DamienD's WinUAE Collection - [720x576] Old vs New Scanlines

DamienD · 11 October 2018, 20:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by WallyGR

Thanx Damien! I am eager to try the new update

Sorry for bringing this up again but...
If we know which games are 640*480 and which are 720*576, I THINK we can work out a scanline configuration for each resolution and apply it in accordingly...can't we?

Quote:

Originally Posted by DamienD

I can definitely tell you how to work out which games are 640x480 or 720x576

Just use Notepad++, "Search" --> "Find in Files", then for "Find what:" enter "gfx_width_fullscreen=720". This gives you a list of all 720x576 configurations...

I did play round with creating a custom "scanlines" like mask and things looked ok when used with only 720x576 games and there was no tearing as opposed to when setting "1:2".

When I'm home tonight I'll give you details to see what you think

Sorry for the delay WallyGR, been busy doing other tasks...

Here's what I came up with, again it's by no means perfect but; at least the scanlines are consistent and there's no tearing.

To test you need to do the following:

Download the attached and extract into "C:\WinUAE\Plugins\masks".
Load a game that has a resolution of 720x576 applied.
Select "Filter", next to "Masks", change "None" --> "720x576_Scanlines.png".
Under "Extra Settings" select "Scanline opacity" and set as "0".

The big question is, does the above look better than the current settings for 720x576 games?

DamienD · 11 October 2018, 23:50

Yeah all good man

To be honest; I'm very interested in what people who keep scanlines on i.e. the default setting in my collection; think about post #1288.

I've been testing numerous 720x576 games and think that I may swap to this... but I would really like people to test / give feedback first as it's quite a big change and will affect all of you so...

Feedback please

ransom1122 · 12 October 2018, 01:20

Scanlines Test

New

Vs

Old

New looks better more brighter and less dull with that scanline feel.

dragon57 · 12 October 2018, 03:42

Another vote for the new way.

WallyGR · 12 October 2018, 08:41

Damien I would love to participate in a scanlines testing.

Believe it or not, I cannot play games in LCD if a (correct) scanline shader or effect is not present.

Best way to test is in monochrome light coloured screenings (eg a light blue workbench screen)

DamienD · 12 October 2018, 09:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by ransom1122

Scanlines Test

New

Vs

Old

New looks better more brighter and less dull with that scanline feel.

Unfortunately the old way doesn't look like this though, wish it did as then I wouldn't be messing around...

When you take screenshots it's before the 720x576 "scaling" so the scanlines are even; just like when in "Windowed" mode.

Have a look at the old way when in "Fullscreen" and you'll notice that the scanlines are not even at all.

ransom1122 · 12 October 2018, 09:27

Can you throw up a workbench desktop old and new?

DamienD · 12 October 2018, 09:33

You can't capture this in a screenshot unfortunately...

Best way to see the old method / uneven scanlines is to start a 720x576 game and immediately pause emulation while the grey screens are flicking through. You'll then see what WallyGR has been talking about.

You don't really notice that much when in-game screens are present unless you look really hard.

Afterwards do the same with the new method to compare.

ransom1122 · 12 October 2018, 10:33

Oh well I gave it a try and...

Deluxe Galaga [AGA] - Grey loading screen

New

Old

New - Looks more even....

But that's an opinion from a guy who generally plays with no scanlines

malko · 12 October 2018, 11:04

Not easy to see something without playing with the orientation of the screen

DamienD · 12 October 2018, 11:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by ransom1122

Oh well I gave it a try and...

Deluxe Galaga [AGA] - Grey loading screen

<snip>

New - Looks more even....

But that's an opinion from a guy who generally plays with no scanlines

This screen is too dark to see anything.

Best to pause emulation on a very light grey, pure white or light blue screen to see the issue.

Anyway, again, you cannot capture this in a screenshot... the scanlines look even there.

You can only see it when in "Fullscreen" mode.

speshady · 12 October 2018, 23:34

Sorry, i prefer the old. New appears to look blockier than the old.
Maybe its just my eyesight though...

dax · 13 October 2018, 01:12

New is better. Thanks for the improvement, Damien

WallyGR · 13 October 2018, 09:26

Silly question ahead:
I cannot find the "new". Damien can you post an old and a new config of a 720*576 game so I can test and post workbench pictures tested in 1080p display?

Thanx!

EDIT:SORRY I HAVE JUST NOTICED THERE WAS AN ATTACHMENT!

honx · 13 October 2018, 11:40

can i download old mask somewhere to be able to compare?
in first post there is only the new one attached.

Specksynder · 13 October 2018, 18:04

New.

DamienD · 14 October 2018, 14:15

Quote:

Originally Posted by speshady

Sorry, i prefer the old. New appears to look blockier than the old.
Maybe its just my eyesight though...

I know what you mean, the new scanlines are like double scanlines but it's the only way I could get them to look consistent.

DamienD · 14 October 2018, 14:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by honx

can i download old mask somewhere to be able to compare?
in first post there is only the new one attached.

I didn't use any masks previously, just the scanlines via "Filters" set at 50% opacity.

