FS-UAE - Why it have no JIT?

nexusle · 15 April 2012, 15:05

Hey Frode,

Why FS-UAE doesn't support JIT?! With JIT the fastest possible emulation is possible.

JIT is in the sources so I think it's easy to enable it, or not?!

FrodeSolheim · 15 April 2012, 15:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by nexusle

Hey Frode,

Why FS-UAE doesn't support JIT?! With JIT the fastest possible emulation is possible.

JIT is in the sources so I think it's easy to enable it, or not?!

Because I'm not interested enough to do the work. Yes, there is JIT code in the sources, but you cannot just "enable" it. Code must also be written/fixed to make mapped memory work properly on all platforms (code can be sourced from UAE and WinUAE, of course). I'm not saying this is a big obstacle, just saying that it is some work..

And it won't work on Linux x86-64 versions, since JIT for x86-64 has not been written (I'm primarily interested in features which can work more or identically on all supported platforms).

demether · 05 May 2012, 18:53

Personaly, I'm trying to build a dedicated linux (dual booting with AROS) machine to run exclusively classic amiga programs, mostly creation apps and 060 demos.

The computer used is a athlon 2400+ 1gb ram nvidia geforce fx5600 128mb.

With winuae, JIT enabled (and big buffer), 040 with max speed emulation, I obtain a really decent emulation of a 060 (comparing demos running on real 060). I don't want to use windows xp, even if winuae give me the best results.

With e-uae, with same settings, the speed is not as good as winuae (around a good real 040), but the biggest issues are the screenmodes and scaling (as I explained on another topic).

With FS-UAE, screenmodes and autoscaling works really great, and most of the aspects of FS-aue are superior to e-uae in my opinion, not speaking of the fact we can run it on a open source linux system. But the speed performance is far from the 2 other emulators. A waaayyyyy slower. I believe it's caused by the lack of JIT.

For what I know in the amiga communities I am, there is a crowd for powerfull amiga classic emulation. Not for gaming, but for all the other things amiga can offer. I know people like me who wants to create machines booting directly on amiga classic system (like people -as myself also- do with mamecabs, virtual pincabs and stuff like that, recycling old PCs), to have a high specs classic amiga without spending the €€€€ needed to built such a computer. Since we want to use dedicated PCs for that purpose, we don't care about 64bit compatibility.

So the question is : is a fs-uae JIT enabled version will be available one day ?

thank you !

FOL · 05 May 2012, 19:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by demether

Personaly, I'm trying to build a dedicated linux (dual booting with AROS) machine to run exclusively classic amiga programs, mostly creation apps and 060 demos.

The computer used is a athlon 2400+ 1gb ram nvidia geforce fx5600 128mb.

With winuae, JIT enabled (and big buffer), 040 with max speed emulation, I obtain a really decent emulation of a 060 (comparing demos running on real 060). I don't want to use windows xp, even if winuae give me the best results.

With e-uae, with same settings, the speed is not as good as winuae (around a good real 040), but the biggest issues are the screenmodes and scaling (as I explained on another topic).

With FS-UAE, screenmodes and autoscaling works really great, and most of the aspects of FS-aue are superior to e-uae in my opinion, not speaking of the fact we can run it on a open source linux system. But the speed performance is far from the 2 other emulators. A waaayyyyy slower. I believe it's caused by the lack of JIT.

For what I know in the amiga communities I am, there is a crowd for powerfull amiga classic emulation. Not for gaming, but for all the other things amiga can offer. I know people like me who wants to create machines booting directly on amiga classic system (like people -as myself also- do with mamecabs, virtual pincabs and stuff like that, recycling old PCs), to have a high specs classic amiga without spending the €€€€ needed to built such a computer. Since we want to use dedicated PCs for that purpose, we don't care about 64bit compatibility.

So the question is : is a fs-uae JIT enabled version will be available one day ?

thank you !

I have a simular system to you (execept GFX card), WinUAE runs full speed on my desktop even without JIT.
Spose it can only be the GFX card letting it down (and maybe the 1GB RAM).

I also find E-UAE full speed in linux.

demether · 05 May 2012, 19:51

full speed comparing to what ? Wich software and computer emulation are you trying to simulate ?

As I said, I'm not trying to run a a500 (or even a 1200 with fast ram) for games (I've got a real a1200+CF for that), but a high end classic amiga (060, rtg graphics card, max ram and max freq).

A good benchmark is a 060 demo like Black Lotus Starstruck for example. It heavily use 3d, 2d (scrollings), and even voxel. It's a really good benchmark, since you can easily find real 060 videos of it on the internet to compare.

