Super Stardust AGA problems, I can't even get it started

Edit/update:
Refer to my 3rd post in this thread to find the latest detailed listing on how best to configure WinUAE v1.3.3 to play Super Stardust AGA, and a "Step-by-Step" tutorial on getting it started.
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Hi guys, sorry to be a bother again – especially if this is a simple (non) issue. But I cannot seem to get past the “Insert Disc 1” screen when trying to load up my 6 disk set of Super Stardust AGA for some reason:

I have read in another topic something about Super Stardust using the “cycle-exact emulation” setting, and how it’s a game that is known for its fair share of emulation issues– but I’m not even able to make it to the playable part of the game yet , which it seems everyone else is able to get to at least.

Here’s what happens to me:

Step 1:
I put Super Stardust AGA Disk 1 (of 6) in the DF0 drive slot, I click “left mouse button” and it takes me to the “Insert Disk 1 “screen.

Step 2:
From there I press “F12” to take me back to the WinUAE GUI screen – I then eject the Super Startdust disk 1 from the DF0 drive and put in disk 2 (I have tried the “End + F1” process as well, just in case I was swapping disks wrong) then I press OK – but nothing happens I’m still stuck on the “Insert Disc 1” screen (which seems to be frozen/ missing colour?)

I have also tired using "Disc 1" and "disc 2"when it asks me to “insert disc 1” just in case it expects me to use the same disc over again ?



This is my Kickstart Rom status (all full):
A500/A2000 Boot ROM v1.2:available
A500/A2000 Boot ROM v1.3:available
A500+: available
A600: available
A1000: available
A1200: available
CD32: available
CDTV (CD-ROM emulation not yet working): available

Here are the WinUAE settings I have tried for Super Stardust AGA far (I have no clue what changes should be made (if any)– so I haven’t really bothered tinkering around much, figuring I’d just do more harm than good):

WinUAE 1.3.3
Quickstart:
Model: A1200
Configuration: tried both options : “basic non expanded” and “4MB fast Ram “
Compatibility vs…: Best Compatibility
Host config: Default
Hardware:
CPU:
68EC020, more compatible
CPU Emu speed: fastest possible


Chipset:
AGA
Options: Faster RTG
Collision Level: Sprites and Sprites vs playfield
Sound emulation : 100% accurate
ROM:
Main Rom File : KS Rom v3.0 (A1200) rev39.106
Enable HRT Mon: ON
All other areas of this setting screen are left empty /default
RAM:
Memory Settings:
Chip: 2MB
Fast: 4MB
Slow: None

All other settings left default (actually every setting is left default except for the testing of the 2 emulated hardware configurations of the Quickstart menu)



Also, I was wondering if there is a site/ list that I can go to that gives a detailed description of what specific set-up configuration each game requires/ is best suited to? (Again, sorry if this is all basic info that I should already be aware of.)



Thanks

[pjhutch]

I have tried it myself and have exactly the same problem.

For a list of games, try the Hall of Light website at
http://hol.abime.net but as for configurations, back2roots.org used to do that but its now closed down.

[Toni Wilen]

Enable floppy "turbo" mode. Game uses stupid CPU loop while waiting for disk dma to finish (and of course the CPU loop finishes too early..)

[Mclane]

upping the CPU idle 2 notches and cycle exact also cure the loading problem.

Edit: But seeing Toni's post I'm hoping Exact CPU can be turned off now...

[rsn8887]

I got into the game, but it has issues due to emulation.
If you want to play it, there is also a pc version that is not bad at all. You can get it from www.the-underdogs.info and it runs very fine in dosbox. Worth checking out!

[Toni Wilen]

Originally Posted by rsn8887

I got into the game, but it has issues due to emulation.

It would be nice to know more about these issues...

[Mclane]

Originally Posted by Toni Wilen

It would be nice to know more about these issues...

Can't say I noticed any once I got it going today, well the only thing was the daft trainer on it didn't properly work but both trained and untrained versions seemed fine to me.

