HEY! I just had this idea...

Amiga1992 · 20 February 2003, 14:26

I'm surprised it wasn't implemented from day one!

How about adding a field that has a "Jambo! Search" for the game you are looking at? When you click at it, a window pops up with results for the game you are looking at at the HOL.

So the abime network gets multitasking ;D

Drake1009 · 20 February 2003, 15:29

That's using the old noodle, or maybe there's more than one in your head?

Amiga1992 · 20 February 2003, 15:47

I dunno, I have become a Dance Dance Revolution addict, you think me gots any noodles left?

Drake1009 · 20 February 2003, 16:56

You probably do, but they're all shaped like little arrows and D's

RCK · 20 February 2003, 18:40

the HOL don't have to be linked with some download link, law is law.
come back in 10 years

Amiga1992 · 20 February 2003, 20:54

It's no download link, it's a link to a site that links to a download! Does Google get lawyers in their neck because you search for "Amiga Kickstart R0M" and you find a link to a download? no.

I say it's perfectly legal.

Twistin'Ghost · 21 February 2003, 03:08

Hasn't Jambo (the user) left the scene (again)? Having something stable linking to something unstable might create a lot of stuff to fix later.

21 February 2003, 03:39

Jambo (the site) is working. Paul is frequently posting news

Paul · 21 February 2003, 10:13

Jambo asked me to be co webmaster, he designed a web interface for me to add news and update and post my guides. He was going to give me more controls, but it looks like he ran out of time. Tried e-mailing him but got no answers so he's probably very busy in real life.

I did say to Jambo I did not want the responsibility, and work of updating the search games database. What it needs is a team of people just maintaining the search database and to keep it up to date (I think it’s a too big a job for one person)

Anyway, I’d say not to add a link until Jambo is back.

Mr Creosote · 21 February 2003, 13:06

I don't think this is such a great idea. It's not only a question of legality (couldn't care less about that), but also of 'image'. I think it'd cheapen HOL to provide 'download sources' (even indirectly), because it makes it look as if its own contents aren't enough. I'm sure nobody understood what I mean.... it's too early

DrBong · 21 February 2003, 19:29

Quote:

Originally posted by Mr Creosote
I don't think this is such a great idea. It's not only a question of legality (couldn't care less about that), but also of 'image'. I think it'd cheapen HOL to provide 'download sources' (even indirectly), because it makes it look as if its own contents aren't enough. I'm sure nobody understood what I mean.... it's too early

I agree. Besides we don't need any unwanted attention if outsiders mistakeningly think we're providing illegal downloads, or indeed are encouraging them. Anyone remember the HOL story on ANN a little while back?

If people want to find a game then they can search it out using the usual methods (e.g. Google, Jambo etc.)

21 February 2003, 19:44

I don't understand. The site that you don't like the image of is already hosted under www.abime.net .Linking two sites of a network might cheapen the other? Let's forget about ANN, they are narrow minded, ignorant people and we can't be responsible if they did not bother checking abime.net was a pirate network or not.

Amiga1992 · 21 February 2003, 19:47

That's what struck me, Burseg. but the reasons given seem sensitive enough.

It might have been a bad idea, but I don't think it has anything to do with legal issues.

Mr Creosote · 21 February 2003, 19:58

They're both hosted under the same domain. So what? What about all sites on any free hosting service? They're all hosted under the same domain, too - without having any connection. Bad comparison since they're both listed on the 'portal page', I know - I just don't know how to explain it any better than this (it's more of a bad feeling I have): casual visitors might mistake HOL as some kind of search engine for downloads. People are stupid unfortunately

21 February 2003, 20:30

I see your point and I hope no one thinks eab and hol should isolate itself from jambo because it's "related with piracy" but rather taking precautions in case people might think so. I'm making an addition to this and saying that risk is already present if some dumb guy sees www.abime.net page with direct links to both jambo and hol but there are less people with THAT level of stupidity. In any case, I don't like the idea of living by fearing and avoiding prejudice of others.

