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Old 27 November 2022, 23:27   #1
starlord
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Rarest of the rare: virtuality 1000 games?

Hi all.

So I remember having seen articles on Amiga Dream of the initial generation on virtuality machines (the 1000 series) due to them being built on Amiga 3000 hardware.

And I was actually wondering if any amongst you had the 5 to 10 games for the platform images or preserved, even if emulation seems unlikely in the short term.

Several games referenced include dactyl nightmare, battlesphere, VTOL, exorex, flying aces…

I believe preserving any original disks could be a good start. Does anyone know if this has been attempted already?
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Old 28 November 2022, 00:22   #2
Pyromania
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I played on one of these in Atlanta in 1994 at the mall (Dactyl Nightmare). I have no idea how to acquire the games and wouldn’t you need the VR hardware to play them?
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Old 28 November 2022, 00:41   #3
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Possibly yes, but at the worst workarounds could maybe be found. Not to mention I believe mame members have located a system I think (not sure if it’s the Amiga one).

However it is still necessary to preserve the games. And given how they work on what is basically an Amiga, I was thinking maybe some people here might have archived disks in ADF format. Maybe?

Me thinks it would be a step in the right direction given their rarity.
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Old 28 November 2022, 01:32   #4
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I serviced the machines a couple of times at Dave and Buster's in Atlanta (I worked for the only CBM dealer still around then). I wish I had copied the data from the drives, but I never even thought of it. It had custom display hardware and other IO boards in all of the slots, as I recall. I had to work on it in-place as it would have been hard to extract it to take it to the shop.

They also used AmigaVision for the closed-circuit TV channel. This ran off of another Amiga 2000 near the front desk.

Mad Dog McCree had a standard Amiga 500 board in it, also. I think I had to service all of them at different times over a couple of years in the very early 1990's.

Last edited by r.cade; 28 November 2022 at 01:37.
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Old 28 November 2022, 01:42   #5
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Just a dream but would be great if they were ported to the Quest 2 VR so I could experience them
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Old 28 November 2022, 01:47   #6
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There were talks of ports but they went nowhere so far. Maybe the authors have lost the original games themselves…

I believe the Arcadia arcade system used an A500. Was mad dog one of those?

@R.cade: interesting. Given your connections, would you know of others that might have the games? Also, on what disk format did they come on? Amiga floppies I suppose as my guess is it was too early for CDs.
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Old 28 November 2022, 02:07   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by starlord View Post
There were talks of ports but they went nowhere so far. Maybe the authors have lost the original games themselves…

I believe the Arcadia arcade system used an A500. Was mad dog one of those?

@R.cade: interesting. Given your connections, would you know of others that might have the games? Also, on what disk format did they come on? Amiga floppies I suppose as my guess is it was too early for CDs.
The virtuality machines were already loaded on the A3000 hard drive. Given the custom nature of the builds, I would guess they came that way. This was not regular software and hardware you installed in an Amiga yourself. I am sure it came self-contained.

Mad Dog McRee might have had a piggyback ROM board over the CPU, or maybe it plugged into the side expansion - it even could have been an A570 - my memory is foggy on it. It was not a floppy disk that loaded.

Last edited by r.cade; 28 November 2022 at 02:14.
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Old 28 November 2022, 02:16   #8
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And do you anyone today that might have functional machines with the games still?
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Old 28 November 2022, 03:16   #9
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And do you anyone today that might have functional machines with the games still?
Oh no, sorry. That was 30 years ago. I don't know anyone from that part of my life anymore.
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Old 28 November 2022, 03:30   #10
T_hairy_bootson
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Just a dream but would be great if they were ported to the Quest 2 VR so I could experience them
https://www.oculus.com/experiences/r...3056616777885/

Dactyl Nightmare was recreated for the rift, so if you have a pc and a link cable you can play it on a quest 2.
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Old 28 November 2022, 08:47   #11
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That’s good I guess. However the other games aren’t so lucky
Would be nice if someone ported them too.
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Old 28 November 2022, 22:38   #12
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These would run on accelerated Amigas with harddisks, so (you already got some eminent answers from r.cade) it's not a matter of preserving disk images.

This is fine as no "arcade game" (not quite but same business idea) manufacturers would gain anything by releasing the software. It was often written for specific hardware and hardware and software were one product, and the product (comparing again to arcade cabinets) were individual entertainment centers with the business idea of making back several times the renting of the machine (and generally attracting visitors).

I agree it's interesting to preserve e.g. an HDF, but it's likely that you will need the original hardware setup with it. If it used the chipset or common expansion cards, it could probably be adapted to run on some similar spec Amigas.
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Old 29 November 2022, 01:20   #13
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I am the VR GUY!

I look after 4 Amiga 3000 based Virtuality machines at the Retro Computer Museum.
We have a 2 player Dactyl Nightmare, 2 player Exorex, or 1 player Exorex, and 1 player Flying Aces/Battle Shere/VTOL/Total Destrution.