Controls were AOK,
Didn't notice any screen garbage
Sound was fine

Played through 2 levels (tunnels) and honestly can't remember any issues here?

[rsn8887]

Are you sure you played the AGA version?
Just tried again on 1.3.4 and the old problems I had before remain...
These are:
1) resolution of overlays (ship and energy meter) is halfed, e.g. they are more pixelated than on real A1200
2) Asteroids flicker and their animation is wrong: looks like two frames are superposed in some weird interlace flicker
3) Crashes after finishing one level, it just hangs at score summary screen

If you got Super Stardust AGA to work, can you summarize or better attach your config? I am probably missing some profound setting...
I tried with both cycle exact and without, and fiddled around a bit, but I cannot claim I exhaustively tried all possible settings

[Toni Wilen]

Originally Posted by rsn8887

1) resolution of overlays (ship and energy meter) is halfed, e.g. they are more pixelated than on real A1200

Superhires sprites, not supported (scaled to hires), proper support would need 1280+ PC side resolution (would be really slow and BIG)

2) Asteroids flicker and their animation is wrong: looks like two frames are superposed in some weird interlace flicker
3) Crashes after finishing one level, it just hangs at score summary screen

I think I remember this happening when I tested this game last time (months ago), most likely depends on host PC speed (only A500-mode is locked to "real" speed) or configuration.

For some unknown reason no flashing yesterday..

[rsn8887]

I think I remember this happening when I tested this game last time (months ago), most likely depends on host PC speed (only A500-mode is locked to "real" speed) or configuration.

For some unknown reason no flashing yesterday..

You are perfectly right, thanks for the hint!
I found the culprit: I used the "fastest possible" setting, as usual. But a quick check with sysinfo showed that, with my current config and machine, I get only ~80% of true A1200 Dhrystone speed. Apparently that is not enough for Stardust. So, if I use "Adjustable between CPU and Chipset" instead and notch the cpu-chipset slider 2 ticks up from CPU, sysinfo reports 112% A1200 speed. And lo and behold, the asteroids look perfect, the game plays perfect.

At score report after first level, I had to fiddle a bit with the slider (the report screen seems to use a lot of the custom chips, so I had to slide it higher temporarily) to get it to accept my firebutton presses. But somehow I actually got into level 2! Finally Super Stardust AGA is back!

Am I right in guessing that my machine is too slow to get the timings for chipset correct and _simultaneously_ emulate cpu at a speed as fast or faster than a 68EC020?

Thanks for the tips guys.

Edit: refer to rsn8887's post directly above this one for more config setting tips




note:
Just as warning though to those messing with the “Cycle Exact” and "cpu idle" settings.... They don’t work in combination with the “Turbo” setting in the “floppy drive emulation speed”

when I tried with “cycle exact” and “faster RTG” checked(on) (in the Chipset / options section), I got past the “inset disk 1/ disk 6/ disk 1 process – and got to the “ In a distant galaxy a long, long time ago.. “ screen - but then when I came to the “Episode II Schaumund strikes back” mock star wars type screen - (whether I tried to skip it early or waited until it finished it’s read out - ending with the line “The professor is back in business”) it just froze with the scrolling stars eventually turning into pixilated glitchy white blocks after about 20-25 seconds of continued down scrolling.

I couldn’t seem to do anything here – it just glitches with the intermittent stars going blocky and some white flicker bars popping up on the sides every so often.

This seems to happen with just “cycle exact” checked on (without "Faster RTG but with floppy set to "Turbo” ) as well, so make sure not to mess with those settings if you are using the “Turbo” setting with this game.



Thanks again for the responses.

Oh, it seems rsn8887 posted his latest reply just as I did mine.

Thanks for the update - it sounds like you figured out my problem too.

Edit: I'll use this post to list all of the info I know on how to best configure WinUAE 1.3.3 for Super Stardust AGA, and then a step-by-step tutorial on how to get it started.

