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Old 10 January 2019, 21:12   #1
oguzog
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AMIGA 4000D internal ide cf card size limit?

Amiga 4000D / 060
internal IDE port using for one ide-cf adapter (cheap aliexpress ones) and one cdrom.
Both work well...
Question is can i use 32 GB CF with it?
What i have experienced till now.
Case 1: I start to create a system from scratch using winuae. System ok os3.9 ok boingball's are ok
started to copy games....stuck somewhere else. No matter how many times i boot / try it always stucks or works VERY SLOW.
Case 2: i wanted to do all using native system. put 060 emergncy disk and os3.9 cdrom and boot. It always says "Cache CDFS - Cannot open "scsi.device" unit x"
But if i try with 4GB CF disk it works well and starts to install. same floppy same cd.
What could be wrong?
MY 32GB cf card is bought from amigastore.eu
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Old 14 January 2019, 01:47   #2
grelbfarlk
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oguzog View Post
Amiga 4000D / 060
internal IDE port using for one ide-cf adapter (cheap aliexpress ones) and one cdrom.
Both work well...
Question is can i use 32 GB CF with it?
What i have experienced till now.
Case 1: I start to create a system from scratch using winuae. System ok os3.9 ok boingball's are ok
started to copy games....stuck somewhere else. No matter how many times i boot / try it always stucks or works VERY SLOW.
Case 2: i wanted to do all using native system. put 060 emergncy disk and os3.9 cdrom and boot. It always says "Cache CDFS - Cannot open "scsi.device" unit x"
But if i try with 4GB CF disk it works well and starts to install. same floppy same cd.
What could be wrong?
MY 32GB cf card is bought from amigastore.eu

Yes I have used 32GB cards on the A4000 IDE.

See numerous threads on threads on the 4GB limit.

http://eab.abime.net/showthread.php?t=61666
Look into formatting with PFS.
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Old 17 January 2019, 04:26   #3
ScottJ85
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I've been using a 32GB CF with my A1200 on Kickstart 3.1, I assume it's not much different for a A4000D.
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Old 17 January 2019, 23:09   #4
fgh
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Oguzog: You asked the same question in a facebook group.
I gave a long answer, but you never reponded...
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Old 25 January 2019, 09:12   #5
oguzog
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Oguzog: You asked the same question in a facebook group.
I gave a long answer, but you never reponded...
I haven't noticed it sorry. I've replied.
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Old 07 September 2021, 19:23   #6
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I realize this is an old thread, but I have the same kind of problem. I have been using WINUAE to format 4gb and 8GB CF hard drives for years, but just recently picked up an A4000. I have 3.1.4 kickstart roms, and AmigaOS 3.1.4. I also have made a 3.1.4 install disk that has PFS3AIO on it. I have formatted 32 gb CFs before with the A1200, but with the A4000, the CF automatically goes to "ATA 2+" and even attempting to manually set it to ATA 1 does not work. The 32 gb CF will not format. I am suspicious that certain CF cards may work and others won't. This specific CF is a San Disk Ultra II.


MAKE SURE THE 32gb CF IS ALREADY IN THE READER BEFORE LOADING WHDLOAD!

My typical process is:
1. open Windows DiskPart and find the cf card with "List Disk". Select the disk (identifiable by being near to 30gb, while all other drives are multi TB...), the type clean to remove everything off the CF completely.
2. With the CF completely empty, bring up WINUAE with Admin Rights. Select 68040 for CPU, AGA chipset with A4000, For ROM select the 3.1.4 ROM. (NOTE: This ROM has to be uploaded, as it is not in the typical set of ROMS), Set your RAM, I typically go 8mg fastram, for floppy drives, I have the modified 3.1.4 install disk in DF0: and Workbench in DF1:.
3. When you get to hard drives, click on Add Hard Drive, look for the one identified as UNK (around 29.8gb) and select it, change from "UAE (uaehf.device)" to "Commodore A600/A1200/A4000 IDE". Below ATA-2+ is automatically set. I try to change it to ATA-1, then "Add hard drive", then click on Properties again and sure enough it is set to ATA-2+. I have even tried "Full Drive/RDB mode" and again setting it to ATA-1.

4. Start WINUAE. When you get the Amiga workbench, navigate to HDToolBox.
5. Click on Change Drive Type. Click on "Define New...", and then "Read Configuration", then click "OK", then "OK" again and then "Continue".
6. Click on "Partition Drive". I typically set the first partition to just under 4gb. Click on Advanced Options and click "Add/Update...", so we can set the filesystem to PFS3. Click on "Add New File System", then in the box that comes up, replace "FastFileSystem" with "PFS3AIO" or whatever you have your PFS3 set to in you l: (lower case L folder. For DosType change the typical 0x444F5303 to "0x50465303" version and revision can be left alone. a new line with a Custom File System shows up, with it selected, click "Ok". Now back on the Partitioning screen, click on the "Change..." button directly above the "Add/Update..." one. Click on the "File System:" button until you have selected "PFS/03". Now look for "MaxTransfer" and set it to 0x1fe00. PRESS ENTER or it will not save., now click on "Ok". Make sure you have created a Partition Device Name (I typically go with DH0, DH1, etc...). You can create as many partitions as you want, but at least 1 that is bootable.
7. Click on Ok to finish partitioning. You should now be back to the Hard Drive Preparation screen. Click on "Save Changes to Drive" on the bottom Right to save your new configuration.
8. Now click on "Exit". This often asks for you to confirm and notifies that DH0 will be written over. Sometimes WINUAE notifies you it has to restart. IF it does not, restart anyway!
9. If you did everything correctly, after a few seconds, DH0: will show up. Use Format to make the drive usable, but only use QUICK FORMAT, with a CF hard drive!

