Request for V2 600 Users [Keyboard simultaneous button detection]

[rjd324]

Just wondering if someone who is using a V2 for the 600 run the program in The Zone: test_w_a_s_d.lha; executable in "main".

Can you detect multiple simultaneous key presses?

Reason for request: On my setup, a V2 600 w/ PCKey 600, when I play games like Duke3d/Quake I cannot move forward and strafe at the sametime. Using that program, I cannot get both W and A/D to appear at the same time. So, it is either the V2, PC Key or keyboard. My 600 is towered, and I use a PC Key 600 and I have tried this test with both an Amiga Technologies 4000 / Amiga 2000 keyboard.

I am suspecting the PCKey at this point.

Thank you.

[patrik]

Does it matter if you have a Vampire or not for this test?

[Daedalus]

It's a design limitation of the A600 (and A1200) design. The keyboard controller and keyboard matrix design mean it cannot detect certain multiple keypress combinations. A quick Google of the PCKey 600 looks like it plugs into the A600 keyboard ribbon connector. Thus it has the same limitations as the actual matrix it emulates, and there's nothing that adaptors like this one can do to get around it.

To get around that limit, you need to use an external keyboard that connects to the keyboard data signals, not the matrix signals. These typically clip over the keyboard controller chip or one of the CIAs, and can handle the key rollovers you need. If you're any good at soldering, an adaptor from an Amiga keyboard like the 2000 or 4000 can easily be made since they use the very same signals in their connector that the A600 uses on its motherboard between the keyboard controller chip and the CIA, so no chips are needed.

[Jope]

The A600's keyboard controller is 6570 based and handles NKRO like other Amiga keyboards.

The A1200 has a 68HC05 based controller, and it seems they rewrote the firmware instead of porting the previous behaviour. As a result, the A1200 is much worse at reading the matrix than any other Amiga.

Guessing time: my guess is, that the PC-Key shares code between the A600 and A1200 versions, since the keyboard matrices are not that different. Because they had to accommodate for the A1200's keyboard controller's quirks, the PC-Key eats quick/simultaneous key presses.

[sean_sk]

Originally Posted by Daedalus

To get around that limit, you need to use an external keyboard that connects to the keyboard data signals, not the matrix signals. These typically clip over the keyboard controller chip or one of the CIAs, and can handle the key rollovers you need.

Unless I've mistaken what you're talking about, I'm not sure this is necessarily the case. I ordered one of these for the A600:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/17388891997...wAAOSwtfhYs-Jz

and I still have the same issue where I cannot use multiple keys at the same time on the external keyboard. I also have one for the A1200 and same issue. It's a little frustrating.

[Daedalus]

Sorry, my mistake regarding the difference in controllers between the A1200 and A600.

However, the USB adaptor you have there does indeed connect to the keyboard clock and data lines, thus bypassing the controller on the motherboard and taking that out of the equation. The issue can therefore only be in the adaptor or the keyboard itself. The keyboard is unlikely to be the issue (and can easily be tested on another machine), so my guess is that it's simply not supported by the adaptor's firmware.

[sean_sk]

Originally Posted by Daedalus

The issue can therefore only be in the adaptor or the keyboard itself. The keyboard is unlikely to be the issue (and can easily be tested on another machine), so my guess is that it's simply not supported by the adaptor's firmware.

Yeah the USB wireless keyboard isn't the issue. Like you say, it's quite likely the USB keyboard adapter that's the issue. But the frustrating part is that I can't know that for sure as I have mentioned this to the vendor on a number of occasions with zero acknowledgment from them. Their firmware update software is never able to contact their update server because it's never online.

You only have to check their comments section of this Youtube video to see how many people have complained about not being able to update their adapters.

[ Show youtube player ]

They're customer service is completely and utterly incompetent.

[Daedalus]

Ah yes, that figures then...

[rjd324]

So. Perhaps not using the pc key and using the lyra 3 with an amiga keyboard will be better ?

[rjd324]

For closure: the Lyra 3 solves this problem.

[rjd324]

I forgot to add: [ Show youtube player ]

Here is a link to a video about the PCKey vs Lyra 3. I also noticed that the lyra 3, when hacked to be compatible with the A600 also allows the numerical keypad on larger keyboards but didn't realise until after the video!

No more complaining about flight sim not working. (I think it was flight sim that you couldn't use on the 600 because it needed the numerical keys. Don't know, never actually played it!)