Sinbad and the Throne of the Falcon - Different Versions

[demoniac]

I finished the Amiga version of Sinbad recently. I never have spent more than 10 minutes on this game before. Once I figured out how game's interface, it became quite easy. I also gotten used to the graphics.

While looking some of the game internals, the file SinbadW on Reel 1 referenced "The Friendly Dolphin". I don't see the creature being referenced anywhere else, so I imagine it got cut out of the final game.

[ImmortalA1000]

Originally Posted by demoniac

I believe Bob Jacob said that his favorite version of Defender of the Crown was the ST as it was the most polished. I only played it a couple of times, but it has Greek fire and disease catapult options, plus one can add more catapults for combat. The character strengths and weaknesses are more balanced like the C64, IIRC. I didn't play it more than a few times as I'm more familiar with the Amiga version and the differences didn't stand out that much.

Likewise, I played Defender of the Crown II a few times and actually liked the original game better. Maybe the game loading time took longer? I think the strategy changed a little as well.

That is my C64 footage on my youtube channel linked to in the first post so thanks for that

Not that long ago I actually wrestled with the question of whether I prefer the C64/ST modified Defender of the Crown vs the original Amiga version. I decided that it depends on whether you are a strategy/RPG gamer or an arcade gamer. Personally I find the 'enhanced' ST/C64 version much more annoying now because it is more difficult and it seems more unfair. Back then if you had an Amiga 1000 you were probably working to fund such lovely purchases which means you didn't have days and days to crack games. I like that if you know what to do you can finish the game in about 15-20 minutes on the Amiga and that suits me fine because I am more interested in the atmosphere the game generated via graphics/sound/story rather than the challenge.

Some people prefer the ST/C64 changes some prefer the less obtuse Amiga original version. There is no better/worse version of DotC. I was extremely impressed with DotC on the ST though when I got it in 1987, they did a good job of making the best of the lower spec ST hardware, even the sound isn't grating (unlike Johnathan Dunn's utterly pathetic ST music for Batman the Movie, heard better music in STOS games!!).

Those early Cinemaware games were an experience I think, there's nothing stopping you playing the game in a different way with different character etc on Amiga

[demoniac]

About 8 months ago, I played and finished the Amiga version. I never seriously played the game until then.

Last week, I completed the ST version and found the following changes.

differences:
Amiga: intro shows the palace with the falcon Caliph
ST: intro has Sinbad on a ship
Amiga: UI is all mouse driven and requires right mouse press to perform actions
ST: originally all joystick based and uses signposts for movement into a different location
Amiga: cyclopes have invidual names and different backgrounds
ST: I believe the backgrounds are the same for all the cyclopes (didn't spend more than a few seconds on the 2nd cyclops encounter to note properly)
ST: cyclops encounters start with an action travel sequence with bats, snakes, raptors, and scorpions before rescuing crew
ST: fight difficulty is much easier; many encounters one could stand at a spot without being hit most of the time
ST: Black Prince (Camaral) and Prince Jamoul are both seemly treated as a single Black Prince character despite few text passages showing their individual names
ST: Black Prince troops still attack after killing the prince and the dead prince's name will show up when his troops take over Damaron
Amiga: sprite sizes fill up about half the screen
ST: map locations are different
naming of yeti (ST) vs. sasquash (Amiga)

missing:
ST: various sequences do not contain unique music
ST: location backgrounds; Amiga contain more than signpost
ST: animation
ST: Prince Harun
ST: questing party option (Prince Harun, Princess Sylphani, Gypsy, Libitina and Shaman can join on Amiga)
ST: Libitina dialog
ST: Gypsy dialog
ST: fountain
ST: less destinations and directional paths due to smaller world size
ST: demon lynx, lion, black panther, Ghaax sequence, griffin sequence
Amiga: centaur
ST: different earthquake level maps as background seems the same
ST: Black Prince fight sequence when palace is attacked
ST: Black Prince victory screen
ST: explanation of Black Prince's relationship and Libitina's
ST: Libitina's aftermath screen
ST: pteranoxos victory screen and gain of a sailor
ST: different idol sprites
ST: pirate battle screen
ST: load and save feature
ST: special ending without save and cast credits with thanks from Bill Williams
ST: rating on a scale of 1-100

I was quite surprized at the amount of change. The ST version contains around 70% of the Amiga release features. As a result, gameplay is also approximately 30% less difficult. The ST closeup NPC graphics stylistically are better along with the navigation enhancements, but those are about the only improvements over the Amiga version. I wasn't fond of the Amiga graphics in the beginning, but came to tolerate them. Some graphic sequences are even better on the Amiga.

