16 September 2003, 23:07 | #1 |
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CONTENT of original releases
hi!
what do you think of including CONTENT of the games box into HOL? e.g. 2 disks, 1 manual, 1 reference card, 1 poster this information is very important for a collector like me - and i know many other collectors who suffer from the same lack of information. right now, it is almost impossible to get to know whether a game came originally with a poster or not. but the HOL could solve this problem. what do you say? if enough people are willing to help, it would be quite easy. i've already asked RCK and he agreed to code it if there is a need. please post what you think of it! thanks |
17 September 2003, 22:49 | #2 |
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That sort of info. is currently being inserted in the notes section at the bottom of HOL entries. For example, take a look at Prime Time.
Where available scans of game boxes and their contents also appear. However, being able to include the sort of information collectors are seeking is dependent on the HOL team owning a lot of originals in their entirety (we're working on it, but we're not rich!), or receiving scans of boxes and their contents from contributors like yourself. |
17 September 2003, 22:59 | #3 | ||
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17 September 2003, 23:23 | #4 | |
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As for unique cells representing package contents, how should this be done? An empty field like Notes? If so, the Notes field should suffice. I can't imagine any other means of displaying this info. |
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17 September 2003, 23:42 | #5 | |
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and the problem we talk about - the "unsureness" - actually IS the reason to include this information! if everybody knows everything, there would be no need for a database. no, i don't see it as a notes field. a notes field should contain info that doesn't fit anywhere else, e.g. that giana sisters had been put from shelves due to legal issues. but every game had been sold in a box, so there is always a content! a possible way could be a simple field where you put all the contens as string. or a simple matrix with disks, manual, poster etc. and a "X" if it was included. just an idea. sorry, i am a little bit confused that nobody seems to be in favour of this option. i would have loved it and i think that it is a good idea. but if no one here is interested, i won't bother and shut up... |
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18 September 2003, 09:15 | #6 |
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I think this information would be great to have, but once again I feel that this really belongs to another project. HOL is not about preservation, but CAPS is.
One of the problems for the CAPS team is to determine if a set of box scans is complete or not. If box owners could supply information about what's included in the boxes, they would not have to wait for the actual scans. Of course this is up to the CAPS team to decide, but maybe they could create a special upload area for text files or something similiar. |
18 September 2003, 09:30 | #7 |
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Well we do this already - in a fashion. The gameinfo.xml shows all that came with a game (assuming we know about it).
Maybe we could present this information in a more accessible, and less segmented way however. That I do agree. We did plan to do a web interface to the gameinfo.xml's at some point, so you could see all the info we have on a game. As it happens, when put a scan package out, we normally get feedback on it about what is missing etc. For example, our very own Mache here contributed a map that was missing from the Wizard Warz release. The problem is as I see it, that we are only going to want to record this information for the games that we have scanned - i.e. we can verify the information because we can see it - this in turn means the information will be populated very slowly. |
18 September 2003, 10:38 | #8 |
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@Walker
hmm, i don't understand why it belongs to a different project. so why do scans belong to the hol? they are also included in caps. and caps game info has most information about publisher, year and so on. does the existence of caps mean that there is no need for the hol? imagine the following scenario: another collector offers me a game. this game is unknown to me. i search for the game on hol. i can see the cover, see if there were different versions (e.g. english and german) and see what the contents of the game are. so i know if something is missing from the game i wanna buy. perhaps only my point of view, but i think that a database should contain as much info as possible! |
18 September 2003, 12:15 | #9 | |
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My opinion: Obviously not. CAPS preserves the games, and was never meant to be a games database. Also, we are unlikely to be able to get all the games that HOL describes. So without HOL, people may not know it existed as a commercial title! Of course, I can only keep on living if I know that we will find all the games, so don't dwell on that, m'kay? The games list on our site was purely to show what we have, including any information that might be needed distinguish it from other games or versions. Some examples: Pinball Fantasies OCS & AGA Barbarian (two different games by Palace and Psygnosis) Pirates, versions v832.02 and v832.04 Loom, German or English languages Lemmings and Batman, one disk version or two disk version Lost Patrol, region locked, PAL and NTSC versions Populous from US and EU regions are different Indiana Jones and the Fate of Atlantis, retail or the bugfixed budget version Kid Gloves, coverdisk or retail It is not really meant to provide information about the games. Just what is different about the releases. So I guess thinking along these lines, showing what was in the box does not really make sense. I was thinking about the possibility of putting the gameinfo.xml's online for reference about the releases themselves really, which by side effect would give you the info you wanted. |
