Amiga Video Output - Currently Available Solutions

[bdb]

Amiga Video Output Options - Currently Available

Ok, you just bought a real Amiga 500 and you will need a (purchasable) way to connect it to a monitor. Out of the box, it has a composite B/W port next to the 23-pin Video port that should give output good enough to test, but there are other options to get video out of the A500. Except for the black & white composite out and the internal Denise based RGB-2-HDMI (A500 & 2000) adapter, these solutions can work with most other Amigas.

Let’s get the vintage (meaning not in production), “sore thumb” option listed and why I refer to it as such: the A520. It connects to the Amiga’s 23-pin video out port; the A520 video modulator that was designed to allow TV sets to display Amiga graphics; while it provides a standard UHF RF output as well as a standard composite video output, it has three RCA connectors: RF output, color composite output, and a mono audio input - connected to the stereo Amiga output with a Y-cable. The video quality is very poor, and even the Amiga Hardware Database [http://amiga.resource.cx/ ] states that it has, “atrocious video quality.”

The easiest (but not least expensive) vintage (purchasable if available) option is to have a 30+ year old Amiga monitor and a 23-pin to VGA cable. The original monitors are available on places like eBay, and are not cheap; but since they sync to 15KHz (the standard of all the original gaming consoles), it makes them useful. Alternative vintage monitors that also sync to 15 KHz (and above) can be found at [http://15khz.wikidot.com/ ]. On that list is the same monitor Chris Edwards uses, a Dell U2410F, and I own that one and a couple of Dells: ST2320L & ST2410; these need just a 23-pin Amiga to VGA adapter [ https://amigakit.amiga.store/amiga-m...ter-p-183.html ] ~ <$15 USD and a VGA cable. They do not handle interlace without flickering. They do handle VGA, DVI and HDMI. These 15KHz monitors are generally available used, handle other monitor-based tasks, and are much less expensive than an Amiga monitor.


My solution to handle 15KHz output with rock solid interlace, is the most common, and generally less expensive: the Amiga-to-SCART cable and the SCART-to-HDMI converter.

Cable: [ https://amigakit.amiga.store/scart-a...dio-p-226.html ] ~$12 USD. No one in the USA/Canada either makes nor sells these Amiga to SCART cables, so AmigaKit is the cheapest and often the fastest way to obtain these.

Converter: You need to then feed the signal into a SCART-to-HDMI (RGB version) [ https://www.amazon.com/Scart-Video-C.../dp/B00MUNIVRO ] ~ $30 USD; note the use of the letters, RGB, in the description. Amazon does a brisk trade in the SCART-to-HDMI converter -- just don't get the cheaper ones, they do not use the Amiga's RGB output, and won't work.

Other options:

The Open Source Scan Converter (OSSC) uses (in my case) a SCART cable to connect to the device [ https://www.retrorgb.com/ossc.html ]; these run $100 USD to $150 depending on the seller, with some listed-on eBay. These (IMHO) do not handle interlace flicker well -- not being made for that purpose. They do have a ton of adjustment options, are perfect for retro gaming, and people swear by them.

One option, that works better (IMHO) than the OSSC and the SCART-2-HDMI, is the “RGB-2-HDMI” -- a hand soldered device (also not sold in North America) that uses the older Raspberry Pi Zero (version 1.1 or 1.3) and plugs into the Amiga's Denise chip -- located inside the Amiga (where you then run an HDMI cable out). These give a pixel perfect output to HDMI, handle interlace perfectly, and have many adjustable settings. They do, however, go inside the Amiga 500 (600 or 2000). There is an external option taking the RGB output from the video out port using a similar device [ https://texelec.com/product/rgbtohdmi-ttl/ ] ~ $109 USD.

The RGB-2-HDMI device runs at least €20 ~ $21 USD [ https://ultimatemister.com/product/amiga-rgb2hdmi/ ] , or [ https://www.retroguru.eu/product/ami...berry-pi-zero/ ], and the Pi usually $40 on eBay.

One of the best devices is the Indivision ECS V3 [ http://wiki.icomp.de/wiki/Indivision_ECS_V3 ] that currently is sold out, but a great product. It also fits inside the Amiga, in place of the Denise, and has some extra screen modes.

