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Old 09 May 2021, 11:47   #1
Foebane
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4.4.0 noticeably slower than 4.2.0

I am currently using WinUAE 4.2.0 and am quite satisfied with it, even if some bugs require me to fall back to 4.0.1 as an earlier version.

I am trying out WinUAE 4.4.0 (the latest big release) and I've noticed that there is a small drop in the number of frames in 3D routines in 68040 demos, and everything seems a tad slower.

I can only assume there has been a fundamental change to configuration parameters that means I now have to adjust my current configs.

I would like to be fully up to date, but this issue I have needs resolving to do so.
Attached Files
File Type: zip winuae_debug_4.2.0.zip (14.9 KB, 24 views)
File Type: zip winuae_debug_4.4.0.zip (15.0 KB, 20 views)
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Old 09 May 2021, 11:55   #2
Mclane
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I can only imagine that with additions, fixes and more correct emulation it has a pull on resources. The real question is, is it slower than a real Amiga would be with whatever your settings are.

I'm sure Toni will correct me on this, just a thought from a user...
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Old 09 May 2021, 12:02   #3
malko
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I have also noticed it for games and still prefer to use 4.0.1 x32 actually in this regard.
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Old 09 May 2021, 12:10   #4
Toni Wilen
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This is quite useless information. Don't skip versions, find the exact one.

(random guess: make sure FPU mode is 64-bit)
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Old 09 May 2021, 12:17   #5
amilo3438
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Foebane View Post
I am trying out WinUAE 4.4.0 (the latest big release) and I've noticed that there is a small drop in the number of frames in 3D routines in 68040 demos, and everything seems a tad slower.
Probably some wrong settings! Which demo is in question?

PS. What CPU and OS? When you last time updated your drivers?

Last edited by amilo3438; 09 May 2021 at 12:22.
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Old 09 May 2021, 12:22   #6
Foebane
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Originally Posted by amilo3438 View Post
Probably some wrong settings! Which demo is in question?

PS. What CPU and OS? When last updated the drivers?
This is one example.

Intel Core i3 8100, and I'm using the onboard graphics UHD 630, don't think I've seen a driver update for it for a while.
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Old 09 May 2021, 12:26   #7
Foebane
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Toni Wilen View Post
This is quite useless information. Don't skip versions, find the exact one.

(random guess: make sure FPU mode is 64-bit)
I'll look for the version of WinUAE where the problem first appears and send the logs.

It's "CPU internal", but the setting is 64-bit.
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Old 09 May 2021, 12:39   #8
amilo3438
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I tested it on latest WinUAE 4.9.0 Beta19 QS A4000 040 128MB Ram! (no problem at all)

And my PC is slower: E5450@3GHz, 4GB Ram DDR2, Win10, all drivers updated. (pretty old for todays standard)

I guess something with your A4000 040 config must not be right!

EDIT:
And here you can update all your Visual C++ versions to the latest!

Last edited by amilo3438; 09 May 2021 at 12:54.
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Old 09 May 2021, 12:55   #9
Foebane
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Toni Wilen View Post
This is quite useless information. Don't skip versions, find the exact one.
The slowdown appears in 4.4.0, the previous version it works fine on (by visual inspection, at least) is 4.3.0.

I've included logs from both, with exactly the same code run at the point of logging.

Quote:
Originally Posted by amilo3438 View Post
I tested it on latest WinUAE 4.9.0 Beta19 QS A4000 040 128MB Ram! (no problem at all)

And my PC is slower: E5450@3GHz, 4GB Ram DDR2, Win10, all drivers updated. (pretty old for todays standard)

I guess something with your A4000 040 config must not be right!
That's why I figured something must've changed between versions, requiring adjustment of config files. My current configs in 4.2.0 work fine.

EDIT: What do the Visual C++ redistributables do? There's lots of them listed in my Programs and Features, they must be important. Are they drivers, or does WinUAE use them in some way? I'm curious.
Attached Files
File Type: zip winuae_debug_4.3.0.zip (15.2 KB, 22 views)
File Type: zip winuae_debug_4.4.0.zip (15.2 KB, 26 views)
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Old 09 May 2021, 13:15   #10
amilo3438
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Foebane View Post
The slowdown appears in 4.4.0, the previous version it works fine on (by visual inspection, at least) is 4.3.0.
I tested the demo in 4.4.0 with QS A4000 040 + Z3 Ram 128MB and see no problem!
Even it runs some 5% better (regarding the CPU usage) then latest 4.9.0 beta19!

I guess you need to create a new config but on the 4.4.0 and test it again! (do not use an old 4.2.0 config to test it on 4.4.0)

PS. Also, what settings is in your WinOS Power Options? (Power saver, Balanced or High performance?)