DrBong · 21 February 2003, 20:36

Quote:

Originally posted by Akira
It might have been a bad idea, but I don't think it has anything to do with legal issues.

Just isn't a great idea because as Mr Creosote said people are stupid and RCK is the one who has to deal with them. In any case, right now we really need to concentrate less on frills and more on the fundamental elements of HOL. There is still so much that is missing in terms of basic info. and box/disk scans. I wish there were three of me atm so I could spend more time on HOL

Mr Creosote · 21 February 2003, 22:18

Quote:

I don't like the idea of living by fearing and avoiding prejudice of others

True, but believe me - I have some made some very unpleasant experiences in this field. On my games/review site, one of the most frequently asked questions is "why do you keep games on the listing if you're not providing a download". This is the nice way, these people 'only' ignore that I've spent several hours on each game to make screenshots and write a review. The worst type of person immediately goes mad like this: "you're such a fraud, promising to offer games and then not giving me the game I have the right to play" (this is of course in my language - it's mostly not that easily understandable

) - as if I ever advertised with "come here for tons of downloads". I'm also running a search engine like Jambo's which also lists game reviews and extras in addition to downloads. Again and again I receive e-mails complaining there are broken download links (there aren't any downloads on the site - these people seem to think all the listed sites are ran by me personally) or that the information given in the search is incorrect since game x can't be found for download on site y (even though it was listed under 'game reviews' ). These people appear as soon as anything similar to the word 'download' appears on a site. And with a site of the size of HOL (in reference to the 'gamecount' ), it will be many such people.

Anyway, the decision seems to be clear for now. Just wanted to add that sometimes, you have to make compromises when it comes to the stupidity of people - as much as it might hurt.

Antiriad · 21 February 2003, 23:30

Damn right. Leechers are bad enough as it is. No need to make things further complicated unecessarily

Twistin'Ghost · 22 February 2003, 02:19

At the end of the day, HOL is an information service. We never intended anyone to ever think that the listings herein offer anything but stats on Amiga commercial (and associative) games and the people that make them. From our viewpoint at the time of HOL's conception, adf download sites were plentiful and random, but what was completely devoid from the web was a reliable site providing details. Many sites abound(ed) with *some* details or scattered bits of info that was a mixture of correct and incorrect info. Our goal was and still is, ALL commercial games and 100% verified details for the games. It is a difficult task and one for which we continually scrutinize each other over, but that is simply because we demand only the best; keeping ourselves in check is the best way to achieve this and it creates a greater sense of unity amongst the team. And it is perhaps the proudest achievement I have been fortunate enough to be a part of.

20 February 2003, 14:26	#1
Amiga1992 Registered User Join Date: May 2001 Location: ? Posts: 19,654	HEY! I just had this idea... I'm surprised it wasn't implemented from day one! How about adding a field that has a "Jambo! Search" for the game you are looking at? When you click at it, a window pops up with results for the game you are looking at at the HOL. So the abime network gets multitasking ;D

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20 February 2003, 15:29	#2
Drake1009 Registered User Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: Denmark Posts: 2,284	That's using the old noodle, or maybe there's more than one in your head?

20 February 2003, 15:47	#3
Amiga1992 Registered User Join Date: May 2001 Location: ? Posts: 19,654	I dunno, I have become a Dance Dance Revolution addict, you think me gots any noodles left?

20 February 2003, 16:56	#4
Drake1009 Registered User Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: Denmark Posts: 2,284	You probably do, but they're all shaped like little arrows and D's

20 February 2003, 18:40	#5
RCK Administrator Join Date: Feb 2001 Location: Paris / France Age: 46 Posts: 3,099	the HOL don't have to be linked with some download link, law is law. come back in 10 years

20 February 2003, 20:54	#6
Amiga1992 Registered User Join Date: May 2001 Location: ? Posts: 19,654	It's no download link, it's a link to a site that links to a download! Does Google get lawyers in their neck because you search for "Amiga Kickstart R0M" and you find a link to a download? no. I say it's perfectly legal.

