Amiga 1000 kickstart (pal/ntsc switch)

frank_b · 16 May 2010, 15:04

Hi guys. I recently managed to get ahold of a US A1k and I'd like to get it running as a pal machine.

I remember that bit 5 of register $dff1dc can be used to toggle Pal/NTSC. Will this bit work on such an old machine and are there any PAL/NTSC software switchers I can run in the start up sequence?

Will using a PAL kickstart disk make the machine boot up in PAL? I'm abroad just now so I can't really play with the machine

It comes with a rather knackered looking v12 kickstart. If someone could zone a pal kickstart 1.3 disk (not wb... just kickstart) that would be great.. I can't see Cloanto complaining about that since it's useless for emulators...

Toni Wilen · 16 May 2010, 15:26

Only ECS and newer Agnus versions can switch between PAL and NTSC. A1000 Agnus is too old (and newer Agnus versions don't fit on an A1000)

There is software hack that can switch PAL to NTSC on old Agnus versions (VPOSW hack) but afaik this method can't be used to switch from NTSC to PAL.

A1000 KS disks are technically identical to ROM versions, contains exact same data and it can be loaded as a ROM (in non-A1000 mode), at least in WinUAE

frank_b · 16 May 2010, 15:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by Toni Wilen

Only ECS and newer Agnus versions can switch between PAL and NTSC. A1000 Agnus is too old (and newer Agnus versions don't fit on an A1000)

There is software hack that can switch PAL to NTSC on old Agnus versions (VPOSW hack) but afaik this method can't be used to switch from NTSC to PAL.

A1000 KS disks are technically identical to ROM versions, contains exact same data and it can be loaded as a ROM (in non-A1000 mode), at least in WinUAE

I'm going to need a us kickstart 1.3 disk then I suppose.

I'm sure I've toggled 50/60 hz on an older Amiga though. v1.3 vintage... It would be pre ecs and definitely pre 2.x

Toni Wilen · 16 May 2010, 15:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by frank_b

I'm going to need a us kickstart 1.3 disk then I suppose.

I'm sure I've toggled 50/60 hz on an older Amiga though. v1.3 vintage... It would be pre ecs and definitely pre 2.x

Very common rev6 and later A500 board revisions had ECS Agnus (but only standard Denise)

frank_b · 16 May 2010, 16:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by Toni Wilen

Very common rev6 and later A500 board revisions had ECS Agnus (but only standard Denise)

Fat Angnus probably..

Toni Wilen · 16 May 2010, 16:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by frank_b

Fat Angnus probably..

All A500s had Fat Agnus (Fat Agnus = PLCC package, not A1000/"original" A2000 DIP).

A500 MB revision 6 replaced original Fat Agnus (8370/71) with ECS Agnus (8372A), also enabling hardware and software PAL/NTSC switching and 1M chip RAM support.

btw, 8372A is the only Agnus revision that has hardware PAL/NTSC configuration pin.

frank_b · 16 May 2010, 16:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by Toni Wilen

All A500s had Fat Agnus (Fat Agnus = PLCC package, not A1000/"original" A2000 DIP).

A500 MB revision 6 replaced original Fat Agnus (8370/71) with ECS Agnus (8372A), also enabling hardware and software PAL/NTSC switching and 1M chip RAM support.

btw, 8372A is the only Agnus revision that has hardware PAL/NTSC configuration pin.

interesting.. I thought fat agnes/agnus was named due to being able to address 1 mb of chip RAM. I'll need to open some of my 500s and see if I can get bogo ram converted to chip in that case.. i also have an a2k.. could swap the agnus on it with the one in the 1k.. reluctant to do that.. I think I'll just see if I can source a US v1.3 kickstart disk...

Toni Wilen · 16 May 2010, 17:02

I think Agnus "naming" was too confusing.. Fat Agnus vs Fatter Agnus comes to mind...

zeg · 16 May 2010, 18:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by frank_b

Hi guys. I recently managed to get ahold of a US A1k and I'd like to get it running as a pal machine.
.

As what i know you also need some 110V > 220/230V upgrade kit!?
The internal power supplie is 110V. If it is some original USA import. Kickstart disks are not the minor problem.
bye bye

frank_b · 16 May 2010, 18:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by zeg

As what i know you also need some 110V > 220/230V upgrade kit!?
The internal power supplie is 110V. If it is some original USA import. Kickstart disks are not the minor problem.
bye bye

I can get a step down on amazon cheaply enough.. Not a problem

zeg · 16 May 2010, 18:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by frank_b

I can get a step down on amazon cheaply enough.. Not a problem

Okey. So. by the way. Kickstart 1.1 was already made for PAL use. That is also not the problem.

frank_b · 16 May 2010, 19:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by zeg

Okey. So. by the way. Kickstart 1.1 was already made for PAL use. That is also not the problem.

Hi. I'm not sure I understand. The unit is from the USA as is the kickstart disk.
Are you saying the kickstart adapts to the hardware and is pal/ntsc neutral?

zeg · 16 May 2010, 19:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by frank_b

Hi. I'm not sure I understand. The unit is from the USA as is the kickstart disk.
Are you saying the kickstart adapts to the hardware and is pal/ntsc neutral?