The RetroTink 2X SCART [ https://www.retrotink.com/product-pa...otink-2x-scart ] (which uses the Amiga’s RGB) is used by some folks (such as Paul Compton, I believe); the manufacturer (retrotink.com ~ a company located in the USA) sells it for ~ $95 USD, and has a good reputation.

The GBS 8220 or the GBS 8200 [ https://www.amazon.com/Paddsun-Conve...dp/B01IBJCAIG/ ] is a “base” board used in arcade gaming systems, to give VGA out; however, it has a few issues (like needing an enclosure, and a cable to connect the RGB in), plus a few video flaws when used with the Amiga; these can be corrected by a GBS Control device [https://www.retrorgb.com/gbs-control...-overview.html ]. The combination device is sold on eBay from $75 USD (China). DIY skills are needed. The GBS 82x0 can also be found in hand-built Amiga Video Converters (sometimes called an Amiga VGA adapter); while the sellers on eBay make claims of perfect output, these sellers make no mention of the BGS Control, and remember it is eBay...

To be thorough, the A500/1000's 86-pin expansion slot can be adapted to a Zorro I slot (the Zorro II slot has 14 extra pins and allows bus-mastering via the Buster chip) is available for purchase [ https://www.tindie.com/products/retr...500-zorroii-2/ ], and there are 2 graphics cards, somewhat available for purchase (GBA++[ http://knoppix.net/store/GBAPII-Comm...951571586.html ] and the quite popular ZZ9000 [ retrorgb.com ]). These were designed for the Zorro II slots of the A2/3/4000s. The GBA++, I believe, requires a minor modification to work with the A500.

Notable mentions:
The GGLABS A520HD is the HDTV equivalent of the classic Commodore A520 TV modulator. Instead of encoding the Amiga video signal to a low-quality composite output, it converts the RGB output to a high quality YPbPr signal compatible with HDTVs with a component input. The A520HD connects to the Amiga 23-pin video port and is powered directly from the system. It is an out-of-stock item with a schematic available [ https://gglabs.us/sites/gglabs.us/fi...d_sch-A00.pdf]

I may have not mentioned something others find generally available for purchase to connect an Amiga to a monitor or TV, but feel free to add comments and corrections to this list. I am hoping for a reference that (newbie) users can be pointed to for solutions (when they mistakenly purchase an Amiga off an auction site and then find they can't get any video output, especially in the States.

[lilwshu]

The Retrotink 2X-SCART does not work well with my PAL Amigas (image blurred/interference present) and appears to have been abandoned by the developer in terms of firmware updates.

[bdb]

Originally Posted by lilwshu

The Retrotink 2X-SCART does not work well with my PAL Amigas (image blurred/interference present) and appears to have been abandoned by the developer in terms of firmware updates.

Noted!

[JoeJoe]

You forgot to mention the D520.

[Snoopy1234]

Great write up. I've been through a few converters. The Chinese Scart/HDMI converter didn't work for me. Amberry AV-1M gives ok non interlaced picture but no good for Hi-Res. I use a stock GBS 8200 in an ICore64 case (Canada). It came with a cable and 3D printed RGB plug ready to go. It did have a few artifacts on screen earlier but with use it is great now. The only thing is a need to reset occasionally when switching from PAL to NTSC - Sometimes it doesn't handle it. The GBS 8200 uses composite sync so if using a standard VGA cable (H/V sync) on the external port, you'd need to jump two pins in the pin block internally. The cable I have is on the pin block anyhow. I also tried recently a JS Electronics simple converter (Scotland) but got no signal from it at the time. That works fine on my Beeb though.

[bdb]

Originally Posted by JoeJoe

You forgot to mention the D520.

My German language skills are poor, and the D520 did not come up in my research. As best I can tell using Google Translate, the item is sold out and that the device's cost was in the $190 USD range. There is no mention of replenishing stock. Although I could not determine if they ship Worldwide, I assume that when in stock, they ship within Europe/EU it appears.

Amedia in France [https://www.amedia-computer.com/en/v...-classic.html] states, after a bit of correction:

The Model D520 is designed to convert the Amiga's analogue video signals into HDMI video out.
"No modification of the Amiga required: plug it into the DB23 video port of any Amiga Classic.
1 x HDMI 2 M cable included
1 x Audio cable (2 x RCA males / 1 x Jack male) included.