WallyGR · 14 October 2018, 19:02

The 1000 Miglia game is excellent for testing scanlines.
After the boot,the game displays a red screen with the (crack?) team info where you are stuck unless you press the mouse button.

I have tested all available masks, and Damien's is the best choice.

Surely not the perfect scanlines BUT WAY BETTER than the uneven thing that comes with the default settings (that is excellent for 640*480 games).

I have tested in a 1080p display.

I vote the New config and I will be very happy if Damien can post a new set of configs for the 720*576 games.

honx · 14 October 2018, 22:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by DamienD

I didn't use any masks previously, just the scanlines via "Filters" set at 50% opacity.

okay, that's similar to what i'm using (40% opacity).

View Poll Results: Scanlines for 720x576 games - should I stick with the old or the new method?
Old	3	11.54%
New	11	42.31%
Not sure really	3	11.54%
Don't use scanlines	9	34.62%
Voters: 26. You may not vote on this poll

11 October 2018, 23:50	#2
DamienD Banned Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: London / Sydney Age: 47 Posts: 20,420	DamienD's WinUAE Collection - Old vs New Scanlines Yeah all good man To be honest; I'm very interested in what people who keep scanlines on i.e. the default setting in my collection; think about post #1288. I've been testing numerous 720x576 games and think that I may swap to this... but I would really like people to test / give feedback first as it's quite a big change and will affect all of you so... Feedback please

13 October 2018, 09:26	#14
WallyGR Registered User Join Date: Sep 2018 Location: Athens Greece Posts: 17	Silly question ahead: I cannot find the "new". Damien can you post an old and a new config of a 720576 game so I can test and post workbench pictures tested in 1080p display? Thanx! EDIT:SORRY I HAVE JUST NOTICED THERE WAS AN ATTACHMENT!* Last edited by WallyGR; 13 October 2018 at 10:51.

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12 October 2018, 01:20	#3
ransom1122 Registered User Join Date: Aug 2011 Location: Omnicorp Age: 45 Posts: 5,812	Scanlines Test New Vs Old New looks better more brighter and less dull with that scanline feel.

12 October 2018, 03:42	#4
dragon57 Registered User Join Date: Dec 2017 Location: East Tennessee, USA Posts: 24	Another vote for the new way.

12 October 2018, 08:41	#5
WallyGR Registered User Join Date: Sep 2018 Location: Athens Greece Posts: 17	Damien I would love to participate in a scanlines testing. Believe it or not, I cannot play games in LCD if a (correct) scanline shader or effect is not present. Best way to test is in monochrome light coloured screenings (eg a light blue workbench screen)

12 October 2018, 09:27	#7
ransom1122 Registered User Join Date: Aug 2011 Location: Omnicorp Age: 45 Posts: 5,812	Can you throw up a workbench desktop old and new?

12 October 2018, 09:33	#8
DamienD Banned Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: London / Sydney Age: 47 Posts: 20,420	You can't capture this in a screenshot unfortunately... Best way to see the old method / uneven scanlines is to start a 720x576 game and immediately pause emulation while the grey screens are flicking through. You'll then see what WallyGR has been talking about. You don't really notice that much when in-game screens are present unless you look really hard. Afterwards do the same with the new method to compare.

12 October 2018, 10:33	#9
ransom1122 Registered User Join Date: Aug 2011 Location: Omnicorp Age: 45 Posts: 5,812	Oh well I gave it a try and... Deluxe Galaga [AGA] - Grey loading screen New Old New - Looks more even.... But that's an opinion from a guy who generally plays with no scanlines

12 October 2018, 11:04	#10
malko Ex nihilo nihil Join Date: Oct 2017 Location: CH Posts: 4,856	Not easy to see something without playing with the orientation of the screen

12 October 2018, 23:34	#12
speshady Registered User Join Date: Jan 2018 Location: currently in Glasgow, from Derbyshire/England Age: 50 Posts: 172	Sorry, i prefer the old. New appears to look blockier than the old. Maybe its just my eyesight though...

13 October 2018, 01:12	#13
dax Registered User Join Date: Dec 2015 Location: Warsaw Posts: 74	New is better. Thanks for the improvement, Damien

13 October 2018, 11:40	#15
honx Registered User Join Date: Oct 2014 Location: Klagenfurt / Austria Posts: 1,559	can i download old mask somewhere to be able to compare? in first post there is only the new one attached.

13 October 2018, 18:04	#16
Specksynder Registered User Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Italy Age: 47 Posts: 445	New.

14 October 2018, 19:02	#19
WallyGR Registered User Join Date: Sep 2018 Location: Athens Greece Posts: 17	The 1000 Miglia game is excellent for testing scanlines. After the boot,the game displays a red screen with the (crack?) team info where you are stuck unless you press the mouse button. I have tested all available masks, and Damien's is the best choice. Surely not the perfect scanlines BUT WAY BETTER than the uneven thing that comes with the default settings (that is excellent for 640480 games). I have tested in a 1080p display. I vote the New config and I will be very happy if Damien can post a new set of configs for the 720576 games.

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