Final Assault working version

[SquawkBox]

I know, but last time I loaded their version of Garrison, I noticed the following : if you pick up a character from a race then one from another race, they all look the same when popping up in the play area. A case of bad crack, if I am not mistaken ? That's why I said it's sometimes a better idea to pick up the original when no proper scene version exist.

[dlfrsilver]

Originally Posted by SquawkBox

Ho ho save your breath, I am not going to argue for the sake of it. Here's a better idea : With a cool head, load HFE v3 of World Games in one of your equipped with Gotek miggies and be edified. Yup, no joy!

All right, long story short, support of Herndon HLS copy protection in FF / HxC is most likely incomplete. It's not up to you (nor to me) to say if current version of FF is "good enough" for owners of machines bearing KS 1.3 and 1 MB chip. J-F is now aware of potential issue pertaining to his software with said protection hopefully. He'll make up his mind whether it's worth the trouble fixing it in next release of HxC or not.

He Ho He ho off to work we go, he ho he ho he ho

Of course World Games doesn't work, it requires a kickstart v1.2.

I will try again to tell it to you with simple words :

The problem is not due to Flashfloppy protection support of HLS herndon !

Let me explain about the HLS herndon :

This is simply an AmigaDOS longtrack, that a standard amiga drive can't copy or reproduce.
This track is checked by a routine that verifies the length of the track.

This is the most simple copy protection on disk. It's as stupid as the protec $4454 longtrack protection, the routine checks the length of the track.

what you must understand is that for example, for Final Assault, once the protection track access or encryption is removed, what is remaining ?

All the problems of compatibility related to the kickstart ! for final assault, it's not specifically the demo that needs a kickstart 1.2, but also the game behind, and it will crash if you use a Kickstart 1.3.

The problem is due to the fact that you use an A500 with KS 1.3 instead of a KS 1.2 !

I can't try that on my A500, because i don't have a KS 1.2, and this does not interest me.

Jeff won't be able to fix anything, because the HLS herndon protection is not the problem. Your kickstart is !

And sorry but i have tested enough protected games with HFE v3, and 99% of them pass. (except ISS, but it's not a FF problem, it's due to the game programming).

For once and for all : the HFE v3 format handles 99% of the protected amiga games, Atari ST games, Amstrad CPC games.

Simply because this format is a bit by bit format. Everything is in there.

[jotd]

All the problems of compatibility related to the kickstart ! for final assault, it's not specifically the demo that needs a kickstart 1.2, but also the game behind, and it will crash if you use a Kickstart 1.3.

but but ... I created the whdload install of Final Assault (HLS, double encrypted exe) running on kickstart 1.3. You mean World Games right? confused...

[dlfrsilver]

Originally Posted by jotd

but but ... I created the whdload install of Final Assault (HLS, double encrypted exe) running on kickstart 1.3. You mean World Games right? confused...

World Games is also possibly locked if it is the NTSC release.

But i stand my words : if the protection pass for 2 games, it will pass for 4 or 6. The HLS herndon exist in only one version, it's a generic serial longtrack track.

next for using HFE v3 correctly, flash floppy must be at least in Rev 3.13 minimum.

EDIT : i tried under winuae both games, they run with kick 1.2 and 1.3. World games has a specificity : it requires to be write deprotected at all times.
Now, i will try with my A500+gotek FF 3.1x+512k.

Let's see the result......

[SquawkBox]

Originally Posted by dlfrsilver

for using HFE v3 correctly, flash floppy must be at least in Rev 3.13 minimum

I use latest version (v3.28 stable), please check picture underneath.

Let's see the result.....

No need to create tension around that proposal of yours, support for Herndon HLS in FlashFloppy is indeed incomplete, fact. Why ? Because if it incomplete in HxC. Why ? Because no one had told Jean-Francois about lack of proper emulation of the Herndon HLS copy protection scheme before I did. Why is he still hesitant to be dealing with the issue ? Simply put, because none of us is running HxC (nothing wrong with that, but ideally, regular users of FF should not forget that FF is based on HxC, it didn't pop up out of nowhere). Once again, normal procedure in J-F view is to post about such issues in his forum, check this thread for example :
https://torlus.com/floppy/forum/viewtopic.php?t=889

See ? He swiftly fixes (well, it took a couple of months in this case) such issues each time some of his customers raise one, but, unlike most folks at the head of a project on EAB, he doesn't feel the need brag about it here (and it may not always be reflected in the change log). Basically, he fixes issues he was able to reproduces then moves on. FF is not a finished product, nor is HxC. There's still room for improvement INCLUDING improving copy protection workarounds. You might consider 99% success rate is "good enough" for the average Joe, but don't assume everyone else is in the same boat. Now, ISS is a wholly different beast, Jean-Francois had agreed to share his results in the thread I created by then, but only to conclude that I would run into less problems if I had installed HxC instead of FF in the first place, which of course is a hasty conclusion.

In closing, I can assure you no single Amiga owner could manage to run the games I mentioned from original (namely World Games, California Games [1445] and Final Assault) from Gotek, the matter at stake is to polish / improve support of Herndon HLS from Gotek, and again that's up to Jean-Francois to examine the issues I raised here, and by emailing him about it, even though it's understood he'd rather discuss these in HIS forum with HIS customers.

Believe it or not, it's not a matter of PAL vs NTSC release, 1 MB chip vs 0.5 MB chip, 1.2 KS vs 1.3 KS etc.... I would argue that only the following test would prove conclusive : Write back any of these three games to floppy and you will see, no problem at all to load each of them, be it from a plain 1.3 KS machine or even from a fancier miggy presumably! He who owns a Greaseweasel (is that the correct name ? I mean the required equipment to write back an IPF to floppy) may give it a try. I will eat my humble pie if proven wrong!

[dlfrsilver]

I have wrote to Keir Fraser, asking for help on the HLS Herndon

[SquawkBox]

False alarm, those games do work when IPF gets converted to v1 HFE. Thanks for your help. So v3 HFE isn't de facto standard format for IPF after all, I thought it had superseded v1.

[SquawkBox]

Originally Posted by SquawkBox

I know, but last time I loaded their version of Garrison, I noticed the following : if you pick up a character from a race then one from another race, they all look the same when popping up in the play area. A case of bad crack, if I am not mistaken ?

http://eab.abime.net/showthread.php?t=9634
https://torlus.com/floppy/forum/viewtopic.php?t=3217
So basically, the copy protection of both Garrison opus prevented the SPS team from imaging the game properly AND the scene crackers from cracking the game properly ? All right, acknowledged. I'll play it from emulation then.