Amstrad CPC, much better than I thought it would be!

You must look at software comparisons too The Spectrum versions of Outrun, Chase HQ and Enduro Racer left the other versions in the cold, The Amstrad CPC 464 version of Outrun LOOKS like it is quite a contender until you play it. The C-64 version is a complete joke and the Speccy 128k comes out as the best racer with detailed graphics, the arcade sound ported to the 128k machines perfectly and single load instead of multiload on the 128k version. I would please ask anybody to play Enduro Racer on the spectrum and THEN play the other 8 bit versions so you can make your own mind up about the good old speccy. The proof is in the pudding there was a vast difference in quality AND quality when it came to the spectrum the facts are all there. The C-64 only ran at 1mhz so the video capabilities were not as much use as they could have been. Sound sound sound ye ok but the C64 was only beating spectrum owners for a couple of years as the introduction of the 128k speccys had an AY chip installed basically the same sound capabilities as the Atari ST. I owned all three of the main 8 bits in the early days C-64/Spectrum128+2 and an Amstrad and I sold the Amstrad and C64 at the end of the 80's and kept my 128+2 as no mater how many times I debatedin my own head I knew which machine gave me REAL value entertainment with games that really did play, on the whole to me The Sinclair ZX Spectrum didn't break any promises.

[s2325]

C64 have best version of Cisco Heat [ Show youtube player ]

[roy bates]

Originally Posted by s2325

C64 have best version of Cisco Heat [ Show youtube player ]

i was nearly sick watching that and i like the c64.

[lilalurl]

Are there lists of exclusive (respectively) c64 and ZX games?
In the same way that we have a list of ST exclusive games:
http://eab.abime.net/retrogaming-gen...ive-games.html

Preferably sieving between those worth a try and the others.

[s2325]

I think there is no such list as both computers have too much exclusives. Just play and don't trust reviews.

[vulture]

I'm pretty much on the same boat. For all its (mainly color) limitations, the 128k speccy was the machine that gave me more enjoyment out of the three by a large margin. Can't quite put my finger on it, I guess it was the detailed black/white art or the bigger resolution compared to C64 and CPC, but - ultimately - probably the speccy programmers just got the right idea about how the gameplay should be most of the time.

Originally Posted by fusedplug

You must look at software comparisons too The Spectrum versions of Outrun, Chase HQ and Enduro Racer left the other versions in the cold, The Amstrad CPC 464 version of Outrun LOOKS like it is quite a contender until you play it. The C-64 version is a complete joke and the Speccy 128k comes out as the best racer with detailed graphics, the arcade sound ported to the 128k machines perfectly and single load instead of multiload on the 128k version. I would please ask anybody to play Enduro Racer on the spectrum and THEN play the other 8 bit versions so you can make your own mind up about the good old speccy. The proof is in the pudding there was a vast difference in quality AND quality when it came to the spectrum the facts are all there. The C-64 only ran at 1mhz so the video capabilities were not as much use as they could have been. Sound sound sound ye ok but the C64 was only beating spectrum owners for a couple of years as the introduction of the 128k speccys had an AY chip installed basically the same sound capabilities as the Atari ST. I owned all three of the main 8 bits in the early days C-64/Spectrum128+2 and an Amstrad and I sold the Amstrad and C64 at the end of the 80's and kept my 128+2 as no mater how many times I debatedin my own head I knew which machine gave me REAL value entertainment with games that really did play, on the whole to me The Sinclair ZX Spectrum didn't break any promises.

[JonB]

A classic example is Manic Miner. On the Spectrum it is playable, very playable, whereas on the CPC6128 it is so slow and jerky it actually makes the music off beat.

I don't know if this is down to the machine or the conversion, but I was very sad to see it.. awful. I bet those 6128 owners felt seriously short changed...

[s2325]

It's conversion fault, not machine. Some developers knew how to use CPC, look at Super Cauldron [ Show youtube player ]

[Retro-Nerd]

The whole point it: Even if you can work around these limitations of 8bit Computers, and push the hardware to their limits, it's often not a good game at all. Chase HQ e.g. is a crappy 8bit game, even the so called masterpiece on the Spectrum. It's unplayable shit, barely average in 16bit ports. Only the late 1:1 Sega Saturn version shows real playability.

Mostly the best games are these games that were originally designed for the specific hardware, not some ports. And then you still have to see it in the right perspective. As i said above. Even if it's pushed to/over the hardware limits, it's not always a good game. And you can see it more often in Spectrum/CPC games than C64 games for sure.

A good friend of mine had a cpc when we were kids, and I've always had a soft spot for the system. It was capable of some quality games, but there was definitely a tendency to dump old speccy ports on there and leave it at that.

Personally I'd say it had the best colour palette of any of the 8-bit micros, and was capable of great-looking games in the right hands(Contra/Gryzor and Operation Wolf look great, for example). The only problem was with how vibrant the palette was, it was very easy for someone without much idea what they were doing to to make it look absolutely monstrous.

[Fissuras]

ZX-81 all the way!

[s2325]

Example of speech synthesis: [ Show youtube player ]

[s2325]

Chase H.Q. II for Atari ST have similar problem as Cisco Heat for C64 - scrolling is too choppy to be playable.