In my case, what is happening is that none of the newly partitioned hard drives show up. It's like the drive did not get complete writes to it. Something was changed, but not all apparently. I have done this 7-8 times and it still will not work with 32gb CF cards. I also have used it with Transcend CF cards with the same results.

Am I doing something obviously wrong somewhere?
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Old 07 September 2021, 23:44   #7
Jolabandola
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Try cleaning the CF card with Diskpart and then plug it back in the Amiga and do an install on real hardware instead.
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Old 08 September 2021, 08:57   #8
jbenam
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Not sure about 32GB, but I have most certainly used a SanDisk Extreme Pro 16GB card on my Amiga. Then I saw the huge amount of RAM wasted on such huge partitions and went back to smaller cards.
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Old 08 September 2021, 16:50   #9
Toni Wilen
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It also could be problem with the card reader. It has happened before, reads usually works, writes go nowhere, no errors reported.
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Old 08 September 2021, 16:53   #10
str0m
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Not quite the same setup but I used to get loads of issues with my CD32 and a CF IDE adapter off the TF330. Swapped for an IDE to SD adapter and it's been fine since. I forget the size though. Might be worth trying one as they are so cheap if you have an SD card laying around

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/163522346147
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Old 08 September 2021, 18:42   #11
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So part of this is that larger CF cards don't support 'TrueIDE', so may not work or not work reliably on IDE controllers.

I bought a CF card to SD adapter, and now I'm using a 128gb MicroSD -> SD card -> CF card adapter, and it has been working great.

Just note, that if you have less than 3.1.4 Kickstart, you'll get 'Not a DOS disk' error if you have larger than 2gb partitions. (ran into that on my desktop a4k with SCSI.)
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Old 08 September 2021, 19:32   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by slaapliedje View Post
Just note, that if you have less than 3.1.4 Kickstart, you'll get 'Not a DOS disk' error if you have larger than 2gb partitions. (ran into that on my desktop a4k with SCSI.)
You cannot say this in general. It's possible to have 100gb partitions on Kick 3.1, even on 2.0 or 1.3 if you use the right file system. Especially on a SCSI controller this is possible. IDE might be limited by hardware.
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Old 08 September 2021, 22:08   #13
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You cannot say this in general. It's possible to have 100gb partitions on Kick 3.1, even on 2.0 or 1.3 if you use the right file system. Especially on a SCSI controller this is possible. IDE might be limited by hardware.
Sure, but those are specifics if you happen to have either a newer file system, or like an FastATA, or SCSI. This was about the internal IDE controller.

I try to keep things safe and leave the first partition as less than 1gb. Otherwise swapping kickstarts can be problematic.
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Old 08 September 2021, 22:35   #14
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Originally Posted by slaapliedje View Post
(ran into that on my desktop a4k with SCSI.)
Quote:
Originally Posted by slaapliedje View Post
This was about the internal IDE controller.
Contradicting yourself?
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Old 08 September 2021, 22:44   #15
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Contradicting yourself?
Nope. Original post was about internal IDE. I said I ran into the same issue on the CSPPC as well. Kickstart 3.1 noped out of reading my disk. Pop in 3.2 and it worked fine.
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Old 09 September 2021, 11:35   #16
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I said I ran into the same issue on the CSPPC as well. Kickstart 3.1 noped out of reading my disk. Pop in 3.2 and it worked fine.
But that's your personal fault and not a general issue. The CSPPC is one of the controllers which allows access to the whole harddrive regardless of Kickstart. Actually all third-party controllers are independent of Kickstart regarding their limits. Kickstart version can only affect controllers which use drivers contained in the Kick ROM and partitions which use file systems contained in the Kick ROM. The latter case can be bypassed if you add the relevant file system to the RDB. This is a best practice anyway.
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Old 09 September 2021, 15:16   #17
slaapliedje
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Access to the whole hard drive via the controller and having access to the full filesystem if it is larger than 2gb is clearly two different things.

Without changing anything except the kickstart going from 3.1 to 3.2 it would go from not working to working, and this was for an SSD that was formatted under 3.1.4. So sure, you can put stuff on the RDB, but something in the kickstart can still muck with your happiness.

At least this has been the experience I have had while messing with the CSPPC and switching between the SCSI, internal IDE and FastATA board, and various kickstarts to try and get my system to be stable.
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Old 09 September 2021, 16:25   #18
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Originally Posted by slaapliedje View Post
kickstart going from 3.1 to 3.2 it would go from not working to working
I'd rather say that going from 3.2 to 3.1 would set it from working to not working, because you partitioned the harddrive in a way which is not backwards compatible. Of course 3.1.4 and 3.2 now have some support for large harddrives which was not available in 3.1. It was advertised like this. But you could add that support in 3.1 easily. For 3.1 this is just the same as adding a third-party file system. It's not a patch or a hack, it's just using a function which was made for this purpose. You just skipped this step and suffered from its consequences.
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Old 09 September 2021, 20:29   #19
slaapliedje
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I'd rather say that going from 3.2 to 3.1 would set it from working to not working, because you partitioned the harddrive in a way which is not backwards compatible. Of course 3.1.4 and 3.2 now have some support for large harddrives which was not available in 3.1. It was advertised like this. But you could add that support in 3.1 easily. For 3.1 this is just the same as adding a third-party file system. It's not a patch or a hack, it's just using a function which was made for this purpose. You just skipped this step and suffered from its consequences.
Fair point, bouncing between testing kickstarts and hard drives it is easy enough to get confused. But I do not ever make the first partition larger than 2gb, so something funky was going on with my set up.
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