Commodore keyboards

[CLXIV]

Hello!

I've never typed on a Commodore keyboard other than that of the A500 and I was curious if the other Amiga models keyboards have the same feel / mechanism? Also how about the Commodore 64 keyboard?

Bonus question: were there external keyboards that could be plugged into wedge Amigas or C64s? And if so, which port did they connect to?

[idrougge]

The A1200, A600 and A4000 keyboards feel the same as the A500. The A2000 and A3000 keyboards have a more distinct feel.

The C64 keyboard uses a totally different mechanism and feels rather cheap, though far from as cheap as its competitors.

All four-digit Amigas used external keyboards and had a dedicated port for that.

[jbenam]

Originally Posted by idrougge

The A2000 and A3000 keyboards have a more distinct feel.

Do the A2000/A3000 keyboards both have the same feel?

I have the other Amiga models, but sadly the A2000 came without a keyboard and an A3000 is way too expensive. Would be nice to know that if I ever end up finding an A2000 keyboard for a decent price I could finally feel what typing on an A3000 feels like.

And what about the A1000? How does it compare to the other Miggys? I really like the feel of the 500/600/1200/4000 keyboards. It just gives you a warm fuzzy feeling that never feels cheap.

[Subzero]

A1000 had the best commodore keyboard imo

[Jpor]

Be careful here. The A600 and A1200 can only use an external keyboard if you piggy back a device onto the mainboard such as a Lyra, PC-Key, sum or Keyrah.
The A1500, A2000, 2500, 3000 and A4000 use external keyboards with a AT type or PS/2 type connector. The A1000 also uses an external keyboard but uses a rj-11 type proprietary type connector instead.

[Matt_H]

Originally Posted by idrougge

The A1200, A600 and A4000 keyboards feel the same as the A500. The A2000 and A3000 keyboards have a more distinct feel.

This is generally true, but there are exceptions. I have a 600 with a keyboard more similar to the 2000/3000. And I have a few 4000 keyboards similar to the 2000/3000 and others that are similar to the 500/1200. Probably something to do with differences between Commodore factories.

[Jope]

Originally Posted by idrougge

The A1200, A600 and A4000 keyboards feel the same as the A500. The A2000 and A3000 keyboards have a more distinct feel.

The later A4000 keyboards have the cheapo metal spring / plastic membrane construction, but the earlier ones have the nicer feeling rubber cup / PCB construction as Mitsumi A2000 and A3000 keyboards. I don't remember having owned more than one of those cost reduced A4000 keyboards, but have had several of the more expensive type.

Then we must also remember that the A600 comes with two kinds of keyboard, the Mitsumi one feels like any other wedge amiga, because it is identical, and the blue membrane one (brand unknown) is a bit wobblier/hollower and noisier.

The A2000 came with three kinds of keyboard: Cherry (A model launch kbd), NMB (1987), Mitsumi (the most common).

The A500 had three as well, NMB (launch), Samsung (1989 ish), Mitsumi (the most common).

Out of these, Cherry and NMB are "mechanical" as in individually keyswitched. The A500 Samsung again feels rather loose and vague in its typing feel.

It is possible to make a metal spring Mitsumi hybrid keyboard feel more like a big box Amiga by swapping the metal springs with rubber cups. I have done this to my A1200 and A600, as I prefer the tactile bump instead of the linear spring.

[Jope]

Originally Posted by jbenam

And what about the A1000? How does it compare to the other Miggys? I really like the feel of the 500/600/1200/4000 keyboards. It just gives you a warm fuzzy feeling that never feels cheap.

It is individually keyswitched aka "mechanical" with Mitsumi standard mechanical switches. The typing feel is rather nice.

Downsides: cramped layout, diamond arrow keys instead of inverted T, the bottom row is tilted towards the user instead of away like every other keyboard, and that feels VERY strange to me.

[CLXIV]

Thanks everyone! As always Jope you're a living encyclopaedia of Amiga knowledge :-D really helpful and detailed answer.

