Original Workbench (and related) disks preservation - Checksums required

[icycool]

I just found this thread via your webpage.
I have a private version of diskripper that will do a disk density scan, and will help find modified tracks.
I also have quite a few original C= disks ~4-500, so perhaps some might be of help if you are still working on this.
The more copies there are of these disks, the greater success in generating a good copy out of them, at least 3 needed.

[MrDolby]

Originally Posted by pgovotsos

Are you interested in pre 1.0, beta releases or only official, commercially released versions?

Preferably official/commercial, but every WB/KS disk is more than welcome

[gdonner]

Hi MrDolby,

I just bought (and received) what appears to be a full set of developer disks for Release 2.0x (37.64)--which appears to be missing from your Workbench disk list.

If you're interested in any of the ADFs (and photos of the disks themselves), just let me know; I can either e-mail them or upload them to a private link on my website for easy download.

I'll also be e-mailing Olaf Barthel to see if any of these are something he's interested in from the standpoint of general Amiga archives:

* Amiga Workbench 37.64
* Install Disk V37.64
* Amiga Fonts 37.64
* Amiga Extras 37.64
* Amiga A3000 Kickstart 37.175
* Kickfile/Tools/Readme 37.175 (Developer Release)
* AutoDoc 37.1 (marked as "Confidential")
* Include 37.1 (marked as "Confidential")

Regards,

Greg

[Jope]

I was reminded of this project again, so decided to dump all of my WB disks.

Checksums will follow later after I attempt to verify them. Unfortunately most old 1.x WB disks are always modified or have viruses, so I'm not sure if I can be totally certain if there are any pristine ones. :-( I have several copies of some of these so hopefully I can find two that are the same.

These are all original labels. Maybe I'll take the time to photograph them at some point for proof.

1.1:
Kickstart 1.1 327244-02 (Has a sticker 50Hz but probably it's the same part no for both)
WB 1.1 327245-02
Extras/Basic/Tutor 316167-01

1.2:
I have an original kick disk but no part number on it
WB 1.2 S 33.56 23-Apr-87 317615-01 (Sweden/Finland)
Extras 1.2 intl 27-Apr-87 380706-09
WB 1.2 intl 317608-03 (This one was stickered S/F and has the contents of 317615-01 on it)

1.3:
KS1.3 317747-01
WB 1.3 UK 34.20 317789-01
WB 1.3 D 34.20 315747-02 (Germany)
WB 1.3 S 34.20 317796-01 (Sweden/Finland, my disk has errors)
WB 1.3.2 UK 34.28 317789-03
WB 1.3.2 D 34.28 317791-03 (Germany)
WB 1.3.2 A3000 367270-01 (mine has an error)
WB 1.3.2 S 34.28 317796-03 (Sweden/Finland, I have a disk with no wp slider so probably unmodified)
WB 1.3.3 S 34.24 (Sweden/Finland, I have multiples with no wp slider)
Extras 1.3 intl 317788-01 (I have one with no wp slider)
Extras 1.3 A3000 367272-01
Extras 1.3.3 intl 367618-01 (1.3.3 lost AmigaBasic, I have one with no wp slider)

2.0:
Kickstart A3000 352245-02
Install 2.0/1.3 A3000 335603-02
WB 2.0 317954-02
Extras 2.0 317235-02
WB 2.04 367813-01
Extras 2.04 367824-01
Fonts 2.04 367825-01
WB 2.05 int 37.71 9.1.92 367813-03
Extras 2.05 int 367824-04
Fonts 2.05 int 367825-03 (My disk detached from the drive plate while dumping :-( )
WB 2.05 37.72 23.3.92 367959-01
Extras 2.05 367960-01
Fonts 2.05 367968-01