If anyone notices any mistakes/ inaccurate info in my step by step process or the set-up configuration I have listed etc – please let me know and I will edit the post accordingly.
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(As tested on WinUAE 1.3.3)
( the 4 Main changes to the default settings are marked with asterisks *)

Settings:
Quickstart:
Emulated Hardware:
Model: A1200
Configuration: tried both options : “basic non expanded” and “4MB fast Ram “ (doesn’t seem to matter as far as how the game runs?)
Compatibility vs required CPU Power (slider): Best Compatibility (all the way to the left) (default)
Host Configuration: Default Configuration (default)
Mode: Start in Quickstart mode (checked/ ON) (default)
Emulated Floppy Drives:
*Floppy Drive DF0: (Select Disk Image): Super Stardust AGA disk 1 (starting disk)
Hardware:
CPU:
CPU: 68EC020, “More compatible” (checked/ ON) (default)
*CPU Emulation Speed: Adjustable between CPU and Chipset
*CPU….Chipset (slider): 3rd notch/tick (2 more notches to the right)
CPU idle (slider): 1st tick (all the way to the left )(default)

Chipset:
Chipset: AGA (default)
Options: Faster RTG checked/ ON or unchecked/ OFF (doesn’t seem to matter if left default or everything unchecked)
Collision Level: Sprites and Sprites vs Playfield (default)
Sound emulation : Emulated,100% accurate (default)
ROM:
Main Rom File : KS Rom v3.0 (A1200) rev39.106(512k)
Enable HRT Mon: ON (default)
note: All other areas of this setting screen are left empty /default
RAM:
Memory Settings:
Chip: 2MB(default)
Fast: 4MB (default)
Slow: None (default)
Floppy Drives:
*Floppy Drive Emulation Speed: Change to “Turbo” (slider all the way to the left)
note: All other areas of this setting screen (GUI) are left as default.


Once you have all of the settings configured ( with Super Stardust AGA disk 1 in the DF0 slot etc - as listed above) here is the rest of the start-up process to be followed:
(Note: Disks 3, 4 & 5 are not used for the start up process):


Short summarized step by step for those familiar with WinUAE:

Step 1: (starting with disk 1 in the DFO slot) next “INSERT DISK 6”, press “left mouse button” to confirm
Step 2: next “INSERT DISK 1”, press “left mouse button” to confirm
Step 3: Once past the “mock Star Wars “ type intro - F12 out to the GUI and change the “CPU… Chipset “ slider from the “3rd” notch over to the “8th” notch/ tick (going from Left to right) return to game screen
Step 4: “INSERT DISK 2” and press “left mouse button” to confirm
Step 5: F12 out to the GUI again and change the “CPU… Chipset “ slider back to the “3rd” notch/ tick. Now go back to the game screen and start playing the game.

Detailed Step by Step for those new to WinUAE:

Step 1:
Skip the “Prestige” intro screen by clicking the “left mouse button” – after about 2-5 seconds or so, you should see the “INSERT DISK 6” screen. From here press F12 to take you back to the main WinUAE settings screen (the GUI: Graphics User Interface- window) – now in the “Quickstart” menu – go to the “Floppy Drive DF0: (Select Disk Image)” section again, now press the “Eject” tab and then replace “DISK 1” with “DISK 6” (use the arrow tab to the right instead of the “Select disk image “ tab - to find the next disk faster if it’s already been used before) (or you can use the “End + F1” method of swapping disks if you prefer). Now press the “OK” tab at the bottom of the “Quickstart” screen of the GUI to take you back to the game screen (close the GUI)

Step 2:
Now click the “left mouse button” to advance/ confirm the disk swap- it will stay on the same “INSERT DISK 6” screen for around 5-15 seconds or so- then it will change the read out to “INSERT DISK 1”. From here you just repeat the same disk change process but this time replacing with “Disk 1”. Once back to the game screen again - click the “left mouse button” and wait another 5 seconds or so before it changes to the next screen