21 February 2003, 03:08	#7
Twistin'Ghost Give up the ghost Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: U$A Age: 33 Posts: 4,662	Hasn't Jambo (the user) left the scene (again)? Having something stable linking to something unstable might create a lot of stuff to fix later.

21 February 2003, 03:39	#8
oldpx Posts: n/a	Jambo (the site) is working. Paul is frequently posting news

21 February 2003, 10:13	#9
Paul RIP Friends Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: UK Posts: 2,157	Jambo asked me to be co webmaster, he designed a web interface for me to add news and update and post my guides. He was going to give me more controls, but it looks like he ran out of time. Tried e-mailing him but got no answers so he's probably very busy in real life. I did say to Jambo I did not want the responsibility, and work of updating the search games database. What it needs is a team of people just maintaining the search database and to keep it up to date (I think it’s a too big a job for one person) Anyway, I’d say not to add a link until Jambo is back.

21 February 2003, 13:06	#10
Mr Creosote Evil Mastermind Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Home Posts: 740	I don't think this is such a great idea. It's not only a question of legality (couldn't care less about that), but also of 'image'. I think it'd cheapen HOL to provide 'download sources' (even indirectly), because it makes it look as if its own contents aren't enough. I'm sure nobody understood what I mean.... it's too early

21 February 2003, 19:44	#12
oldpx Posts: n/a	I don't understand. The site that you don't like the image of is already hosted under www.abime.net .Linking two sites of a network might cheapen the other? Let's forget about ANN, they are narrow minded, ignorant people and we can't be responsible if they did not bother checking abime.net was a pirate network or not.

21 February 2003, 19:47	#13
Amiga1992 Registered User Join Date: May 2001 Location: ? Posts: 19,654	That's what struck me, Burseg. but the reasons given seem sensitive enough. It might have been a bad idea, but I don't think it has anything to do with legal issues.

21 February 2003, 19:58	#14
Mr Creosote Evil Mastermind Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Home Posts: 740	They're both hosted under the same domain. So what? What about all sites on any free hosting service? They're all hosted under the same domain, too - without having any connection. Bad comparison since they're both listed on the 'portal page', I know - I just don't know how to explain it any better than this (it's more of a bad feeling I have): casual visitors might mistake HOL as some kind of search engine for downloads. People are stupid unfortunately

21 February 2003, 20:30	#15
oldpx Posts: n/a	I see your point and I hope no one thinks eab and hol should isolate itself from jambo because it's "related with piracy" but rather taking precautions in case people might think so. I'm making an addition to this and saying that risk is already present if some dumb guy sees www.abime.net page with direct links to both jambo and hol but there are less people with THAT level of stupidity. In any case, I don't like the idea of living by fearing and avoiding prejudice of others.

21 February 2003, 23:30	#18
Antiriad The Sacred Armour Of Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Sussex, UK Age: 45 Posts: 1,141	Damn right. Leechers are bad enough as it is. No need to make things further complicated unecessarily

22 February 2003, 02:19	#19
Twistin'Ghost Give up the ghost Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: U$A Age: 33 Posts: 4,662	At the end of the day, HOL is an information service. We never intended anyone to ever think that the listings herein offer anything but stats on Amiga commercial (and associative) games and the people that make them. From our viewpoint at the time of HOL's conception, adf download sites were plentiful and random, but what was completely devoid from the web was a reliable site providing details. Many sites abound(ed) with some details or scattered bits of info that was a mixture of correct and incorrect info. Our goal was and still is, ALL commercial games and 100% verified details for the games. It is a difficult task and one for which we continually scrutinize each other over, but that is simply because we demand only the best; keeping ourselves in check is the best way to achieve this and it creates a greater sense of unity amongst the team. And it is perhaps the proudest achievement I have been fortunate enough to be a part of.

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