3.0:
Install 3.0 370126
Install 3.0 370126-02 (root block bad so no idea what the difference might be)
Workbench 3.0 370127
Extras 3.0 370128-01
Fonts 3.0 370130
Fonts 3.0 370191-01
Storage 3.0 370150
Locale 3.0 370129
Install 3.1 370299-98 (ESCOM)
WB 3.1 370300-98 (ESCOM)
Extras 3.1 370301-98 (ESCOM)
Fonts 3.1 370301-99 (ESCOM)
Locale 3.1 370300-99 (ESCOM)
Storage 3.1 370299-99 (ESCOM)

Misc:
A2094 Toshiba 317733-01
A2232 Pilot Build Only 317769-01
A2300 Genlock Revised 317718-02
A590 RAM test 317830-01 (no wp slider)
Amiga C 1.1 316169-01 (has a V1.1 sticker, probably the same part no for 1.0)
Amiga Lisp 316171-01
Kaleidoscope 316160-01
The Very First English 380921-02
Lär Dig Själv Swedish 380921-05
Amiga Vision Boot UK 367178-03
Amiga Vision Program 367179-03 (no wp slider)
Amiga Vision Tutorial 1 int 367180-02 (no wp slider)
Amiga Vision Tutorial 2 int 367264-04 (no wp slider)

[Nobby_UK]

Has "The Very First" disk been mentioned ?

= a simple tutorial disk

[Jope]

Well I just did in English and Swedish. For some reason no-one ever translated it to Finnish back then, so we got the Swedish one. AmigaTutor from the A1000 was translated though. :-)

[Jami]

Hi MrDolby,

I took my Commodore Amiga 500 out of the attic, purchased an ACA500+ and I dumped some of my original amiga disks with TSGui. Here are the workbench disks coming with my A500 -- bought in december 1990, in France :

• Workbench v1.3.2 rev 34.28 FR/BE => CRC-32:fc4d8346
• Workbench Extras => CRC-32: 2f9cea9f
• Premiers Pas => CRC-32: 895ade7e

"Premiers Pas" and "Workbench Extras" are already known by Tosec.

But surprisingly, Workbench v1.3.2 rev 34.28 FR/BE is unknown by Tosec.

[BountyHunter]

This is my first post!

I'm new to the forum but have been an Amiga user for many years, I've just found my original Workbench 1.3.3 & Extras 1.3.3 disks:

Workbench v1.3.3 rev 34.34 A500/A2000 [U.K.][317789-04]
Extras v1.3.3 rev 34.34 A500/A2000 [INT][367618-01]

They're both untouched and were kept unused in my fathers desk as we always used backups. The Workbench disk also has no 'write enable' tab.

I Believe that Workbench v1.3.3 [317789-04] is still awaiting checksum verification so I'll endeavor to image the disks and provide CRCs ASAP.

[Jope]

Here's the CRCs of the disks I have imaged so far. We can identify a few sure ones due to me having multiple copies that match.

If there is a !, the disk was guaranteed unmodified (either sealed in plastic or no w/p notch).

