Money can't buy me IPFs !

[Retro1234]

I cant read this! What are the names of these two games?

[Interceptor]

nobody wants to stop you getting IPF files any which way to choose to go about doing so, dumping for friend, trawling the net, whatever.

in fact, i wish you the best of luck.

but if you post topics with the sole intent to extract them directly from SPS (especially via public forums!) then you're gonna get the kind of responses that you have.

if you have useful suggestions for a FAQ, then please post them via the contact page on the softpres.org website, and if they are reasonable and sensible, we'll update the FAQ. remember the official FAQ is the questions WE get asked.

[killergorilla]

Originally Posted by Deleauvive

By the way, "missing" IPFs are said to be available to a few "chosen ones" (possibly but not necessarily guys in touch with the owner of the floppies), but let's stop discussing that (and Interceptor , I know I am very far from being able to penetrate this "cast" of some sort)

Firstly, I presume by "missing" IPFs you mean ones which are not currently in the TOSEC dat (and therefore shared in the usual places).

The reason they are "missing" is simply because whoever dumped them (the originator of the dumps may even be the SPS Team) is keeping the images to themselves. Whether you agree with this attitude or not that is currently how it is. They are not "chosen ones", they are simply not willing to share their images for whatever reason.

The "cast" you speak of seems to be a term you've made up in your head, presumably referring to the people who have not shared their personal images. Either way, these people are not "selected" by the SPS Team, neither are they in some "exclusive SPS club" which excludes people like yourself.

I personally, as well as many, many other dumpers (no names mentioned) have always shared my/our images with whoever wanted. This meant that the majority of games were spread quite quickly and they all ended up in the TOSEC sets which you can now find if you look hard enough.

You seem to have built some kind of conspiracy up, possibly through misinterpreting the facts, possibly through some mild psychosis.

As for getting the games WHDified, I think the general plan of action is to ask your favourite WHDLoad coder nicely, let them know that there are indeed SPS images available, so that they, the coder, can request images from the SPS team (this has happened before). Then, you may have a chance of getting your game installed.

But, then you also have the dilemna of finding some images to install the game when (if) the game ever does have an install made.

[seuden]

Please read what KG has written.

[Galahad/FLT]

I second KG's sentiments.

[NewDeli]

First, I was very glad to be able to conclude and to read Interceptor wise suggestion, as this thread was starting to get uncontrollable.

It's all right with me bearing a few flames (thanks for the pants), if I manage to get a better picture of these things which had me ruminating for quite a while, with you KG or even with TCD.

No, I don't think the 'selected' people -let's call them 'couriers'- I am referring to are SPS members. Definitely not.

AFAIU, there are cases when a WHDload coder is granted a "missing" IPF upon request. OK, fine, that's what I was genuinely expecting to happen. That would have ended the train of thoughts. (and it happened all right for one of my WHDload 'champions' ).

In this case, whether the SPS *ss is "covered" or not is their problem , not mine. I suppose they take their precautions though (meaning the owner of the disks may have been alerted that his game was to be processed by a patcher, or asked to dump his original again...with a newer version of the dumping tool eventually).

Let's call this "level 3" infiltration
In fact, I can't imagine this happening without a grey zone located at the confines of IRC, be it temporary, which makes the "level 3" shares possible, upon very rare occasions.

"Level 2" is what I am trying to do : Locating an original owner, obtaining the IPF without owning the game myself, knowing he would probably never have dumped the game by himself.

and you can represent "Level 1" by those simply finding the sites where the TOSEC sets can be downloaded from, and having nice "sceners" filling the gaps.

I know I might be romancing things a little... But the retro world appears to me like a very connected entity, full of surprises. When I was talking about taking action, I simply meant that sending PMs or emails, crossing fingers for something to happen, is obviously not the right way here to get things done (although some people like to give this impression).

At least, you would agree with me that contacting those already known owners of "missing" titles, NOT from the SPS, and NOT among those "dumping friends" of yours is prohibited.

[Galahad/FLT]

Originally Posted by Deleauvive

First, I was very glad to be able to conclude and to read Interceptor wise suggestion, as this thread was starting to get uncontrollable.

It's all right with me bearing a few flames (thanks for the pants), if I manage to get a better picture of these things which had me ruminating for quite a while, with you KG or even with TCD.

No, I don't think the 'selected' people -let's call them 'couriers'- I am referring to are SPS members (except in case of schizoid symptoms, like prohibiting one thing during the day and encouraging it during the night... Wishful thinking may occur when facing this beautiful duplicating machines, ha ha).