Step 3:
Now you should see the “In a distant galaxy…” screen – then from here (whether you have clicked the mouse button/ fire button to skip it – or wait out the entire mock Star Wars type intro) it will just go to a black screen.
From here you MUST go back into the GUI - find the “CPU… Chipset “ slider option (Hardware/ CPU/ CPU Emulation Speed) then change the “CPU… Chipset “ slider from “3” to “8” (possibly more/ less depending on your PC specs? But the 8th notch is what works for me) and press “OK” to return to the game screen.
Only then will it change from the black screen – to showing the next disk swap step in the start up process which is : “INSERT DISK 2”.


Step 4 :
Insert “Disk 2” the same way as before
(F12… etc etc) - and when back to the game screen again, click the “left mouse button” to confirm the disk change. Now you will see another black screen.

Step 5:
Press F12 and go back to the “CPU… Chipset “ slider and change it back to the 3rd notch,(again it probably varies for each different PC?) press “OK” to return to the game screen. This should now allow it to load through the black screen a little faster and now you should see the actual Super Stardust game menu / intro screen – from there change the in-game options to your liking and “start game” (press the “fire button” to change options and start game etc)



Note :
No matter what ““CPU… Chipset “ slider” notch I play the game with (the higher the notch mark I use/ further right I go –seems to just make the game slower/ more glitched) – but I still get graphical glitches on the lower/ lowest notches too (Example : In level 1 – when the meteors/asteroids pass over the purple planet – they cause blue square/ pixilated patch glitch trails to appear, and when I press Space Bar to bring up the “Status Display” menu in the game – it shows multiple pixilation glitches as well)

So I may not be using the optimal settings for my particular system if others say they are playing Super Stardust AGA without said glitches ?

And as others have noted; it seems that it’s all about these tiny incremental CPU timing changes with the “ CPU… Chipset “ slider - which determines whether or not you get stuck on a permanent black screen or if you actually get to play the game . So if you keep experiencing the black screens – just keep F12’ing to the GUI, changing the slider one notch up/ down etc, then returning to the game screen and testing to see if you have managed to get the result you are looking for.


Thanks.

[Paul]

Edited thread title with better name

Yeah I really should have done that in the first place, I always appreciate it when people put the specific subject/ game in the title just because it makes topic searches that much easier. I don't know why I went against my own rule, so to speak, in this case?

Thanks

[Mclane]

Glad that people got SS working to it's best potential, sleep got the better of me before I saw posts requesting what config I used.

It's a while since I've seen a 1200 working in the flesh, mine went many years ago with its 68030 8MB card and 80mb (HUGE!!) HD so I didn't see the sprite difference in Stardust from memory. The asteroids animation was fine and the crash at the first level didn't happen for me.

Question tho, are there any other 'super hi-res' sprite games?

[rsn8887]

@newguy99:
Thanks for starting this thread, at least it is figured out now that Super Stardust AGA is working. I remember other posts in other boards claiming it doesn't work, like on lemonamiga...

sidenote: Faster RTG setting is only for Workbench stuff when you use Picasso gfx modes. These are hi-res gfx modes, where UAE emulates an add-on graphics card and can thus use "Picasso" modes like 1024*768 etc. Almost no games use these resolutions, apart from maybe some really late ones that you run from WB. So it should have no relevance for this game whatsoever.

[andreas]

Originally Posted by rsn8887

You are perfectly right, thanks for the hint!
I found the culprit: I used the "fastest possible" setting, as usual. But a quick check with sysinfo showed that, with my current config and machine, I get only ~80% of true A1200 Dhrystone speed. Apparently that is not enough for Stardust. So, if I use "Adjustable between CPU and Chipset" instead and notch the cpu-chipset slider 2 ticks up from CPU, sysinfo reports 112% A1200 speed. And lo and behold, the asteroids look perfect, the game plays perfect.