1.1/ExtrasBasicTutor^1.adf - 4c1791d8
1.1/ExtrasBasicTutor.adf - 6f08ec2b
1.1/Kickstart1.1PAL.adf - 70d0030a
1.1/Workbench1.1.adf - 3cee9068
1.2/Extras1.2intl-380706-09^1.adf - 40250a41
1.2/Extras1.2intl-380706-09^2.adf - 46383329
1.2/Extras1.2intl-380706-09^3.adf - 464adbd3
1.2/Extras1.2intl-380706-09^4.adf - abad7028
1.2/Extras1.2intl-380706-09^5.adf - 15488d4e
1.2/Extras1.2intl-380706-09^6.adf - 46383329
1.2/Extras1.2intl-380706-09^7.adf - 55914f89
1.2/Extras1.2intl-380706-09.adf - bead3825
1.2/Extras1.2-PCI^1.adf - 3cbf918d
1.2/Extras1.2-PCI.adf - f0ef9c7f
1.2/Extras-copy.adf - 33475492
1.2/Kickstart1.2.adf - 9d68d211
1.2/Kickstart1.2-copy.adf - 9952865a
1.2/Kickstart1.2-PCI^1.adf - 9952865a
1.2/Kickstart1.2-PCI^2.adf - 9952865a
1.2/Kickstart1.2-PCI.adf - 9952865a
1.2/Workbench1.2-33.47-PCI^1.adf - 5b47ca49
1.2/Workbench1.2-33.47-PCI.adf - 016f7802
1.2/Workbench1.2-copy.adf - 998d72fe
1.2/Workbench1.2intl-317608-03.adf - 68a4386e
1.2/Workbench1.2S-317615-01^1.adf - 2fad8c1a
1.2/Workbench1.2S-317615-01^2.adf - 2fad8c1a
1.2/Workbench1.2S-317615-01.adf - 2fad8c1a
1.3/0061-Workbench1.3.adf - 6311126f
1.3/0062-Extras_1.3.adf - 3f4b8446
1.3/Extras1.3.3intl-367618-01^1.adf - e8eb34c4
1.3/Extras1.3.3intl-367618-01!.adf - e8eb34c4
1.3/Extras1.3D-copy.adf - bc1f2c03
1.3/Extras1.3intl-317788-01^1.adf - 2f9cea9f
1.3/Extras1.3intl-317788-01^2.adf - f7d43a71
1.3/Extras1.3intl-317788-01^3.adf - cf61bd00
1.3/Extras1.3intl-317788-01!.adf - 2f9cea9f
1.3/Extras1.3intl-317788-01.adf - 4cb15988
1.3/Kickstart1.3-317747-01.adf - 5fd0ef3b
1.3/Workbench1.3.2D-317791-03.adf - 494280ce
1.3/Workbench1.3.2D-34.28.adf - bccb677b
1.3/Workbench1.3.2S-31779603^1.adf - 30d73c76
1.3/Workbench1.3.2S-317796-03!.adf - 5646abff
1.3/Workbench1.3.2S-317796-03.adf - 5646abff
1.3/Workbench1.3.2S-34.28.adf - 689a8bdf
1.3/Workbench1.3.2UK-317789-03.adf - 7b1f7c89
1.3/Workbench1.3.2UK-34.28.adf - e206d883
1.3/Workbench1.3.3S-317796-04^1.adf - 478b386a
1.3/Workbench1.3.3S-317796-04^2.adf - 478b386a
1.3/Workbench1.3.3S-317796-04^3.adf - 478b386a
1.3/Workbench1.3.3S-317796-04!.adf - 478b386a
1.3/Workbench1.3D-315747-02.adf - 350f29dc
1.3/Workbench1.3S-317796-01-bad.adf - 629762ea
1.3/Workbench1.3UK-317789-01-mod.adf - 0795e73f
2.0/Extras2.04-367824-01.adf - a019b6b9
2.0/Extras2.05-367960-01^1.adf - 2ec25826
2.0/Extras2.05-367960-01.adf - 2ec25826
2.0/Extras2.05int-367824-04.adf - 86daec05
