Were Team 17 the best Amiga publisher?

[mc68060]

Even though they came quite late, I think Team 17 could be considered the best Amiga publisher for the following reasons:

1) Their games were developed on Amigas for Amigas
2) All of their games are Amiga originals
3) Their games make perfect use of the hardware and usually run at 50hz
4) There are no bad Team 17 games
5) They hired Amiga legends like Eric Schwartz and Tobias Richter for contributions to their games
6) They stayed until the bitter end when most other companies had already left the sinking ship
7) Most of their CD32 releases weren't shovelware
8) They listened to fans' feedback by releasing updated versions of Project X and Alien Breed, for example

All in all, while their games might not be the technically most stunning games released on the Amiga, they probably deserve to win the title of being faithful Amigans not just interested in making quick bucks but really in delivering quality titles up until the bitter end.

What do you think?

[dreadnought]

If we were to make a case for the most loyal or dedicated Amiga publisher then indeed these are strong points. But the best? It's subjective of course...personally I'd go with Cinemaware, because I have a really soft spot for their games. When it comes to publishers with more diverse library, I'd pick Core or Psygnosis ahead of T17.

Then there's Microprose, which is always my favourite publisher, no matter the platform...

[Pyromania]

Team 17 is great, maybe Psygnosis was at their same level sometimes.

[mc68060]

Psygnosis had some top-notch titles and a unique style and artwork, but they also published lots of games which suck, e.g. Cliffhanger, Last Action Hero, and Dracula. It's rather shameless to publish those titles for a company as renowned as Psygnosis! They were clearly trying to cash in on their name with those titles.

[jotd]

Team 17 games are beautiful but not all of them were good.

Excellent ones are Superfrog, Alien Breed, Arcade Pool, Body Blows & Galactic, Qwak, Worms (specially DC AGA).
Really below par ones for me: Full Contact, Project X, Assassin, Overdrive. Fast & good technically but really play like crap (I bought 3 of them as original too...)
Never got into All Terrain Racing either. Same issue as Overdrive: good scrolling but too fast and you have to memorize the track or have lightning reflexes to drive properly.

Most of their CD32 releases weren't shovelware

I can't agree totally with that: Superfrog and All Terrain Racing don't even have CD32 joypad support. Means no pause unless you have a keyboard. And they didn't even use the second button for Superfrog jump... ATR mentions the use of the green button but actually it has no effect. But Kingpin seems to have a good CD32 version with audio IIRC. And Body Blows CD32 was the best version that mixed Galactic & classic (but could have been released on A1200 too...)

But yes, it was a publisher that re-published budget/SE titles and real AGA versions: respect for that. Maybe not the best publisher, but very good one, and a feeling of respect for the customers, and providing budget titles that weren't just "cut down" but sometimes completely different games (Alien Breed SE has completely different levels, so has Assassin to some extent, and they also fixed bugs in their SE games). I think I bought Team 17 games originals more than any other publisher, including the Bitmap Brothers

BTW: Renegade is the best publisher They provided Bitmap Bros titles, plus other good ones like Virocop , Ruff n Tumble.

[acd2001]

Originally Posted by jotd

Team 17 games are beautiful but not all of them were good.

Body Blows & Galactic bleargh !!!
Otherwise I do agree very much with this post.

[nikosidis]

jotd:
Did you forget Super Stardust!!
All terrain racing is to me the best racing game on Amiga.
I never get tired of it

Team 17 was always my fav.. Amiga publisher.

All the reasons posted in the first post say a lot.

[ExiE]

ATR was actually very good game
Body Blows & Galactic were as bad as many other below average fight games...
And ProjectX SE was great Shoot 'Em Up too

[jotd]

I have to give ATR another go. I loved Qwak by the same author.

I completed BB Galactic back in the days, but never Body Blows as I found it too hard. And MK is of course much better, but I liked BB Gal. Unfair but I learned that starting on the dragon planet allows to face those dragons first (which are pretty hard). Once gotten rid of, the rest is easy.

The really positive aspect of Team 17 games is that they usually learn from their mistakes: they fix/improve the big issues of their first games in a sequel / SE. Project X is near unplayable, but SE doesn't make you lose your powerups so it's slightly easier. But I hate the "single wave" approach. It looks too much like a demo

[Predseda]

I quite liked BBG playing with Kai - Ti character.