The only emulator giving me good speed, good scrolling without vsync problems, and good sound is winUAE with jit enabled.

E-uae is not that bad, but not good concerning fullscreen aga resolutions scaling , especially on LCD screens. 060 demos stills a little choppy, but the workbench is very responsive even in big resolutions.

On FS-uae, scaling and full screen are great, sound also, but the speed is not here. For example, Starstruck takes ages to load...and the workbench is really slow (rtg mode, 040/40 config, full of ram config).

FrodeSolheim · 05 May 2012, 20:05

Yes (@FOL, @demether), you are clearly talking about two different cases. dementher points at that WinUAE in fastest possible mode runs significantly faster than FS-UAE in fastest possible mode. However, there is no such thing as "full speed" here, since you can always get better speed by buying a more powerful CPU...

FOL, you on other hand, if I remember correctly, struggle to run a normal A1200 emulation without performance problem, which is something different altogether (I will have to review your case, btw -perhaps you should create a separate thread for your performance problem with log file, hardware specs, and a description of the performance issues).

I have been out all day, and sleepiness is preventing me from writing anything about JIT right now. I think I need a nap first

FOL · 05 May 2012, 21:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by FrodeSolheim

Yes (@FOL, @demether), you are clearly talking about two different cases. dementher points at that WinUAE in fastest possible mode runs significantly faster than FS-UAE in fastest possible mode. However, there is no such thing as "full speed" here, since you can always get better speed by buying a more powerful CPU...

FOL, you on other hand, if I remember correctly, struggle to run a normal A1200 emulation without performance problem, which is something different altogether (I will have to review your case, btw -perhaps you should create a separate thread for your performance problem with log file, hardware specs, and a description of the performance issues).

I have been out all day, and sleepiness is preventing me from writing anything about JIT right now. I think I need a nap first

Remember my problems were not related to my system, it was related to FS-UAE config. I dont have any issues any more.

FrodeSolheim · 09 May 2012, 22:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by nexusle

Hey Frode,
Why FS-UAE doesn't support JIT?! With JIT the fastest possible emulation is possible.

I got JIT up and running on Linux/x86 (10 hour bus drive monday evening / night...) , so it looks like JIT support is coming after all ...

nexusle · 09 May 2012, 22:42

Yeah!!!!!

nexusle · 09 May 2012, 23:05

But one question: Is the Mac build x64 or x86?!?!

FrodeSolheim · 09 May 2012, 23:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by nexusle

But one question: Is the Mac build x64 or x86?!?!

It is x86

nexusle · 09 May 2012, 23:24

Great!!! Xmas on spring

yesplease · 10 May 2012, 14:46

You are so great, Frode !! Amazing, this news is the pure essence of awesomeness ! What a great piece of software for us retro nerds ;-) !!!

demether · 10 May 2012, 18:00

that's a very good news. Can't wait to have a version to test it.

nexusle · 10 May 2012, 18:01

+1

Amiga1992 · 10 May 2012, 18:45

I think this is the first OSX emu to feature JIT, isn't it? Great job!

kriz · 10 May 2012, 18:50

Killer !!

nexusle · 10 May 2012, 18:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by Akira

I think this is the first OSX emu to feature JIT, isn't it? Great job!

No. My official E-UAE build supports JIT on OSX also

http://web.me.com/nexusle/E-UAE/files/e-uae_ub.zip

Amiga1992 · 11 May 2012, 01:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by nexusle

No. My official E-UAE build supports JIT on OSX also

http://web.me.com/nexusle/E-UAE/files/e-uae_ub.zip

True. I just forget, it just doesn't run on PPC.
Thanks for clearing that up!

FrodeSolheim · 13 May 2012, 13:39

Experimental JIT support for Linux (x86) and Mac OS X: http://eab.abime.net/showthread.php?p=818128#post818128

15 April 2012, 15:05	#1
nexusle Banned Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: Earth Age: 46 Posts: 500	FS-UAE - Why it have no JIT? Hey Frode, Why FS-UAE doesn't support JIT?! With JIT the fastest possible emulation is possible. JIT is in the sources so I think it's easy to enable it, or not?!