"Kickstart 1.1: Introduced PAL mode"
But read all here.
http://www.gregdonner.org/workbench/

Toni Wilen · 16 May 2010, 19:40

1.2 (and later) supports both PAL and NTSC. 1.1 had separate PAL and NTSC versions. 1.0 and older are NTSC-only.

frank_b · 16 May 2010, 20:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by Toni Wilen

1.2 (and later) supports both PAL and NTSC. 1.1 had separate PAL and NTSC versions. 1.0 and older are NTSC-only.

The version I have is 1.2 Cool. Shame about lacking hdisk autoboot tho...

Frank

Amiga-Digital · 16 May 2010, 22:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by frank_b

I'm going to need a us kickstart 1.3 disk then I suppose.

I'm sure I've toggled 50/60 hz on an older Amiga though. v1.3 vintage... It would be pre ecs and definitely pre 2.x

but the powersuply have a tick singanl that make the a1000 50/60 hz

i have a usa 1000 board thats running with ks1.3 and 3.1 with the dkb-kickswitch

frank_b · 16 May 2010, 23:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by Amiga-Digital

but the powersuply have a tick singanl that make the a1000 50/60 hz

i have a usa 1000 board thats running with ks1.3 and 3.1 with the dkb-kickswitch

Hey. Can you please try a 50/60hz software switcher on your machine and see if it works?

Frank

Jope · 17 May 2010, 07:56

If it has the old A1000 Agnus, it will be an exercise in futility. :-)

The tick signal is not what makes the machine PAL or NTSC, it is the Agnus. The correct crystal oscillator should also be accompanied with the Agnus, but the differences caused by the incorrect oscillator aren't very visible unless you're trying to record the Amiga signal to video tape.

rkauer · 17 May 2010, 22:17

Simple and precise answer: only swapping the original thin Agnus for the PAL Agnus counterpart will make the A1000 run in PAL mode.

Remember the A1000 PAL Agnus is rare, albeit not expensive.

Pheonix · 17 November 2015, 00:34

Sorry to resurrect an old thread, but was curious. Is there any sort of Agnus "switcher" available? To allow having both a PAL & NTSC Agnus (and crystal,) available by using a switch?

16 May 2010, 15:04	#1
frank_b Registered User Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Boston USA Posts: 466	Amiga 1000 kickstart (pal/ntsc switch) Hi guys. I recently managed to get ahold of a US A1k and I'd like to get it running as a pal machine. I remember that bit 5 of register $dff1dc can be used to toggle Pal/NTSC. Will this bit work on such an old machine and are there any PAL/NTSC software switchers I can run in the start up sequence? Will using a PAL kickstart disk make the machine boot up in PAL? I'm abroad just now so I can't really play with the machine It comes with a rather knackered looking v12 kickstart. If someone could zone a pal kickstart 1.3 disk (not wb... just kickstart) that would be great.. I can't see Cloanto complaining about that since it's useless for emulators...

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16 May 2010, 15:26	#2
Toni Wilen WinUAE developer Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Hämeenlinna/Finland Age: 49 Posts: 26,506	Only ECS and newer Agnus versions can switch between PAL and NTSC. A1000 Agnus is too old (and newer Agnus versions don't fit on an A1000) There is software hack that can switch PAL to NTSC on old Agnus versions (VPOSW hack) but afaik this method can't be used to switch from NTSC to PAL. A1000 KS disks are technically identical to ROM versions, contains exact same data and it can be loaded as a ROM (in non-A1000 mode), at least in WinUAE

16 May 2010, 17:02	#8
Toni Wilen WinUAE developer Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Hämeenlinna/Finland Age: 49 Posts: 26,506	I think Agnus "naming" was too confusing.. Fat Agnus vs Fatter Agnus comes to mind...

16 May 2010, 19:40	#14
Toni Wilen WinUAE developer Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Hämeenlinna/Finland Age: 49 Posts: 26,506	1.2 (and later) supports both PAL and NTSC. 1.1 had separate PAL and NTSC versions. 1.0 and older are NTSC-only.

17 May 2010, 07:56	#18
Jope - Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Helsinki / Finland Age: 43 Posts: 9,861	If it has the old A1000 Agnus, it will be an exercise in futility. :-) The tick signal is not what makes the machine PAL or NTSC, it is the Agnus. The correct crystal oscillator should also be accompanied with the Agnus, but the differences caused by the incorrect oscillator aren't very visible unless you're trying to record the Amiga signal to video tape.

17 May 2010, 22:17	#19
rkauer I hate potatos and shirts Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Sao Leopoldo / Brazil Age: 58 Posts: 3,482	Simple and precise answer: only swapping the original thin Agnus for the PAL Agnus counterpart will make the A1000 run in PAL mode. Remember the A1000 PAL Agnus is rare, albeit not expensive.

17 November 2015, 00:34	#20
Pheonix Registered User Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: Waco USA Posts: 253	Sorry to resurrect an old thread, but was curious. Is there any sort of Agnus "switcher" available? To allow having both a PAL & NTSC Agnus (and crystal,) available by using a switch?

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