• Compatible with: A500, A500+, A600, A1000, A1200, A2000, A3000, A4000.
• Power supply by the Amiga.
• Latency <= 1 output frame (20 ms at 50 Hz output).
• Firmware update via Amiga possible.
• Line dubbing in progressive formats.
• PAL and NTSC.
• Supports OCS, ECS, AGA (no SUPER-RES).
• Overscan up to 672 × 520 24 bits per pixel, 800 × 600 16 BPP.
• Scanlines, adjustable between 0 and 100% in 16 steps (only progressive).
• Switching between interlaced / progressive in V-Blank without frame loss."

Do you have any experience with it that you could provide ?

[dreadnought]

It's a decent summary. Couple of comments regarding the vintage CRT section:

-the quality of the composite from the modulator is not really "atrocious", it's an unneeded hyperbole. It's of course worse than RGB, but not that bad in itself, especially if you're mostly into action gaming. I did some comparisons here.

-getting a dedicated old Amiga monitor is not an automatic guarantee of quality, simply because not all of them were that great and, more importantly, after nearly 4 decades there is no telling what shape they might be in. So, you might as well try and get a normal CRT TV. Some of the newer Trintrons are much better value for money imo (of course assuming you also get one in a good nick) even for producivity. And for pure gaming even lesser brands are fine.

For the new solutions I think the new Medusa device from Lotharek might be worth adding.

[CCRider]

My setup (for Amiga and other contemporary videogames, all in the same chain):

Amiga RGB-to-SCART cabe -> Hydra mini (multiple SCART inputs) -> RetroTink RGB2COMP -> CRT TV with Component input.

[bdb]

Originally Posted by dreadnought

It's a decent summary. Couple of comments regarding the vintage CRT section:

-the quality of the composite from the modulator is not really "atrocious", it's an unneeded hyperbole. It's of course worse than RGB, but not that bad in itself, especially if you're mostly into action gaming. I did some comparisons here.

-getting a dedicated old Amiga monitor is not an automatic guarantee of quality, simply because not all of them were that great and, more importantly, after nearly 4 decades there is no telling what shape they might be in. So, you might as well try and get a normal CRT TV. Some of the newer Trintrons are much better value for money imo (of course assuming you also get one in a good nick) even for producivity. And for pure gaming even lesser brands are fine.

For the new solutions I think the new Medusa device from Lotharek might be worth adding.

The way this was put together, was to let someone who just bought an Amiga from an Auction site find a way to connect their 30 year-old computer to a currently available monitor or TV.

I can take the discussions, adverse opinions, and such and re-write them to this format (preferably with an estimated cost), but surely those interested in helping this post have the ability to do the same.

[bdb]

Originally Posted by CCRider

My setup (for Amiga and other contemporary videogames, all in the same chain):

Amiga RGB-to-SCART cabe -> Hydra mini (multiple SCART inputs) -> RetroTink RGB2COMP -> CRT TV with Component input.

The way this was put together, was to let someone who just bought an Amiga from an Auction site find a way to connect their 30 year-old computer to a currently available monitor or TV.

Let me do the Googling and re-write your post:

It has been suggested, that using an Amiga-to-SCART cable (referenced above), one can plug into a Hydra Mini Automatic SCART Switch [ https://retrolemon.co.uk/audiovideo-...ini-hydra.html ] ~ €109 ($110 USD) and then to a RetroTink RGB2COMP device [ https://www.retrotink.com/product-page/rgb2comp ] ~ $70, to give component out (5x RCA output (Y, Pb, Pr, Left, Right) to fit into a TV or monitor that has those inputs.

[desiv]

One quirky thing with my GBS is that it (and/or my monitors) apparently doesn't like NTSC. (I'm in the US)

Could just be my monitors that I've tried it on, but they like PAL thru the GBS, but won't sync with NTSC.
I generally run in PAL mode, but my system is NTSC default, so I have to remember to go into the pre-boot and flip it to PAL if I am going to be doing something that doesn't go to PAL...

It's weird because I could swear that used to work, but that was another GBS and another monitor ago, and I'm not positive...

[bdb]

Originally Posted by dreadnought

...
For the new solutions I think the new Medusa device from Lotharek might be worth adding.