Quote:
Originally Posted by Foebane View Post
EDIT: What do the Visual C++ redistributables do? There's lots of them listed in my Programs and Features, they must be important. Are they drivers, or does WinUAE use them in some way? I'm curious.
WinUAE is compiled with Visual C++ (I guess), so it is better to have the latest versions! (it is not a driver, it is general routines used for programs compiled with VC++)

Last edited by amilo3438; 09 May 2021 at 13:31.
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Old 09 May 2021, 13:53   #11
Foebane
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Quote:
Originally Posted by amilo3438 View Post
PS. Also, what settings is in your WinOS Power Options? (Power saver, Balanced or High performance?)
It seems I'm on Balanced, but I shouldn't have to change it.


Quote:
WinUAE is compiled with Visual C++ (I guess), so it is better to have the latest versions! (it is not a driver, it is general routines used for programs compiled with VC++)
I tried installing the latest version on that page, seems it's already there.

Amilo, you don't by any chance use "Fastest possible", do you? It seems to be set as default on QS.
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Old 09 May 2021, 14:01   #12
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Originally Posted by Foebane View Post
Amilo, you don't by any chance use "Fastest possible", do you? It seems to be set as default on QS.
Of course, it is default on QS A4000 040 setting! (I have just added Z3 Fast to 128MB)

Btw. I have it on "High performance" in the Power plan.
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Old 09 May 2021, 14:10   #13
Foebane
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Of course, it is default on QS A4000 040 setting! (I have just added Z3 Fast to 128MB)
I don't use it, I use the "Approx. A500/A1200 or Cycle Exact" at the fastest I can get it, along with the Cycle Exact Emulation Speed set to x8.

I do everything I can to get it running as fast as I can EXCEPT for "fastest possible", because then I can finely control it and it is a lot more stable, even if the framerate on a few demos is really lower than it could be.

I used to use Fastest Possible, but it was too unstable and even some people said my FP config was wrong and not recommended. Don't remember who now.

EDIT: Can't you see what is wrong in the config I provided? Everything should be laid out there.
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Old 09 May 2021, 14:22   #14
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EDIT: Can't you see what is wrong in the config I provided? Everything should be laid out there.
No, Toni is in charge of that!

Btw. I have no problem also with approximate or fastest possible!
Also, you can always move the slider to the left is you encounter speed problem with fastest possible.

PS.
It seems to me that you are very bored today!
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Old 09 May 2021, 14:40   #15
Foebane
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Originally Posted by amilo3438 View Post
No, Toni is in charge of that!
I'll wait and see if Toni says anything about my config.

Quote:
Btw. I have no problem also with approximate or fastest possible!
Also, you can always move the slider to the left is you encounter speed problem with fastest possible.
Yeah, in the past I set the Fastest Possible slider all the way to the right! Didn't think about slowing it down.

Of course, as of now, I have a new system for adjusting the baseline config so I can tailor it for individual demos, so yeah, I could spend time converting them to various FP speeds.

I did try FP just now with my current config, but the sound became garbled. Any idea how to fix that?

Quote:
PS.
It seems to me that you are very bored today!
Actually, I am. 4.2.0 works OK, but it seems some people here swear by the absolutely latest versions of WinUAE, so I was wondering what I would have to do, config-wise.
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Old 09 May 2021, 14:44   #16
amilo3438
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Originally Posted by Foebane View Post
I did try FP just now with my current config, but the sound became garbled. Any idea how to fix that?
Yes, try to move the sound buffer to 9 or 10! (if you are using WASAPI Default)
Or change it to WASAPI EX or DSOUND. That is how I fixed a sound "speed" problem.
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Old 09 May 2021, 14:52   #17
Toni Wilen
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CPU speed adjustment is the most likely reason. Behavior will change between versions. Or vsync.

Most optimal solution is variable refresh monitor (g-sync/freesync). Normal vsync usually sucks, unfortunately.
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Old 09 May 2021, 16:29   #18
Foebane
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Most optimal solution is variable refresh monitor (g-sync/freesync). Normal vsync usually sucks, unfortunately.
So I have to buy a new, expensive monitor?
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Old 09 May 2021, 17:08   #19
amilo3438
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Not unless you want to be in trend!

By the way, I'm not a fan of g-sync/freesync things.
I can always set screen to HDMI 50Hz and all problems is gone.

Last edited by amilo3438; 09 May 2021 at 17:21.
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Old 09 May 2021, 17:11   #20
Toni Wilen
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So I have to buy a new, expensive monitor?
No (and they aren't that expensive).

Disable CPU speed adjustment. Any change? Disable JIT (it does not really make any sense with non-fastest mode anyway). Any change?

If it still is slow: then try betas to find out the one that introduced the problem.
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