2.0/Fonts2.04-367825-01.adf - 2f88c0f6
2.0/Fonts2.05-367968-01.adf - 0f4d1bbd
2.0/Workbench2.04-367813-01.adf - 57714d34
2.0/Workbench2.05-367959-01.adf - 9ff825c0
2.0/Workbench2.05int-367813-03.adf - e6f7fd73
3.0/Extras3.0-370128-01.adf - 95da642d
3.0/Extras3.0-370128.adf - 95da642d
3.0/Fonts3.0-370130.adf - 6ad06536
3.0/Fonts3.0-370191-01.adf - 242ff841
3.0/Install3.0-370126-02-bad.adf - 303d6130
3.0/Install3.0-370126.adf - af8b2ec1
3.0/Locale3.0-370129-01.adf - 67835fe5
3.0/Locale3.0-370129.adf - 67835fe5
3.0/Storage3.0-370150.adf - 0c8c24d5
3.0/Workbench3.0-370127.adf - a4d9752d
3.1/Extras3.1-370301-98^1.adf - 786a7c59
3.1/Extras3.1-370301-98.adf - 786a7c59
3.1/Fonts3.1-370301-99^1.adf - a152083d
3.1/Fonts3.1-370301-99.adf - a152083d
3.1/Install3.1-370299-98.adf - 27b3c15a
3.1/Locale3.1-370300-99.adf - 92f2770a
3.1/Locale3.1-370300-99-bad.adf - 1c6d5da4
3.1/Storage3.1-370299-99^1.adf - b16ae967
3.1/Storage3.1-370299-99.adf - b16ae967
3.1/Workbench3.1-370300-98.adf - 576b08f9
3.1/Workbench3.1-370300-98-bad.adf - f3df581e
other/2094Toshiba-317733-01.adf - f755ef08
other/2232Install-317769-01.adf - 3caa21b7
other/2300Genlock-317718-02.adf - 464ff0f6
other/A590RamTest-317830-01!.adf - 1c84cf65
other/AmigaC1.1-316169-01^1.adf - 71850275
other/AmigaC1.1-316169-01.adf - 5e124f8e
other/AmigaTutorFI-PCI^1.adf - c8a734ac
other/AmigaTutorFI-PCI.adf - 2501e48a
other/Bridgeboard-317759-01!.adf - 86e43a8e
other/Kaleidoscope-316160-01^1.adf - 7c45b834
other/Kaleidoscope-316160-01.adf - 7c45b834
other/Kaleidoscope-316160-01-bad.adf - 477bfb2d
other/LärDigSjälv-380921-05^1.adf - 421e064a
other/LärDigSjälv-380921-05^2.adf - 421e064a
other/LärDigSjälv-380921-05^3.adf - 421e064a
other/LärDigSjälv-380921-05^4.adf - 421e064a
other/LärDigSjälv-380921-05^5.adf - f37311b1
other/LärDigSjälv-380921-05.adf - c65525fe
other/TheVeryFirst-380921-02^1.adf - 4fe76865
other/TheVeryFirst-380921-02^2.adf - 35a76027
other/TheVeryFirst-380921-02^3.adf - 1ab58e91
other/TheVeryFirst-380921-02^4.adf - 1140eacb
other/TheVeryFirst-380921-02^5.adf - 1ab58e91
other/TheVeryFirst-380921-02^6.adf - ca4fb945
other/TheVeryFirst-380921-02^7.adf - 35a76027
other/TheVeryFirst-380921-02.adf - 1ab58e91
other/VisionBoot-367178-03.adf - 5baa4559
other/VisionProgram-367179-03!.adf - c520146c
other/VisionTut1-367180-02!.adf - 7b5305bb
other/VisionTut2-367264-04!.adf - 262fe2ee

