Unable to mount Amiga HD

pipper · 30 July 2017, 21:50

I'm trying to mount a real Amiga HDD into WinUAE to be able to create an image from it and eventually backup the contents. The harddrive is connected via an IDE-to-USB adapter. I have successfully mounted other 2.5" harddrives (4GB, 10GB) using WinUAE with the same adapter.
The problem harddrive is an original 170mb harddrive out of an (Escom) Amiga 1200HD. Its a Seagate ST9190AG. The harddrive likely has never seen a PC, while the other working harddrives are more modern and were originally used in a PC (before I partitioned them for Amiga use).
The biggest difference I notice is that the Windows diskmanager shows it as not initialized (which is fine), but is not able to show the drive size. The working drives are also shown as not initialized, but windows at least figures the size.

Is there anything I can do to make Window/WinUAE recognize the drive?

mark_k · 30 July 2017, 22:15

You probably need to connect the drive to your motherboard's IDE port, or to a SATA port via an IDE-SATA converter. Many USB-IDE bridge chips don't work with old IDE drives.

idrougge · 31 July 2017, 01:21

What Mark K. says.

pipper · 31 July 2017, 01:36

Thanks, I had a hunch this would be the case. I'll get a 3.5" to 2.5" IDE adapter and try it on an older PC that still has IDE ports :-)

Toni Wilen · 01 August 2017, 22:28

Windows detecting the drive but with 0 byte size is quite common side-effect when drive is too old for USB adapters. (I am still not sure whats the real reason, perhaps it happens when drive is CHS only and does not support LBA addressing?)

In worst case (really old/buggy drive) forcing PIO0 mode in BIOS may be required.

EDIT: Could you download http://www.winuae.net/files/b/winuae.7z , then go to add harddrive, select the drive and press new Read Identity button. What do you get? (attach the output)

EDIT2: Use the USB adapter with above test, above test version should show the drive with zero size in select list. There is chance to support those drives if ATA passthrough works and reason really is CHS-only drive.

pipper · 05 August 2017, 09:13

I tried the beta executable - but no success.
When starting WinUAE regular, the drive will show up, but can't be accessed.
If I run WinUAE as admin, the drive will not be listed.

In meantime, I also tried to run the drive directly on an IDE port of an older computer, but it would not recognize it at all. The drive _is working_ in my Amiga.

Toni Wilen · 05 August 2017, 09:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by pipper

I tried the beta executable - but no success.
When starting WinUAE regular, the drive will show up, but can't be accessed.
If I run WinUAE as admin, the drive will not be listed.

I must have missed some extra test..

Could you run as admin, click add harddrive, quit winuae, attach winuaebootlog.txt? It should show the error.

Quote:

In meantime, I also tried to run the drive directly on an IDE port of an older computer, but it would not recognize it at all. The drive _is working_ in my Amiga.

Did you check if PC has BIOS setting to force PIO-0 mode? Some ancient drives apparently report their supported capabilities wrong.

mark_k · 05 August 2017, 13:54

Some more random thoughts...

Have you checked the master/slave jumpers on the drive? That probably won't be the cause of the problem, since it's probably set for master already.

Looking at the ST9190AG product manual, it doesn't support LBA access and thus words 60-61 of its IDENTIFY DEVICE data contain zeros. It doesn't seem to support DMA or any advanced PIO modes either.

Not relating to that drive, but apparently some old drives require that an INITIALIZE DEVICE PARAMETERS command be issued before being accessed. Another thing likely to trip up USB bridge chip firmware…

Also, the Conner CP3000 40MB drive looks like it may contain bogus values for C/H/S geometry in words 1, 3 and 6. The Masoboshi MC-702 driver contains code to handle that; I guess the developer had one of those drives. And scsi.device in Kickstart contains a quirk for Conneer CP2024.

pipper · 05 August 2017, 22:56

I attached the winuaebootlog.txt.

I think this is the relevant part:
opening device '\\?\usbstor#disk&ven_&prod_&rev_#152d203380b6&0#{53f56307-b6bf-11d0-94f2-00a0c91efb8b}'
device id string: '152D203380B6'
IOCTL_DISK_GET_LENGTH_INFO failed with error code 21.
IOCTL_DISK_GET_LENGTH_INFO not supported, detected disk size may not be correct.
BPS=512 Cyls=0 TPC=0 SPT=0 MediaType=12
device size 0 (0x0) bytes
IOCTL_DISK_GET_DRIVE_LAYOUT failed with error code 21.

Toni Wilen · 06 August 2017, 09:30

Thanks.

