Can Furia upgrade Amiga 600 to A1200 compatibility?

[VegaVegas]

As the title says- if I upgrade Amiga 600 with Furia upgrade card, is this possible to play AGA games dedicated for Amiga 1200?? I'm mostly interested in running newer AGA games and Doom Amiga if it's in any way possible. If none of this is an option then I will just upgrade RAM. Thanks in advance

[AmigaHope]

The Furia is a simple 68030 CPU upgrade (with RAM and some other stuff). It will not do that, though it will let you run Doom semi-playably with a small enough window.

The Vampire V2 *CAN* do that as it has a large FPGA that lets it implement AGA. (Not to mention being far, far, far faster than a 68030)

[VegaVegas]

Oh well, I planned to buy Furia so if it can't do that then even what's the point?? Vampire is a severe overkill and a huge waste of money so I will probably just stick to more RAM for hard drive loaders

[Pollock]

Originally Posted by AmigaHope

The Furia is a simple 68030 CPU upgrade (with RAM and some other stuff). It will not do that, though it will let you run Doom semi-playably with a small enough window.

The Vampire V2 *CAN* do that as it has a large FPGA that lets it implement AGA. (Not to mention being far, far, far faster than a 68030)

The Furia is an overclocked 020, he did make an 030 prototype, but it never went into production.

And yes, with a Vampire you can play AGA, but only across HDMI, and alot of the AGA don't work yet.

[Daedalus]

A faster CPU is still a good thing, making many games much nicer to play. But it depends on the type of game really, whether it's worth it or not.

[AmigaHope]

Yeah, it will still improve your experience. Stuff will load/decrunch faster, CPU-dependent games like Frontier or Zeewolf will play MUCH better, and managing all your WHDLoad stuff in general will take less time.

Not to mention you'll have proper exits from WHDLoad with garbage collection without having it have to be manually coded into the slave.

[Heywood]

Probably not a particularly helpful answer here but if you are looking towards AGA level games, perhaps something like a MiSTer could be worth considering?

It most likely going to cost less than an Amiga 1200 or a Vampire - fairly easy to get access to with plenty of youtube videos etc about. It would be more costly than a Raspberry Pi but from what I understand (I don't have one myself) they "feel" closer to the real thing since the custom chips are replicated at a gate level rather than using software emulation.

You could find the AGA games weren't worth the hype and be happy that the MiSTer can emulate other systems.

[VegaVegas]

I always hated software emulators because every emulator for any system has WAY too many errors and WAY too many oversights... I never even understood Mister device either, this is like another one of those Raspberry Pi systems to me, which I also hate because they are emulators. But if this is a HARDWARE emulator then this sounds more like an Everdrive emulator for consoles which is just a little more acceptable. Hmmm, so... what is the real efficiency and does this really replace real hardware and are there any critical or stupid errors for Amiga 1200/CD32 emulation??

[Heywood]

This isn't the same kind of thing as software emulation on a Raspberry Pi or PC

My interpretation is that the FPGA is a big chunk of re-programmable logic (and RAM) that can be purpose programmed for various tasks - e.g. re-creating a 68020 CPU, Agnus, Denise etc. So at a bit level view data exchange between different re-created chips still communicate across the various Amiga bus paths.

The Vampire itself utilises an FPGA to do its magic, the non-standalone variant seems to almost just use the amiga as a power and input host.

Again I don't have one but I have heard from those that do, generally seem to think that it behaves and feels like an Amiga on reliable hardware and as it seems to be a fair number of people saying this, I suspect they aren't just trying to make themselves feel better about spending (a bit?) more than a Raspberry Pi.

[Lisko]

I have both a mister and an Amiga 1230 and I can say for sure that the mister is really really close to the original both as graphics and sound accuracy, it's really hard to distinguish between the two but the original hardware it's just another feeling for me: Having to use real floppies disks, pcmcia cf/ethernet cards, original keyboard and other accessories... but these are very personal opinions is up to you if a modern recreation it's the same thing as the original. Surely as authenticity the mister is right behind the original hardware more than everything else (vamp4sa included) but still isn't the same thing obviously.

[d4rk3lf]

If you wanna play Doom, even A1200 with fast 030 proc, won't be enough, for todays standards... it's really slow on any 030.

So, if you wanna Doom experience on OCS/ECS, at reasonable speed, only Warp/Vamprire, or some cards with 040/060 proc could do the job well.

[amiman99]

I have A600 with ACA630 25MHZ, I can tell you that Doom is not fun on this system. You can play it in smaller window and with less colors.
Not worth it.
But, if you want your A600 to feel more snappy, faster, and better to live with, any accelerator will help.
A600 with 68000 7Mhz and no fast RAM is not fun.

To play Doom at minimum, A1200 with 030 50MHz is a good start.

[Lisko]

Originally Posted by amiman99

I have A600 with ACA630 25MHZ, I can tell you that Doom is not fun on this system. You can play it in smaller window and with less colors.
Not worth it.
But, if you want your A600 to feel more snappy, faster, and better to live with, any accelerator will help.
A600 with 68000 7Mhz and no fast RAM is not fun.

To play Doom at minimum, A1200 with 030 50MHz is a good start.

Even an 030 @ 50mhz it's pretty low spec for doom. Sure it's a start but not a good one for a comfortable experience and considering that everything today is better at it hasn't much sense. For doom at a reasonable speed without RTG a pumped 040 or even better a 060 is needed.

[Pollock]

Originally Posted by amiman99

I have A600 with ACA630 25MHZ, I can tell you that Doom is not fun on this system. You can play it in smaller window and with less colors.
Not worth it.
But, if you want your A600 to feel more snappy, faster, and better to live with, any accelerator will help.
A600 with 68000 7Mhz and no fast RAM is not fun.

To play Doom at minimum, A1200 with 030 50MHz is a good start.

I can tell you from testing Doom :

68030 @50mhz - 7 FPS
68060 @66mhz - 26 FPS
Vampire V1200 - 35FPS

[VegaVegas]

Originally Posted by Pollock

I can tell you from testing Doom :

68030 @50mhz - 7 FPS
68060 @66mhz - 26 FPS
Vampire V1200 - 35FPS

How is that even possible??? I think Doom was designed for 386, maybe 486...

[amiman99]

Originally Posted by Pollock

I can tell you from testing Doom :

68030 @50mhz - 7 FPS
68060 @66mhz - 26 FPS
Vampire V1200 - 35FPS

Just tried it on my 030 50MHz, Doom Attack, LOW Detail, smaller window by 2, I get 14fps. It's playable. It's not good looking by any means, and doesn't feel sluggish.

[d4rk3lf]

Originally Posted by VegaVegas

How is that even possible??? I think Doom was designed for 386, maybe 486...

It crawls on fastest 386 too... maybe even slower then fastest 030.

[Pollock]

Originally Posted by amiman99

Just tried it on my 030 50MHz, Doom Attack, LOW Detail, smaller window by 2, I get 14fps. It's playable. It's not good looking by any means, and doesn't feel sluggish.

yeah, sounds about right, i was testing full screen. high detail.

[AmigaHope]

Originally Posted by VegaVegas

How is that even possible??? I think Doom was designed for 386, maybe 486...

It's the chip ram bus. As your CPU gets faster, more and more of the fps limit comes from just waiting for the transfer to video memory to complete. You get the same effect playing Doom on an ISA VGA card. Doom plays silky smooth on a 486 but only if your VGA card uses VESA Local Bus (or the rare EISA or MCA bus). There was a brief period where there were double-speed ISA slots to help this problem before VLB became the standard.