[Duke]

I found Workbench 1.2 Rev. 33.61 on the Internet Archive:

https://archive.org/details/workbenc...1987-commodore

It looks like this release wasn't dumped at all yet.

[Snoopy1234]

On a post by absence he asked about the A3000 OS 2.04 Install Disk and required a checksum for this thread.
There is an image on the EAB server : http://ftp2.grandis.nu/turran/FTP/Co...stall.2.04.adf

It has a 2.04 version of 37.67 but an earlier release (3.6) than the A500+ Install of (3.8) part# 367826-02. It might be the elusive A3000 2.04 Install disk - part# 367826-01 ??

The EAB image has a checksum error on block 1707 - Image CRC32 (57644161)

Image corrected with Disksalv and Working/re-structured - Image CRC32 (8B4575BE)

This is Unconfimed.

[Crashdisk]

If you have a damaged disk, it would be better to ask the community to find a good disk, rather than repair it with DiskSalv or DiskDoctor.
Why would you do that? Because when a data sector is damaged, these programs will not repair anything. They will either delete the damaged file or worse, correct the checksum so that the file can be opened but make no mistake, the data will be bad in 99,9% of the cases. The structure of the disk will also be altered so that if you repair the initial damaged disk 5 times, you will get 5 different repaired disks

About the damaged disk, there are 2 alterations:
- Modification of sector 880 by DiskCopy
- Sector 1707 is corrupted and affects the C/IPrefs file

Original disk or at least the closest existing one is CRC32 [5810AEC1]

[Snoopy1234]

Originally Posted by Crashdisk

If you have a damaged disk, it would be better to ask the community to find a good disk, rather than repair it with DiskSalv or DiskDoctor.
Why would you do that? Because when a data sector is damaged, these programs will not repair anything. They will either delete the damaged file or worse, correct the checksum so that the file can be opened but make no mistake, the data will be bad in 99,9% of the cases. The structure of the disk will also be altered so that if you repair the initial damaged disk 5 times, you will get 5 different repaired disks

About the damaged disk, there are 2 alterations:
- Modification of sector 880 by DiskCopy
- Sector 1707 is corrupted and affects the C/IPrefs file

Original disk or at least the closest existing one is CRC32 [5810AEC1]

Ok Thank you for the correction. With the image I made I replaced the IPrefs fille with the same version after Disksalv removed it and ran Disksalv again to align file structure. I haven't any experience at this.
I thought it might be an A3000 install disk.

[rhester72]

I've Zoned wb132mine.adf, which is a partially-corrected dump of a recently acquired Workbench 1.3.2 (US) disk.

The following corrections were made to the raw dump:

- Bad sectors 1434, 1632, 1654, 1676, and 1720 replaced from a TOSEC dump (with sector checksums and file integrity verified)
- Dates corrected:

.info set to 13-Aug-88 18:15:51 [taken from US 1.3.3 release, .info date unchanged from 1.3.2]
Prefs/ set to 13-Aug-88 18:16:15 [taken from IT and NL 1.3.2 releases]
Prefs/.info set to 13-Aug-88 18:16:15 [taken from IT and NL 1.3.2 releases]
System/.info set to 13-Aug-88 18:16:12 [taken from IT and NL 1.3.2 releases]
Utilities/.info set to 13-Aug-88 18:16:05 [taken from NL 1.3.2 release]

Dates that are still wrong:

System (directory)
Utilities (directory)
Root block

Unless someone magically produces a never-written-to US 1.3.2 Workbench floppy, this is very likely the closest to a pure dump we will ever have.

[Crashdisk]

I'm having trouble understanding your approach. If you're looking for a copy that's as close as possible to the original, why do this kind of thing?
I'm not talking about the repair (if done right), but about the .info files.
If the dates were wrong, the files have probably been altered.
So changing the date of the files won't bring them back to their original states!?
Also, .info files are linked to the creation of each disk, so referring to another disk doesn't make sense, unless of course they both come from the same root. Of course, these files can be copied and transferred from one disk to another, but this remains very random.

All this to say that we're moving away from the original spirit of the topic : "Original Workbench (and related) disks preservation - Checksums required"

I agree with you that finding an unmodified original is much more difficult than it first appears.

Lynk recently delivered an interesting copy with very little alteration :
.info > altered
rootblock > altered with diskcopy

.../Collection/Various/Lynk's Stuff/AAA Collections/Nathan/Nathan Disk 13.adf

[rhester72]

Originally Posted by Crashdisk

I'm having trouble understanding your approach. If you're looking for a copy that's as close as possible to the original, why do this kind of thing?

Because my intention is to restore it to original state.

I'm not talking about the repair (if done right), but about the .info files.
If the dates were wrong, the files have probably been altered.

It depends.