To rephrase, the aforementioned item, the Medusa Retro Scandoubler, available at RetroLemon [ https://retrolemon.co.uk/audiovideo-...andoubler.html ] for 199 GBP or [ https://lotharek.pl/productdetail.php?id=135 ] for 849 PLN "accepts almost all signals that retro computers can produce: composite (yellow RCA, via SCART), S-Video (via SCART), RGB (via SCART), RGBHV (via VGA connector, separate syncs)" requiring a connecting cable and a separate external 5V USB power supply.

It then outputs to DVI-I.

Additional information may be found at the listed links.

Both places ship to the States and Retro Lemon Worldwide.

[JoeJoe]

I can only recommend the D520. I plug the then as desired to my A500/A600/A1200 and ready. The image is an extremely sharp and scrolling is buttery smooth. Unfortunately, it is also not cheap.
The RGB2HDMI (Pi) solution is better. But you have to open the Amiga to get a different PCB for the Amiga type. But the BIld is also perfect.
My two cent

[CCRider]

Originally Posted by bdb

The way this was put together, was to let someone who just bought an Amiga from an Auction site find a way to connect their 30 year-old computer to a currently available monitor or TV.

Let me do the Googling and re-write your post:

It has been suggested, that using an Amiga-to-SCART cable (referenced above), one can plug into a Hydra Mini Automatic SCART Switch [ https://retrolemon.co.uk/audiovideo-...ini-hydra.html ] ~ €109 ($110 USD) and then to a RetroTink RGB2COMP device [ https://www.retrotink.com/product-page/rgb2comp ] ~ $70, to give component out (5x RCA output (Y, Pb, Pr, Left, Right) to fit into a TV or monitor that has those inputs.

Well... if the intent is to be a straightforward process above anything else, go and get an A500 Mini already.

[bdb]

Originally Posted by CCRider

Well... if the intent is to be a straightforward process above anything else, go and get an A500 Mini already.

As well you should!

[desiv]

Originally Posted by desiv

One quirky thing with my GBS is that it (and/or my monitors) apparently doesn't like NTSC. (I'm in the US)

OK, just an update on this...
I decided to try it again.
Went to an NTSC mode. My monitor blanked as usual...
Hit the AUTO button on the GBS, even tho I am sure I did that before, just to be sure... And of course...
It started showing the Amiga screen...
er.. what?
Tried a PAL screen.. Works. Tried NTSC screens... Works...

I know I tried LOTS of option in the GBS before, and I can't imagine I didn't hit AUTO, but...

What? What do you mean, "But we have read your posts before, and it is very likely you missed that..."

And well, to that I say.. "er.. SHUT UP!!!"

;-) <sigh> Good Amiga day, as I got that working and I found my config problem on my Filezilla FTP server on my Windows machine...

[ImmortalA1000]

I notice you are in the USA, otherwise SCART RGB analogue cable as I used from 1987 onward works brilliant on a half decent CRT TV. I remember I had my A1200 and A1000 connected like that on a Mitsubishi Diamondtron 28" CRT TV and it was brilliant.

It's relatively cheap to get a 15.5khz RGBa to HDMI converter and I imagine that would be the best bet for Americans with an LCD TV. I would never spend £150 on a C= or Phillips iffy CRT tubed monitor over a £100 Sony KV late 1980s series CRT TV, no way did any 3rd party monitor ever match the king of kings Trinitron KV's of 1986-1991 for us on the other side of the ocean. It's a bit tricky in the USA without SCART RGB input sockets. I feel sorry for you all there.

[desiv]

Originally Posted by ImmortalA1000

It's a bit tricky in the USA without SCART RGB input sockets. I feel sorry for you all there.

Yeah, once I started to look into the retro scene across the pond, I started getting jealous of SCART. Would have made things SO much easier...

Darn you... Doctor Who, Monty Python, AND SCART? Not fair!!

The GBS-8200 is decent and cheap, but not great and VGA (not HDMI).
I do have a 1084s, but where my 1200 is right now, there isn't really room for it. I'm using my PC monitor, which has two HDMI and one VGA input.
I use one HDMI for my desktop PC and the other HDMI for my work laptop, so having the VGA for the Amiga works fairly well in general.
Of course, I'm thinking of eventually going with a PiStorm32, and it's RTG would probably make me get an HDMI switchbox and try harder to find a spot for my 1084s somewhere on my desk...