[s2325]

Jim Power for Amstrad CPC [ Show youtube player ] I think game wasn't finished as you can not shoot in few places and music may be place holder. This version have built-in trainer but checkpoints are more rare than on Amiga. Gameplay is not smooth and spikes have only one frame of animation, like in Rick Dangerous. Enemy can respawn on you.

[tekopaa]

CPC games are using max 30% of screen and still laggy? CPC was ok for slideshows and basic. Commodore64 for music and games .

[dlfrsilver]

Originally Posted by tekopaa

CPC games are using max 30% of screen and still laggy? CPC was ok for slideshows and basic. Commodore64 for music and games .

it took quite a time for coders to use correctly the CPC.

I own a C64, and on this machine you must choose carefully the games you want to play in order to be not disappointed.

Many C64 games have rubbish graphics (after all, video games are about video right ? ), so before buying one need to check if the game is pleasant to look at

[DisposableHero]

In all honesty the CPC suffered from Lame Spectrum Ports to a greater extent than the Amiga suffered from Lame ST Ports - by the time enough programmers realised it was superior hardware, the 16-bits had come along and the CPC wasn't cutting edge anymore. Stuff like Zap't'Balls, Prehistorik 2 and Bunny Bricks go far beyond what a Spectrum could do on a technical level, and give the C64 a run for its money. Had it been released 6 months after the Spectrum and not 2 years, things may have been different.

It did so well in France partly because they used a different video standard to the rest of Europe, meaning that an unmodified Spectrum or C64 could only display in monochrome on a normal French TV, so the cost of the Amstrad's inbuilt monitor was nullified.

[Retro-Nerd]

Many C64 games have rubbish graphics (after all, video games are about video right ? ), so before buying one need to check if the game is pleasant to look at

It's about playability, level design, controls, smooth scrolling and then a last graphics and music. And especially in the first 4 mentioned categories the CPC sucks for action games often enough. The better Plus models came out when the system was already dead.

[dlfrsilver]

Originally Posted by Retro-Nerd

It's about playability, level design, controls, smooth scrolling and then a last graphics and music. And especially in the first 4 mentioned categories the CPC sucks for action games often enough. The better Plus models came out when the system was already dead.

I'm sorry, but to me a game with playabilty, level design (on 8 bits machines ? don't make me laugh !), controls, smooth scrolling and shit graphics is equivalent to the chocolate offered for christmas.

All the ingredients are quality, and when you taste the chocolate, it taste like shit.

It's useless to have a 50 fps scrolling, playability and shit graphics.

I have tried quite a number of game on my own C64, and god oh god,
most of the time, only the music saves the games.

I own Golden Axe and Robocop 3. Both have awesome and beyond the walls musics, but for fuck sake, the graphics are a torture, how to have pleasure with visually it's so dark, grey, brown poop, pee pee yellow ?

Hand me a gun, i shot myself in the head !

I prefer an 8 bit game with modest pretentions as well as beautiful graphics and correct sound, correct playability than a "jerk-fest" running at 50 fps with parallax scrolling and colors for the blind !

It's the same on amiga, i don't understand C64 lovers blaming the amstrad for its vivid colors, when the amiga also offers vivid colors and not the shit color palette range from the c64.

I love games with beautiful graphics, and i don't give any credit to a game using 50 frames per seconds, with great music and good playability and shot down by rubbish graphics.

To me it's like inviting me in a great restaurant and then pooping in my plate.

It's a torture to play a game painted or drawed by a blind graphist which only know brown and grey

[dlfrsilver]

Originally Posted by DisposableHero

In all honesty the CPC suffered from Lame Spectrum Ports to a greater extent than the Amiga suffered from Lame ST Ports - by the time enough programmers realised it was superior hardware, the 16-bits had come along and the CPC wasn't cutting edge anymore. Stuff like Zap't'Balls, Prehistorik 2 and Bunny Bricks go far beyond what a Spectrum could do on a technical level, and give the C64 a run for its money. Had it been released 6 months after the Spectrum and not 2 years, things may have been different.

It did so well in France partly because they used a different video standard to the rest of Europe, meaning that an unmodified Spectrum or C64 could only display in monochrome on a normal French TV, so the cost of the Amstrad's inbuilt monitor was nullified.

About France and c64, let me tell you how things really happened :

1) the c64 was sold in the biggest hypermarkets in France

2) It was overly expensive compared to what it could bring to the final user.

3) It was seen as a toy, when the CPC was seen as a family computer

4) Most people don't give a fuck about computers needing a monitor not sold with them

5) the horrible color palette of the C64 was a full repelant for most users, when my own father had to choose between the CPC and C64, not only the price was irrealist, but he thought that the colors were really crap, like million other people here.

The C64 had oldish graphics, and the CPC brought really better overall graphics, and had tons of peripherals, and a great support.

6) Next the CPC got an immense support from the engineers in companies throught all the country.

In France, engineers made so much for the CPC that the c64 got killed and removed from the shops.

For 1 c64 sold, more than 50 CPC were sold. Things went so bad for Commodore France that they almost went bankrupt, and were saved by the Amiga, with which they did not made the same mistake :

They sold a balanced computer, with vivid colors and hardware scroll and awesome sound for the right price.