The following is true:

- .info files are merely cache files containing a list of icons in the folder by name, used only by Workbench 1.3 to (negligibly) speed up floppy folder presentation on the Workbench
- Merely opening a folder is enough to "update" the .info file (with precisely the same contents as before _assuming no icons have been added, removed, or had their names changed)

So changing the date of the files won't bring them back to their original states!?

They were never _not_ in their original states, see above. Unlike under 2.0+, merely opening a write-enabled disk under 1.3 is enough to alter both .info files _and_ the rootblock last-updated timestamp.

Also, .info files are linked to the creation of each disk

Most definitely not. See above.

so referring to another disk doesn't make sense, unless of course they both come from the same root.

And they *did* come from the same origin, which I quite clearly stated in my post as to the provenance of the timestamp information for each.

Of course, these files can be copied and transferred from one disk to another, but this remains very random.

No files were copied, and you're quite right - doing so would alter the disk bitmap and at that point all bets are off from a preservation standpoint.

All this to say that we're moving away from the original spirit of the topic : "Original Workbench (and related) disks preservation - Checksums required"

As no such untouched original has ever been identified (nor is likely to be), I thought folks might at least be peripherally interested in the closest even seen to a pristine state. If not, so be it, but I'm damned happy to have found one in such lightly-altered shape.

[Crashdisk]

To put it simply, you've made modifications to the disk to get as close as possible to the original, but none of them can be verified as safe and identical to the original Commodore disk that came out of the factory.
A kind of approximation to give the illusion, but it's not preservation.
However, it does have the merit of being functional, but Lynk's copy is probably closer to the original than your version and without tweaking

[rhester72]

Originally Posted by Crashdisk

To put it simply, you've made modifications to the disk to get as close as possible to the original, but none of them can be verified as safe and identical to the original Commodore disk that came out of the factory.
A kind of approximation to give the illusion, but it's not preservation.
However, it does have the merit of being functional, but Lynk's copy is probably closer to the original than your version and without tweaking

I just got a look at Lynk's dump, and you're indeed correct - the dates I corrected are indeed different (and newer). This is particularly surprising given the means by which Commodore prepared releases - US always came first, followed by UK, NL, IT, and others. I have no reasonable explanation for why the .info file would be older on International releases, but it obviously is (I can easily explain why the .info is older than the icons in a directory, but that's just another artifact of how Commodore prepared the master disks).

Thank you for the pointer - this is absolutely the cleanest yet! (Though I wonder what makes you suspect the rootblock was altered by diskcopy...simply opening the disk icon is enough to alter the rootblock to mirror the update to the root .info file).

[Crashdisk]

Originally Posted by rhester72

Though I wonder what makes you suspect the rootblock was altered by diskcopy

Timeline of events, based on my observations :
- Disk duplication with DiskCopy
- Change disk name to remove "copy of "
- Alteration of .info.

Disk Format : Bootable DOS disk

 - Block Allocation Map was found in sector 1323
 - Disk name            : <Workbench 1.3>
 - Old disk name        : <copy of Workbench 1.3>
 - Filesystem creation  : 1992.02.20 21:06:11
 - Last root alteration : 1992.02.20 21:07:50
 - Last disk alteration : 1992.02.20 21:07:53
 - Rate of filling      : 96.86% (based on BAM information)
 - Rate of filling      : 100.00% (based on sectors identification)

------------------------------- -------- -------- -- -- -- ---------------- ---------------------------------------------
 Content list                  |  Size  | CRC32  |BA|HR|SQ|      Date      | Information                                 |
------------------------------- -------- -------- -- -- -- ---------------- ---------------------------------------------
.info                          |      70|99B4D8AD|OK|OK|OK|1992.02.20 21:07|                                             |
------------------------------- -------- -------- -- -- -- ---------------- ---------------------------------------------

[rhester72]

Good lord! What tool is that? I've been doing all this with a hex editor! LOL