At score report after first level, I had to fiddle a bit with the slider (the report screen seems to use a lot of the custom chips, so I had to slide it higher temporarily) to get it to accept my firebutton presses.

Awwwww....

Nice for you that it works now, but I reckoned this kind of "fixes" had become obsolete since the release of versions like 0.8.21 already...
CPU->Chipset tweaks originate from 0.7.5R1/0.8.6/0.8.8 times, and I hoped this to be over now after 10 (!) years.

But I remember Toni saying something about CPU timing accuracy in AGA mode still being a bit WIP, so let's hope it will only be a matter of time until this is properly tackled.

Note too that even in 2007, there *ARE* still AGA demos which work on a stock A1200 and which would merely show a pitch-black screen on WinUAE. Some tiny CPU timing problem can determine "works / works not" status in AGA.

[DamienD]

Sorry for the late reply guys, only got back from holidays last Friday and finally started to go through all the threads I've missed...

Hmmm, pretty long thread and a complex solution we have here... I remember it took me quite a lot of time to get Super Stardust AGA running perfectly ages ago.

Last time I tried was using WinUAE v1.0.0 and it really does run well, don't have to change settings throughout the game constantly, sound / graphics are in sync plus none of these other issues rsn8887 or anybody else has talked about i.e.

Originally Posted by rsn8887

1) resolution of overlays (ship and energy meter) is halfed, e.g. they are more pixelated than on real A1200
2) Asteroids flicker and their animation is wrong: looks like two frames are superposed in some weird interlace flicker
3) Crashes after finishing one level, it just hangs at score summary screen

Here are the settings that I use:


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CPU:
CPU Type: 68020 + FPU
More compatible: Ticked
CPU Emualtion Speed: Adjustable between CPU and chipset and slider bar at the far left hand side.

Chipset:
Chipset type: AGA
Collision level: Sprites and Sprites vs. Playfield
Sound emulation: Emulated, 100% accurate

ROM:
Boot ROM File: Kickstart v3.1 (A1200) rev 40.68 (512k)

RAM:
Chip: 2MB
Fast: 4MB

Disk Drives:
DFO: .ipf (Disk 1 of 5)
DF1: .ipf (Disk 2 of 5)

Display:
Screen - Fullscreen: 720x576, 16-Bit
Settings: Full Screen
Line Mode: Scanline

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Another thing to note is that my laptop isn't even that greatly spec'd. It's has the following:

CPU: Mobile Intel Pentium 4 1.80GHz
RAM: 256MB of RAM
Graphics Card: ATI Mobility Radeon 7500
Sound Card: SoundMAX Integrated Digital Audio

...need to try the exact same config in WinUAE 1.3.4 and see how it goes

[rsn8887]

Originally Posted by DamienD

CPU:
CPU Type: 68020 + FPU
More compatible: Ticked
CPU Emualtion Speed: Adjustable between CPU and chipset and slider bar at the far left hand side.

Yep, but I think using the CPU/Chipset slider instead of "fastest possible" fixed almost all my previously mentioned and quoted problems... and I didn't even turn it all the way to the left, as you suggested. That might even fix the fiddling/hanging at end of level screen

[DamienD]

Originally Posted by rsn8887

Yep, but I think using the CPU/Chipset slider instead of "fastest possible" fixed almost all my previously mentioned and quoted problems... and I didn't even turn it all the way to the left, as you suggested. That might even fix the fiddling/hanging at end of level screen

Yup, if I use "fastest possible" the hanging at the start of each level after level 1 occurs. Also in the intro the starfield is not correct... Adjusting the CPU / Chipset slider to any setting I tried fixes this

Also, with the CPU / Chipset slider set to the 3rd or 8th bar from the left I started to see graphics errors with the Asteroids as you've mentioned + with the intro the text either ran too fast / too slow and the sound then had to loop around...

With the CPU / Chipset slider set all the way to the left everything runs perfectly. Of course I'm talking from a WinUAE v1.0.0 perspective, will test in WinUAE v1.3.4 tomorrow