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18 September 2003, 12:35 | #10 | |
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Okay I might be wrong but.... |
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18 September 2003, 13:25 | #11 |
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@fiath
no provocation! i just wanted to show that there is a difference between caps and hol, although they might provide partly the same information. the only point i wanted to make clear: just because it is featured in caps, it doesn't mean it should not be in hol. i don't see a difference between box scans (hol and caps) and box content (caps only). @dizzy you are right, no need to hurry! but i don't think it is a matter of time. i asked rck because i thought (and still think!) that it is a good idea. he agreed and said he could code it. filling these fields actually is a time-consuming task. but as with any other field, they can remain empty until they are filled someday. gathering the information could be done by contributors, so it is not that much of work for hol. currently a game has 30 fields, so why should 31 be a problem? |
18 September 2003, 13:39 | #12 | |
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HOL is meant to be a database focused on game information, whilst CAPS wants to preserve everything from the actual games to registration cards. I have sent some scans of manuals and other stuff to CAPS myself, and these scans are not in HOL. |
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18 September 2003, 13:55 | #13 | ||||
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hi walker!
hmm, perhaps is my english not good enough to explain what i think. or i misinterpret your statements so i will try to comment on your post. Quote:
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i hope this makes it clearer what i am actually talking about... ??? |
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18 September 2003, 16:47 | #14 |
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This site must be what you looking for... only Sierra games but very usefull for collectors ( pc only but sierras games where the same on amiga...)
http://www.vintage-sierra.com/ |
19 September 2003, 08:59 | #15 | |||
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19 September 2003, 09:52 | #16 | |||
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@Dizzy
yes, that's what i meant. a simple field with some entries. Quote:
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and be honest: there is hardly any information on the front cover of a game, perhaps title and publisher (which is redundant beacuse of the fields), so at least the front cover is pure viewing pleasure, not information! Quote:
and don't add it into hol in half a year or so and praise it as a new and cool invention because i still think that it is something new, because there is no resource on the internet which has this kind of information. what a pity! perhaps i should build another site? |
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19 September 2003, 10:33 | #17 | |||
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19 September 2003, 13:15 | #18 | |
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I will have to ask the guys though. No promises. |
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19 September 2003, 23:40 | #19 | ||
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As for making a dedicated section for game contents, it would simply be impractical. We could not make a list that could cover every possibility outside the items commonly found within game contents (that is, disks, manuals, reference card, warranty card, poster, map). For example, I have games which include uncommon items such as surgical gloves, videotapes, novels, badges, scratch 'n' sniff cards etc. Also, I doubt if people would care if a warranty card was included with a game. It would be better to just simply list the game contents, and we already do that in the Notes section. Making a dedicated notes section for game contents would simply involve too much work because we have no easy way of telling which game already has the info. and then no easy way of being able to extract it from the database. Quote:
If you or others want to submit details of game contents then we are only happy to include them in the Notes section. However, there will not be a dedicated section for game contents in the forseeable future, unless the HOL team discusses it and the majority decide that it's a good idea. As you can see, there are other HOL team members who have said that they are not in favour of your idea at the moment. We can't please all the people all of the time. If we tried to please everyone, then we would have an enormous amount of extra work and no life outside of our day jobs. |
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20 September 2003, 11:05 | #20 | ||||
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but i still feel that there is a need for that kind of info, so i am thinking about some ways to get it done. perhaps the caps-team is interested in such an expanded section. otherwise, i won't hesitate to build a database on my own. |
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