Second attempt, winuae.7z updated.

pipper · 07 August 2017, 02:32

The latest executable let me read the identity, but I guess the result is not successful :-)

BusType: 0x07
Vendor: ''
Product: ''
Revision: ''
Serial: '152D203380B6'
Size: 0

INQUIRY:
00000201 ....

Toni Wilen · 07 August 2017, 19:17

Yeah, adapter really seems to have trouble accessing the drive.

Request for drive capacity and mode sense pages via SCSI passthrough returns "Medium not present" error.

01 August 2017, 22:28	#5
Toni Wilen WinUAE developer Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Hämeenlinna/Finland Age: 49 Posts: 26,534	Windows detecting the drive but with 0 byte size is quite common side-effect when drive is too old for USB adapters. (I am still not sure whats the real reason, perhaps it happens when drive is CHS only and does not support LBA addressing?) In worst case (really old/buggy drive) forcing PIO0 mode in BIOS may be required. EDIT: Could you download http://www.winuae.net/files/b/winuae.7z , then go to add harddrive, select the drive and press new Read Identity button. What do you get? (attach the output) EDIT2: Use the USB adapter with above test, above test version should show the drive with zero size in select list. There is chance to support those drives if ATA passthrough works and reason really is CHS-only drive. Last edited by Toni Wilen; 02 August 2017 at 11:15.

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30 July 2017, 21:50	#1
pipper Registered User Join Date: Jul 2017 Location: San Jose Posts: 664	Unable to mount Amiga HD I'm trying to mount a real Amiga HDD into WinUAE to be able to create an image from it and eventually backup the contents. The harddrive is connected via an IDE-to-USB adapter. I have successfully mounted other 2.5" harddrives (4GB, 10GB) using WinUAE with the same adapter. The problem harddrive is an original 170mb harddrive out of an (Escom) Amiga 1200HD. Its a Seagate ST9190AG. The harddrive likely has never seen a PC, while the other working harddrives are more modern and were originally used in a PC (before I partitioned them for Amiga use). The biggest difference I notice is that the Windows diskmanager shows it as not initialized (which is fine), but is not able to show the drive size. The working drives are also shown as not initialized, but windows at least figures the size. Is there anything I can do to make Window/WinUAE recognize the drive?

30 July 2017, 22:15	#2
mark_k Registered User Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Posts: 3,344	You probably need to connect the drive to your motherboard's IDE port, or to a SATA port via an IDE-SATA converter. Many USB-IDE bridge chips don't work with old IDE drives.

31 July 2017, 01:21	#3
idrougge Registered User Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Stockholm Posts: 4,342	What Mark K. says.

31 July 2017, 01:36	#4
pipper Registered User Join Date: Jul 2017 Location: San Jose Posts: 664	Thanks, I had a hunch this would be the case. I'll get a 3.5" to 2.5" IDE adapter and try it on an older PC that still has IDE ports :-)

05 August 2017, 09:13	#6
pipper Registered User Join Date: Jul 2017 Location: San Jose Posts: 664	I tried the beta executable - but no success. When starting WinUAE regular, the drive will show up, but can't be accessed. If I run WinUAE as admin, the drive will not be listed. In meantime, I also tried to run the drive directly on an IDE port of an older computer, but it would not recognize it at all. The drive _is working_ in my Amiga.

05 August 2017, 13:54	#8
mark_k Registered User Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Posts: 3,344	Some more random thoughts... Have you checked the master/slave jumpers on the drive? That probably won't be the cause of the problem, since it's probably set for master already. Looking at the ST9190AG product manual, it doesn't support LBA access and thus words 60-61 of its IDENTIFY DEVICE data contain zeros. It doesn't seem to support DMA or any advanced PIO modes either. Not relating to that drive, but apparently some old drives require that an INITIALIZE DEVICE PARAMETERS command be issued before being accessed. Another thing likely to trip up USB bridge chip firmware… Also, the Conner CP3000 40MB drive looks like it may contain bogus values for C/H/S geometry in words 1, 3 and 6. The Masoboshi MC-702 driver contains code to handle that; I guess the developer had one of those drives. And scsi.device in Kickstart contains a quirk for Conneer CP2024.

06 August 2017, 09:30	#10
Toni Wilen WinUAE developer Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Hämeenlinna/Finland Age: 49 Posts: 26,534	Thanks. Second attempt, winuae.7z updated.

07 August 2017, 19:17	#12
Toni Wilen WinUAE developer Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Hämeenlinna/Finland Age: 49 Posts: 26,534	Yeah, adapter really seems to have trouble accessing the drive. Request for drive capacity and mode sense pages via SCSI passthrough returns "Medium not present" error.

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