[jotd]

completed it with Junior. Best punch ever.

Rereading the original post, I agree on the faithfulness too. I agree on most points. Great publisher. Not my favourite but certainly dedicated and on the top of the list. And the "original" team (Andreas Tadic + Rico Holmes + Allister Brimble) were really a winning trio.

[Fiery Phoenix]

Agree with most of the above, those Psygnosis titles did indeed suck, but they were some of their last ones

Full Contact, agree, not Team 17's best, but I am sure it was a budget title, so will cut some slack

Cinemaware main titles were great, but not a huge back catalogue and some of the later TV Sports titles were really average

Microprose, no doubt great games, but mainly sim based ones, which is not my forte'

LucasFilm / Renegade had some decent titles, again not a huge back catalogue as a publisher

Virgin actually has a decent amount of good games published and wide variety of genres too, but not a publisher that springs to mind

I suppose overall, when looking at the number of games released and the quality, Team 17 right up there, if not at the peak.

[str0m]

Project X became massively better for me when I realised I could change ship and one of the other ones has almost none of the horrible inertia that the standard one does.

[kremiso]

Great team indeed
publisher and not developer side talking, i still love Assassin, despite his hardness.
The first miles over the special edition imo
it require training, tactics (and patience) but is a great game

[kriz]

Truly rulez, also is cool to see they still remember the Amiga and shows of their old stuff from time to time .. The excellent 30th year celebration video from earlier this year shows this also: [ Show youtube player ] Respect to Team17!

[gimbal]

Respect that they're still alive and kicking!

[d4rk3lf]

Similar thread I opened in here:
https://eab.abime.net/showthread.php?t=97810

But in my pool Psygnosis won.
Personally, I like Team 17 games much more (and voted for it).
As I said in that thread, Team 17 for Amiga was something like Blizzard company was for PC in period of 96-2003.
So, not really big company, but every title they release is extremely polished.
And yeah... if you mention Full Contact (that I agree is mediocre game), we gotta keep in mind that it's FIRST Team 17 game.
So, I guess it's the game when team just get know eachother and has not establish workflows and all.

But I understand all others who cheers Psygnosis more, because it seems that Shadow of the Beast, had enormous impact at the time, despite the, not very rich, gameplay.

Perhaps, all the people that are with Amiga from the very beginning are tend to love more Psygnosis, while others (like me), that got involved in the Amiga after 1990, like Team 17 more.

[saimon69]

Assassin is a particular case for me, because as a Strider Fan i finally had something FAR more decent than the darn Tiertex port - clear that the tweaked up version was better

[gimbal]

Originally Posted by d4rk3lf

But I understand all others who cheers Psygnosis more, because it seems that Shadow of the Beast, had enormous impact at the time, despite the, not very rich, gameplay.

That's the thing, it all depends on what you aim for. If I would rate based on how a game emotionally affected me through graphics sound and music then companies like Psygnosis, Cinemaware and even Horrorsoft win hands down as they made/published some games that made me watch in silence and maybe even gave me some chills. But the gameplay... eh not always my cup of tea.

Those are games which have a large art component to them; although I cherish the Amiga platform for having such games... at the end of the day I still want to play game-games.

[tarr]

They made their games as Amiga games should have been, technically. I mean: smooth 50fps scrolling, great music and sound effects, overscan, no slowdowns, great graphics and so on. What they lacked was proper game design. I mean: Project X was astounding even for those who played Sega Mega Drive games, but it lacked depth and game design. Assassin was boring, and Superfrog was just a cute platformer, but no where as good as Sonic or Super Mario World. I remember i preferred James Pond II and Fire and Ice, because of their better game and level design. Alien Breed was a good game, but a little too hard and unforgiving.

Body Blows was a betrayal: the demo played better and they promised throws, but throws were not in the final game. Fighting Spirit and Shadow Warrior showed that a good beat em up in the style of Street Figher II could be made on the Amiga. Body Blows just showed lack of dedication and passion.

The best Amiga games in Team 17's category of games (polished arcade games) were Lionheart and Turrican (the three episodes), because they were non only fast, beautiful and smooth, but they also were playable and well designed, with surprises and variety.

If team 17 had a good game designer they would have been the best.