And knowing Commodore, I should have known really (I did suspect) that it wouldn't be as simple and consistent as sticking to one keyboard per model. I'm going to have to open my Amiga up now to identify which keyboard it is (I don't particularly like it but I have to know!).

[Jope]

Originally Posted by CLXIV

Thanks everyone! As always Jope you're a living encyclopaedia of Amiga knowledge :-D really helpful and detailed answer.

Np.

I didn't answer the C64 question, as that is a bit off topic and the rabbit hole goes just as deep as in the Amigas, but the quick answer is: mostly an older version of the linear Mitsumi hybrid switch as found in wedge Amigas. It has longer travel and is heavier to type on due to all the components being larger.

And knowing Commodore, I should have known really (I did suspect) that it wouldn't be as simple and consistent as sticking to one keyboard per model.

In the end it's just their sourcing department doing their job, trying to cut prices and using alternate manufacturers as negotiating leverage.

I wish NMB would have lived longer, as they really are quite nice keebs. Ever since that, the competition they found probably undercut Mitsumi in price, but not in quality.

I'm going to have to open my Amiga up now to identify which keyboard it is (I don't particularly like it but I have to know!).

You could post us a picture of the ctrl-shift-alt-space area on the lower left and we can try to identify it without opening the computer.

[CLXIV]

I certainly do appreciate the offer (would have saved a little bit of hassle) but I already opened her up! Looks like I have a Mitsumi (I think the model was a 56-A620 or something like that - I expect pretty standard for a red-light model?).

So there would be a noticeable difference if I swapped in an NMB keyboard? Are they clicky or a consistent spring like my Mitsumi?

I'm curious about the ctrl-shift-alt-space area identification - are they printed differently or something?

[Jope]

Originally Posted by CLXIV

So there would be a noticeable difference if I swapped in an NMB keyboard? Are they clicky or a consistent spring like my Mitsumi?

NMB boards that shipped with the Amiga are consistent spring aka linear. Somewhat stiffer in feel than Mitsumi.

I'm curious about the ctrl-shift-alt-space area identification - are they printed differently or something?

Samsung = keycaps have a sharper shape to them, mitsumi are more rounded. NMB has a C= logo on the left Amiga keycap.

[CLXIV]

From the sounds of it then I'd probably not prefer the NMB over the Mitsumi. I'm sure some here will spit out their coffee but I actually always preferred the feel of the standard cheap PC keyboards (rubber dome I think?). Just nice to have some feedback (and register a key press) before the key is all the way down to the base. A C= would look pretty sweet though :-)

[idrougge]

Originally Posted by Jope

The later A4000 keyboards have the cheapo metal spring / plastic membrane construction, but the earlier ones have the nicer feeling rubber cup / PCB construction as Mitsumi A2000 and A3000 keyboards. I don't remember having owned more than one of those cost reduced A4000 keyboards, but have had several of the more expensive type.

Good to know, I will have a look through my A4000 keyboards to see if they all use the same mechanism.

Then we must also remember that the A600 comes with two kinds of keyboard, the Mitsumi one feels like any other wedge amiga, because it is identical, and the blue membrane one (brand unknown) is a bit wobblier/hollower and noisier.

There are also A600s with Samsung keyboards. I have never seen a blue membrane yet, do you know if they were used in SE/FI keyboards?

It is possible to make a metal spring Mitsumi hybrid keyboard feel more like a big box Amiga by swapping the metal springs with rubber cups. I have done this to my A1200 and A600, as I prefer the tactile bump instead of the linear spring.

So I have I, but some like it the other way, so I can trade springs for cups with a gentleman who wants all his keyboards to feel like A500/A1200 ones.

[Jope]

Originally Posted by idrougge

There are also A600s with Samsung keyboards. I have never seen a blue membrane yet, do you know if they were used in SE/FI keyboards?

I wonder if the blue membrane one is Samsung.

I don't remember having had blue membrane boards in other layouts than UK.

[idrougge]

I think there were QWERTZ Samsungs as well.

[Jope]

Originally Posted by idrougge

I think there were QWERTZ Samsungs as well.

I have one for the A500 at least. ;-)

[idrougge]

For the A600, that is.