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Old 04 August 2022, 17:22   #21
TCD
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Virtua Fighter 2 on the Genesis/MegaDrive doesn't use the SVP chip (Virtua Racing was the only game to do so). It's not even a 3D game, just a 2D fighter with some pseudo-3D background effects. Totally different code and assets compared to the arcade/Saturn versions.
I blame it on roondar (not at all on not reading that 20 page thread properly )
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Old 04 August 2022, 19:26   #22
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I blame it on roondar (not at all on not reading that 20 page thread properly )
No worries! There's a lot (too much!) to keep track of. Sega stuff is my other retro hobby, which is the only reason I remember those details.
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Old 04 August 2022, 19:35   #23
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I just remember that Virtua Racing was crazy expensive when it came out and back then (no internet) the magazines would mention 'Sega's SuperFX chip'. I always assumed they used it in Virtua Fighter 2 too as the arcade used the same hardware (Virtua Racing and Virtua Fighter 1 at least).
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Old 04 August 2022, 19:43   #24
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Really interesting read that. Thanks
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Old 04 August 2022, 20:17   #25
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I'd rather have people put effort in creating a MiSTer core of the arcade version of Virtua Racer.
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Old 04 August 2022, 21:39   #26
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Were the demo sceners of the day the best at getting the most out of the Amiga? If so are there any demos that come close to replicating it or a 3d environment like it?
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Old 04 August 2022, 22:20   #27
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I blame it on roondar (not at all on not reading that 20 page thread properly )
Sorry, my memory isn't flawless either, I didn't remember that the thread wasn't about the MD version either
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Old 04 August 2022, 23:07   #28
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Hi guys,
do you think that virtua racing is doable on amiga ??
Myself, i think yes, on a 030 50mhz or at least on a 040.
I always asked myself why nobody tried to make a port or a clone ????
Which cpu do you think will be necessary to make it run on aga ?
If aga is a must have for it ??
Ah, here we go again ;-)
Yea, please check this thread which essentially beats the same horse to death.
http://eab.abime.net/showthread.php?t=101353

Some things to remember, when such a question is asked, it should really rephrased into something like, how close to something looking like virtua racing could we get at playable speeds on an 50MHz 030.
The Model 1 arcade board totally and completely murders an ECS/AGA Amiga with 030 if we look at raw power.
There is simply no way you could push around the same data set as in the original game at any sort of playable speed on an 030.
As I said, lots of numbers were thrown around in the Virtua Fighter thread, but the model 1 arcade hardware can push 3000 polygons per frame at 60Hz!

So then we come to what I mentioned. You probably need to reverse the question and ask what is technically possible on a 50MHz 030 and the see if its enough to build a new data set with a much tighter polygon budget.

(A full 060 and some sort of early amiga 3d hardware (cybervision 64) would be a more realistic target.)
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Old 04 August 2022, 23:21   #29
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Ah, here we go again ;-)
Yea, please check this thread which essentially beats the same horse to death.
http://eab.abime.net/showthread.php?t=101353

Some things to remember, when such a question is asked, it should really rephrased into something like, how close to something looking like virtua racing could we get at playable speeds on an 50MHz 030.
The Model 1 arcade board totally and completely murders an ECS/AGA Amiga with 030 if we look at raw power.
There is simply no way you could push around the same data set as in the original game at any sort of playable speed on an 030.
As I said, lots of numbers were thrown around in the Virtua Fighter thread, but the model 1 arcade hardware can push 3000 polygons per frame at 60Hz!

So then we come to what I mentioned. You probably need to reverse the question and ask what is technically possible on a 50MHz 030 and the see if its enough to build a new data set with a much tighter polygon budget.

(A full 060 and some sort of early amiga 3d hardware (cybervision 64) would be a more realistic target.)
I agree that an arcade-perfect 1:1 conversion isn't realistic, but something on par with the Genesis/MegaDrive Virtua Racing or the 32X Virtua Fighter should be very achievable.
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Old 05 August 2022, 02:11   #30
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Well here is the PAL game running on my Hi-def/Stereo Sound labelled mk1 PAL Megadrive so that is the real speed for sure.

[ Show youtube player ]

It actually runs faster than I remember it. Lots of dithering but pretty fast for the time. IIRC Virtua Racing for Megadrive was £69.99 RRP wasn't it?

For a like for like comparison of the two machines the Megadrive port of F1 (by Domark) seems to run faster on Megadrive than Amiga. The ST port is using software sample playback so that sacrifices the usual 10-12% faster framerate over Amiga and runs the same.

The SVP is probably more powerful the SuperFX as Starfox rarely hit the same max framerates as Virtua Racer from what I remember, then again I haven't played that for 5 years and that was before I had a camera to do real hardware YT videos so I can't check.
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Old 05 August 2022, 07:45   #31
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it's really too bad that commodore didn't put a kind of 32x in the amiga trapdoor ! Or the hadware from a megadrive cartridge ! Those special cartridge aren't so expensives for the hardware inside.
One card in the trapdoor and we could have the same result.
But i suppose that commodore was already in the red ?
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Old 05 August 2022, 09:41   #32
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Nah, not even close on an '030.
The SVP in the Megadrive version is comparable to an '060 in 3d rendering performance, so unless you want to cut to have about 1/4 of the detail and framerate (which maxes out at 15fps) of the Megadrive version; an exercise it pointlessness, any '030 version would sit somewhere completely pointless and laughable.
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Old 05 August 2022, 10:46   #33
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an amiga 500 wolf 3d seemed impossible but Dread is there.
why not an 040 virtua racing, then ???
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Old 05 August 2022, 10:53   #34
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why not an 040 virtua racing, then ???
Well because games don't appear just by virtue of the hardware existing. The question shouldn't be "can Amiga X do it", but which person can do it. The Duke3D and other derived game ports and Dread are all possible because individuals made it happen.

If there is no person available capable of making the game as intended, and by capable I mean has the (insane) technical skills, the will and the free time, then it is "not possible".

In that respect I would consider a game such as this not possible. Hardware be darned.
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Old 05 August 2022, 10:53   #35
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because Dread use special techniques to allow fast speed on 7 Mhz 68000 that you cannot use on Virtual Racing that is true 3D, require powerful FPU speed and maybe also good GPU.
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Old 05 August 2022, 11:04   #36
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an amiga 500 wolf 3d seemed impossible but Dread is there.
why not an 040 virtua racing, then ???
Maybe because it's probably not that trivial, and perhaps not worth the effort? It took presumably years of very skilled coding for Dread to materialize, but at least it's a new game, not just a port.
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Old 05 August 2022, 11:08   #37
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/me goes off playing Virtua Racing in Fusion...
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Old 05 August 2022, 13:01   #38
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Old 05 August 2022, 13:31   #39
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I love it. It hurts my eyes when too zoomed out, but I love it nonetheless.
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Old 05 August 2022, 14:13   #40
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Would love to see this running on A500
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