AFAIU, there are cases when a WHDload coder is granted a "missing" IPF upon request. OK, fine, that's what I was genuinely expecting to happen. (and it happened all right for one of my WHDload 'champions' ).

In this case, whether the SPS *ss is "covered" or not is their problem , not mine. I suppose they take their precautions though (meaning the owner of the disks may have been alerted that his game was to be processed by a patcher, or asked to dump his original again...with a newer version of the dumping tool eventually).

Let's call this "level 3" infiltration
In fact, I can't imagine this happening without a grey zone located at the confines of IRC, be it temporary, which makes the "level 3" shares possible, upon very rare occasions.

"Level 2" is what I am trying to do : Locating an original owner, obtaining the IPF without owning the game myself, knowing he would probably never have dumped the game by himself.

and you can represent "Level 1" by those simply finding the sites where the TOSEC sets can be downloaded from, and having nice "sceners" filling the gaps.

I know I might be romancing things a little... But the retro world appears to me like a very connected entity, full of surprises. When I was talking about taking action, I simply meant that sending PMs or emails, crossing fingers for something to happen, is obviously not the right way here to get things done (although some people like to give this impression).

At least, you would agree with me that contacting those dumpers of "missing" titles, NOT from the SPS, and NOT among those "dumping friends" of yours is prohibited.

You're not getting it.

At no point EVER do SPS give out incomplete IPF's EVER!!!

I would class myself as a person that gets on well with the SPS team, not only would I not presume to ask for an incomplete IPF (what would be the point??) I wouldn't expect to get one.

They are unpublished for very sane reasons, that they be original and unmodified, if they give exceptions to one game here and one game there, then they will fall down the route of giving out more incomplete IPF's, and then SPS will CEASE to be the de facto resource for these images.

Enough already!!!

[mr.vince]

Originally Posted by Deleauvive

... asked for the IPF in private as I was suggested to -> always was given the same boring (but understandable) answer...

I am sorry for boring you by giving you an understandable answer.

Originally Posted by seuden

Please read what KG has written.

I can only second that!

Originally Posted by Deleauvive

...No, I don't think the 'selected' people -let's call them 'couriers'- I am referring to are SPS members (except in case of schizoid symptoms, like prohibiting one thing during the day and encouraging it during the night... Wishful thinking may occur when facing this beautiful duplicating machine, ha ha)....

...In this case, whether the SPS *ss is "covered" or not is their problem , not mine. I suppose they take their precautions though (meaning the owner of the disks may have been alerted that his game was to be processed by a patcher, or asked to dump his original again...with a newer version of the dumping tool eventually).

Let's call this "level 3" infiltration ...

At least, you would agree with me that contacting those already known owners of "missing" titles, NOT from the SPS, and NOT among those "dumping friends" of yours is prohibited.

I think you have reached the point where we all feel like aliens in "Mars Attacks!" when they start playing that one record... please... I've had enough!

[TCD]

Sometimes I wonder if you know what you're writing Deleauvive or just can't stop after you started...
Still I can't see your point and I know that you'll never tell, so why don't you just stop right now okay?

[NewDeli]

mr.vince, do I need to tell you the simple fact that you replied was a welcomed event ?

I'll sentence myself to write down the following 100 times, then :
"I understand it will take time before I can come up to the SPS with something valuable, but it's worth the effort..."

Many thanks, I think I got it confirmed with that reply of Galahad .
Class will continue with Girv.


Boy, what a day...

[killergorilla]

I'd love to pretend I have any clue what you still don't get about this whole deal, I (and many others) have explained enough for you to have all the answers...

"I understand it will take time before I can come up to the SPS with something valuable, but it's worth the effort..."

Rrrrright.

Dumping anything the SPS team don't already have is "valuable" and "worth the effort".

You really are a confusing person.

[Marcuz]

i feel more than a lot confuse too.

[whiteb]

Originally Posted by marco pedrana

i feel more than a lot confuse too.

Your answer, Young padawan, is in the profile.

Windows Vista Supporters.

[TCD]

Originally Posted by marco pedrana

i feel more than a lot confuse too.

Don't worry, I think we're almost there

@Deleauvive

Originally Posted by Interceptor

if you have useful suggestions for a FAQ, then please post them via the contact page on the softpres.org website, and if they are reasonable and sensible, we'll update the FAQ. remember the official FAQ is the questions WE get asked.

These are the guys you should talk to

[Valken]

DV,

I think I understand what you're trying to say in you are trying to provide the resources and are frustrated with the IFP-WHDfied process for 2 games but you're really over dramatising it a bit.

