbody else

[coze]

no, there are no 060 accelerators for A500. Though you can fit one into one of those A500 busboard expansions which give you an A2000 processor slot. And fit in a 060 A2000 accelerator there. Of course you're much better off with an A2000 in the first place if you want to go that route.

[AB Positive]

Originally Posted by TheCyberDruid

Why the heck don't you go for an A1200 (or A4000) like everbody else

Um... didn't you read my last post? Unless I want to pay $140 + international shipping from AmiKit I'm not getting an A1200 - finding one in the US is like finding wood from the True Cross. Nearly impossible.

And if I were to get a different model I'd go with an A600 - which again you can't find. There's an occasional A3000 or A4000 but I can't afford paying twice what I paid for my dual-core PC for an A4000 ($229 for my PC - eBay gets anywhere from $400 to $650ish for the tower amigas)

Soooo... hmmm. There is the occasional A2000 for an ok price around here but man, I love the integrated-keyboard style. An A600 would be awesome. Every time I see someone nab one at a boot sale for 10 pounds I just shake my fist and curse

[T_hairy_bootson]

I think what people are trying to explain to you AB_Positive is that buying a 1200+Accelerator is still cheaper than buying an equivalent accelerator for an a500 or a600. Even in the US.

[TCD]

Originally Posted by AB Positive

Um... didn't you read my last post?

I did, but I thought you were just talking about an A600. Didn't know it's that hard to get one in the US. They are a bit pricey here too, but before you go the A500 or A600 route I might be worth to check if the price for an A1200 is really that bad

Edit : Spot on THB

[AB Positive]

Originally Posted by T_hairy_bootson

I think what people are trying to explain to you AB_Positive is that buying a 1200+Accelerator is still cheaper than buying an equivalent accelerator for an a500 or a600. Even in the US.

Oh ick.

Well then. I guess I should take the Supra for $25 and run with it. I was figuring if you had a stock 1200 and a good enough hard drive you could do WHDLoad without an accelerator.

Balls. :/

[musashi5150]

Originally Posted by AB Positive

I guess I should take the Supra for $25 and run with it.

Do that. It's a great card. My A500 loves it

[Hewitson]

Originally Posted by AB Positive

Would that, plus a HDD and FastRAM get me near WHDLoad/programming app level speed or would I be better off searching out a higher 680*0 chip?

Err, what do you think most whdload games/demos are written for?

All you need is RAM and a HD. However the price of adding this is a waste of money compared to the price of A1200 from amigakit.

[alexh]

Originally Posted by AB Positive

I guess I should take the Supra for $25 and run with it.

Absolute no-brainer.

Originally Posted by AB Positive

I was figuring if you had a stock 1200 and a good enough hard drive you could do WHDLoad without an accelerator.

It would work fine for a lot of games but you really need more than 2MBytes of RAM. Just a trapdoor RAM card (~$50) would be enough.

[alexh]

If you wanted an A600 just do a deal with someone in the UK for something from USA. They can be bought second hand in UK for under $20

I'd swap a "2Mbyte A600 with 2GB compact flash removable HD" for something electronic you cannot get here in the UK....

NOTE: Dont forget computers from the EU are PAL. They can be forced to run at 60Hz but you'll still need a TV capable of accepting 15KHz RGB (i.e. commodore monitor)