On the stand up machines, I also have Legend Quest, but more testing is required to get both machines to run it.
Gridbusters and GridWarriors - still working on getting those on!

I also have 2 Stand up machines at home, and a large collection of retro VR "stuff".

I have been restoring, repairing and general maintaining these machines since I got my first at the end of 2012.

I have learnt a LOT about the machines, and spoke to many people who used to work at the company, due to it used to be just 7 miles from my home.

As for the games. I have all but one that I know of - but there`s so little info/knowledge about the one I`m missing - it may not actually exist!

I have floppy disk sets for most of the games.
All the games I have, are `installed` using Winuae, and stored in various mediums, including micro SD cards, that I use on the Amiga VR`s via SCSI to SD.

The original software CANNOT be ran on WINUAE - as the SW looks for a custom graphics card - that as its a Zorro card, cannot be put into a PC running Winuae.

Oculus Dactyl Nightmare. Created by Fredrick Enmark, Authorised for free fanbased release by myself and the game`s creator and John Waldren who started the VR company. (I know them both!)
My name is actually in the credits to prove!

If you want to know more about the Amiga bases VR machines, please get in contact
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Old 29 November 2022, 01:45   #14
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That is actually very interesting. Knowing the games are already preserved is one very big step. Despite them not working it would be good to include them in a rom set or on the archive at permanent residence provided all parties agree.

As far as the zorro card is concerned, maybe some people from mame or other dumping efforts could agree to have a look at the technical specs, if only to see how it works. Provided the processors are documented and the hardware doesn’t use anything like logic circuitry, it could be possible to emulate in the future maybe.

Anyhow, thanks for reaching out.

So the games did come on floppy sets. Out of curiosity, which ones do you have? Specifically, would you have Battlesphere, VTOL and flying aces?
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Old 29 November 2022, 01:56   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by starlord View Post
Hi all.



So I remember having seen articles on Amiga Dream of the initial generation on virtuality machines (the 1000 series) due to them being built on Amiga 3000 hardware.



And I was actually wondering if any amongst you had the 5 to 10 games for the platform images or preserved, even if emulation seems unlikely in the short term.



Several games referenced include dactyl nightmare, battlesphere, VTOL, exorex, flying aces…



I believe preserving any original disks could be a good start. Does anyone know if this has been attempted already?
@simon_m74 - is holder of many of the virtuality machines, games and accessories. Maybe something he could shed light on?
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Old 29 November 2022, 14:01   #16
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I’m sure he could indeed. I believe several in the mame community would also be interested.

Of course, the question here is if he still has access to all of those games.

Last edited by starlord; 29 November 2022 at 14:14.
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Old 29 November 2022, 17:57   #17
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Most of the games I have are on floppy, that use an automated `quarterback` software to unpack and install to hdd.
ALL the games I have are on hard drives in various places, to makes sure I never loose them!

As for `emulating` the graphics card - its a no go. I already asked Toni Willen, and he said the most that could be done, is for Winuae to acknowledge the presence of a graphics card, but not use it, as even though they use a TMS34020 (I think - I`m not t home currently) and a co-pro...Information on these can be found I`m sure... But there are also some programmed IC`s, with `WI` logos on them. No information will be available..

On Floppy - I have at least:
Dactyl nightmare
VTOL
Exorex (used to be known as Heavy Metal)
Battlesphere
Total Destruction
Hero - (not sure which version, as there seems to be 2 games with this title - hence I`m missing possibly one game)
Flying Aces.

Master CD of Grid Busters - CD 0001! but I cannot get it to read - all my `Commodore` CD readers are poorly at the moment.

And along with that lot, I have also have the following on HDD.
Gridbusters (almost working - needs a CD, but I did get one version working once)
Legend Quest
GridWarriors

And `Special Experiences` for corporate events.
Bubble Yum (for a bubble gum company)
Rock Garden - Dactyl Nightmare remade for a Rock Party.


As well as MUCH early hardware... prototype vacuformed VR headsets, prototple VR gloves (as well as production ones). Atari Jag headset. Virtuality Track kits (used to make any video display into a VR tracker), and the list could go for ages!
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Old 29 November 2022, 19:11   #18
starlord
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Truly impressive. If winuae could be made to aknowledge the card, that would be a good step for now, other than having to find a copy of the card to possibly decap.

In anycase, excellent work keeping the games safe. Would you consider one day uploading the images either on the internet archive so they could be included in rom sets in the future?

Many thanks for the information trove.
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Old 30 November 2022, 10:43   #19
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VR isn't my thing and I would probably get motion sickness after 14ms but I need to visit the musuem. Just looked up where it is and I was nearby earlier this year doh! Should be back that way next year so will try and combine that with a visit as I would love to see the kit!
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Old 01 December 2022, 00:43   #20
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Hi Str0m,
I hope to see you at RCM soon!
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