Overall, the Amiga version is the better one, but the ST version is an interesting conversion and has a much easier entry point due to its navigation.

[kremiso]

thanks for the detailed comparison demoniac

interesting to know about all those missing things in the ST version

[Minuous]

ST version seems to be also missing the game load/save feature.

[TCD]

Really interesting list demoniac

Originally Posted by demoniac

Last week, I completed the ST version and found the following changes.

I wonder if this should be put on HOL as a miscshot.

[demoniac]

Originally Posted by Minuous

ST version seems to be also missing the game load/save feature.

There's no save feature for ST.

[ImmortalA1000]

I can't actually decide if I like Sinbad, there are worse Cinemaware games but at the same time it isn't going to be a game I ever hanker to play. I only have it because I have a complete Cinemaware (as a developer, not publisher) collection. Lords of the Rising Sun is another one that I am on the fence about.

[demoniac]

Both Sinbad and Lords of the Rising Sun took a while for me to get into. I think Lords overall is a more polished product, but Sinbad's Amiga world is larger and more varied. Both are better than Kings of Chicago.

Originally Posted by TCD

I wonder if this should be put on HOL as a miscshot.

Or you can link the post to the Notes section if it fits with that category.

[ImmortalA1000]

Neither really interested me as much as Desert or Crown. Wings is probably my next best but very little variety in what you actually do as there are only 3 mini games to play, rush job?

[TCD]

Originally Posted by demoniac

Or you can link the post to the Notes section if it fits with that category.

That makes more sense. Done

[gimbal]

Originally Posted by ImmortalA1000

Neither really interested me as much as Desert or Crown. Wings is probably my next best but very little variety in what you actually do as there are only 3 mini games to play, rush job?

Wings a rush job? I don't call those mini games, those are three games in one.

It's Desert where you have very little to do. Essentially all you have to do is get four ant samples to convince the mayor (which will involve shooting ants, blowing up a few ants and flying over some ants, probably 2-3 minutes of gameplay total), spend some time blowing up ants with a tank (another 2-3 minutes), and then blow up the queen while you dodge a few ants and navigate a static maze (probably 5 minutes). Everything else is filler. You'll probably see the hospital at least once because the knife fight minigames are pretty BS and the "chicken!" mini... game I guess is pedantic. You can do a little "side quest" to get some gas for a flamethrower to make the dash to the queen easier. That's about it. And then they made Ant Heads in which you... do even less!

[demoniac]

Originally Posted by TCD

That makes more sense. Done

Also add it to the ST conversion?

[TCD]

Originally Posted by demoniac

Also add it to the ST conversion?

I didn't notice that the conversions were missing. Thanks for the heads up and they have been added.

[ImmortalA1000]

Originally Posted by gimbal

Wings a rush job? I don't call those mini games, those are three games in one.

It's Desert where you have very little to do. Essentially all you have to do is get four ant samples to convince the mayor (which will involve shooting ants, blowing up a few ants and flying over some ants, probably 2-3 minutes of gameplay total), spend some time blowing up ants with a tank (another 2-3 minutes), and then blow up the queen while you dodge a few ants and navigate a static maze (probably 5 minutes). Everything else is filler. You'll probably see the hospital at least once because the knife fight minigames are pretty BS and the "chicken!" mini... game I guess is pedantic. You can do a little "side quest" to get some gas for a flamethrower to make the dash to the queen easier. That's about it. And then they made Ant Heads in which you... do even less!

Wings has the war diary and then you are plunged into one of three mini games, one of which is not great. So it's a lot of dog-fighting or Zaxxon style straffing + lots of reading. There isn't much variety. It was also released around the time they were hired by NEC to do Desert for PC Engine CD-ROM just before they went bust so maybe they were spread a bit thin. Either way it's not much more than the sum of its parts for me, a bit like an arcade game with just 2 levels, YMMV.

[demoniac]

Originally Posted by TCD

I didn't notice that the conversions were missing. Thanks for the heads up and they have been added.

I mean also add the link as a Notes item in the ST conversion page as well. I didn't see it when I just checked. Not sure if you changed something else.

[TCD]

Didn't know there was a ST conversion... Added the info there now too.

[demoniac]

Thanks.

[Minuous]

Originally Posted by demoniac

There's no save feature for ST.

Exactly my point.