It would be simpler for the rest of us Amiga fans if you simply made a request for those games you want WHDfied and all of us can try to help make that happen with whatever resources we have.

I agree more (all) games should be preserved, whdfied (if possible) and made available for the masses to enjoy in current and future generations but please note all of the work are done NON-PROFIT by dedicated volunteers. It will be a slow process but worth its wait.

[NewDeli]

Yeah, I've noticed since a few days, people I've never talked to before are sending me PMs, and show their sympathy. I think they must be some Dlfrsilver minions .

It's not just me that dramatizing it, I've noticed in other forums (I want to make it clear I am not sharing these opinions) SPS main goal are not fully understood, that they, the SPS team members are considered lucky b*stards to have access to so many games...and what's the purpose of having preserved them if no one can have access... and so on, and so on.

@Marco
You're making me feel guilty... please . I think "we'll get there" when I have started making more contributions. Trying to answer the unanswered (without showing disrespect) didn't prove very useful. Better luck next time...

Two things, if I may :

• If some of you feel creating this FAQ from scratch is worth it, then let's try, people
• Can someone tell me to whom the manuals are handed to (in case boxed games are sent for preservation), there aren't too many of them in HoL, right ?

[TCD]

Originally Posted by Deleauvive

Yeah, I've noticed since a few days, people I never talked to before are sending me PMs and show their sympathy. I think they must be some Dlfrsilver minions .

Sad that they don't support you here, isn't it?

Originally Posted by Deleauvive

Two things, if I may :

• If some of you feel creating this FAQ from scratch is worth it, then let's try, people

Why? Try to improve the FAQ on the SPS site if you or anyone else has some useful input. That is where is belongs Deleauvive.

[NewDeli]

oh, I meant dealing with the FAQ in private, of course not here.

Originally Posted by TheCyberDruid

Sad that they don't support you here, isn't it?

What's that your implying ? I can read my PMs all right, psychosis hasen't got that far I should need to duplicate their content on the board !
Or may be, you'd like to be part of the fun !

[killergorilla]

Right.

Here it is. In plain English for you.

Let's remove the SPS team from the equation for a second.

I have a music CD, "Help!" by The Beatles. If I want to backup this music CD, I make a copy of it and hey presto I have a copy I can use.

Let's say for example, that Help! is CD that I cannot physically backup myself, due to some snazzy protection. So, I find out who can back it up for, a company called "CD WONDER POWER" I then send my CD to them and they create a backup for me.

I now have a copy of my CD, as well as the original I had in the first place.

Do I now have the right to complain to "CD WONDER POWER" that I don't have access to the rest of the Beatles music collection? No. Simply because I do not own the original CDs for all the other Beatles albums.

You get it yet?

The SPS Team are there to preserve copies of games/game related software. They are not there to horde games and sit on them claiming they have the best games collection ever.

The SPS Team cannot, without major risk of being shut down, dish out disk images to everyone and his dog just because they want access to the images.

You clearly have a problem with the SPS Team keeping images of all of these games. Would you prefer it if they never kept a copy themselves? No, so stop being so silly.

You really think the SPS team revel in having access to more images than people outside the company? I highly doubt IFW and Co. sit there at night playing "The Clue!" rubbing their hands together saying "HAHAHAHA THEY'LL NEVER GET TO PLAY THIS!!!".

[NewDeli]

It's only one aspect of the problem, I think. The other aspect is, I, as a true Beatles fan will fail to contact you directly.

It's not a matter of obtaining the backup from "CD POWER COMPANY" (well, it's not a company, if they're not selling anything but anyway). Of course, I am not entitled to obtain it from them.

It's a matter of not being able to sharing my special edition of "REVOLVER" with you (provided you wouldn't mind making such a deal with me).

I mean what's wrong with asking ? I have this special edition of "REVOLVER" you might be interested in, I browse at some board and examine a list of contributors to the "CD WONDER POWER" company.

Ah, Killergorilla has done this rare "HELP" backup with the help of the company. Now... let's see if he's willing to give away his backup... Hell, no. It's written here. KG doesn't want to trade his backup, he doesn't want to be contacted about it. OK, end of the story... for now. Well, may be he'll change his mind, I'll post on the board some info. on this superb "REVOLVER" backup I've just done.

In the current situation, I can't see who's that "HELP" contributor, I can't ask the company to inform him of my intention to deal with him and about my ethical ways of conducting such deals. I can never know in what disposition he is concerning that backup he made.