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05 May 2012, 18:53	#3
demether Registered User Join Date: Apr 2012 Location: france Posts: 178	Personaly, I'm trying to build a dedicated linux (dual booting with AROS) machine to run exclusively classic amiga programs, mostly creation apps and 060 demos. The computer used is a athlon 2400+ 1gb ram nvidia geforce fx5600 128mb. With winuae, JIT enabled (and big buffer), 040 with max speed emulation, I obtain a really decent emulation of a 060 (comparing demos running on real 060). I don't want to use windows xp, even if winuae give me the best results. With e-uae, with same settings, the speed is not as good as winuae (around a good real 040), but the biggest issues are the screenmodes and scaling (as I explained on another topic). With FS-UAE, screenmodes and autoscaling works really great, and most of the aspects of FS-aue are superior to e-uae in my opinion, not speaking of the fact we can run it on a open source linux system. But the speed performance is far from the 2 other emulators. A waaayyyyy slower. I believe it's caused by the lack of JIT. For what I know in the amiga communities I am, there is a crowd for powerfull amiga classic emulation. Not for gaming, but for all the other things amiga can offer. I know people like me who wants to create machines booting directly on amiga classic system (like people -as myself also- do with mamecabs, virtual pincabs and stuff like that, recycling old PCs), to have a high specs classic amiga without spending the €€€€ needed to built such a computer. Since we want to use dedicated PCs for that purpose, we don't care about 64bit compatibility. So the question is : is a fs-uae JIT enabled version will be available one day ? thank you !

05 May 2012, 19:51	#5
demether Registered User Join Date: Apr 2012 Location: france Posts: 178	full speed comparing to what ? Wich software and computer emulation are you trying to simulate ? As I said, I'm not trying to run a a500 (or even a 1200 with fast ram) for games (I've got a real a1200+CF for that), but a high end classic amiga (060, rtg graphics card, max ram and max freq). A good benchmark is a 060 demo like Black Lotus Starstruck for example. It heavily use 3d, 2d (scrollings), and even voxel. It's a really good benchmark, since you can easily find real 060 videos of it on the internet to compare. The only emulator giving me good speed, good scrolling without vsync problems, and good sound is winUAE with jit enabled. E-uae is not that bad, but not good concerning fullscreen aga resolutions scaling , especially on LCD screens. 060 demos stills a little choppy, but the workbench is very responsive even in big resolutions. On FS-uae, scaling and full screen are great, sound also, but the speed is not here. For example, Starstruck takes ages to load...and the workbench is really slow (rtg mode, 040/40 config, full of ram config).

05 May 2012, 20:05	#6
FrodeSolheim FS-UAE Developer Join Date: Dec 2011 Location: Førde, Norway Age: 43 Posts: 4,043	Yes (@FOL, @demether), you are clearly talking about two different cases. dementher points at that WinUAE in fastest possible mode runs significantly faster than FS-UAE in fastest possible mode. However, there is no such thing as "full speed" here, since you can always get better speed by buying a more powerful CPU... FOL, you on other hand, if I remember correctly, struggle to run a normal A1200 emulation without performance problem, which is something different altogether (I will have to review your case, btw -perhaps you should create a separate thread for your performance problem with log file, hardware specs, and a description of the performance issues). I have been out all day, and sleepiness is preventing me from writing anything about JIT right now. I think I need a nap first

09 May 2012, 22:42	#9
nexusle Banned Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: Earth Age: 46 Posts: 500	Yeah!!!!!

09 May 2012, 23:05	#10
nexusle Banned Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: Earth Age: 46 Posts: 500	But one question: Is the Mac build x64 or x86?!?!

09 May 2012, 23:24	#12
nexusle Banned Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: Earth Age: 46 Posts: 500	Great!!! Xmas on spring

10 May 2012, 14:46	#13
yesplease Registered User Join Date: May 2012 Location: moon Posts: 208	You are so great, Frode !! Amazing, this news is the pure essence of awesomeness ! What a great piece of software for us retro nerds ;-) !!!

10 May 2012, 18:00	#14
demether Registered User Join Date: Apr 2012 Location: france Posts: 178	that's a very good news. Can't wait to have a version to test it.

10 May 2012, 18:01	#15
nexusle Banned Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: Earth Age: 46 Posts: 500	+1

10 May 2012, 18:45	#16
Amiga1992 Registered User Join Date: May 2001 Location: ? Posts: 19,645	I think this is the first OSX emu to feature JIT, isn't it? Great job!

10 May 2012, 18:50	#17
kriz Junior Member Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: No(R)Way Age: 41 Posts: 3,185	Killer !!

13 May 2012, 13:39	#20
FrodeSolheim FS-UAE Developer Join Date: Dec 2011 Location: Førde, Norway Age: 43 Posts: 4,043	Experimental JIT support for Linux (x86) and Mac OS X: http://eab.abime.net/showthread.php?p=818128#post818128

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