Amiga 600 mouse problem with Y

majsta · 27 May 2012, 13:35

I m in process of repairing one A600 board. I repaired most of the things on the board but I just can't resolve mouse problem. Mouse works left to right so X is fine and buttons are working but mouse don't work in Y. I have number of boards with this problem but can't understand what's wrong here. Mouse is ok and I replaced U34 on board but no Y movement again. Maybe someone have experience with this.

Photon · 27 May 2012, 15:54

I guess you don't have another mouse to test with, or you'd have concluded that the boards share the same problem, almost certainly the CIA.

If back and right works in a game with a joystick, everything is OK and the mouse is bad. http://old.pinouts.ru/Inputs/AmigaMouseJoy_pinout.shtml

majsta · 27 May 2012, 16:07

I don't have other mouse to test it but this one worked just fine on other boards.
OK I replaced Paula also but the same, but looking at the schematics you could be correct and maybe problem is with U7 and even maybe U8. Thank you I ll check that.

majsta · 27 May 2012, 16:22

Just changed U7 but it is the same mouse moves up and down for just one pixel and then back to previous position.

Photon · 27 May 2012, 16:27

You don't have a joystick? You'd need that or another mouse, or you'd just be swapping chips around with no possibility of eliminating fault sources.

You could conclude that the mouse or mouse cable is the source, if you have multiple boards that fail the same way. But if you move chips from one board to the other to test this, you can't conclude that, because the fault could be with the chips and the fault move to the board you put them in.

majsta · 27 May 2012, 16:31

No I don't have joystick, but mouse is fine like I said. There must be something else I can check. I checked every component and replaced everyone I suspected that something is wrong with her but situation remain the same.

Toni Wilen · 27 May 2012, 16:36

Does mouse work in joystick port? (Use for example 2 player Lemmings to test)

Denise handles joystick/mouse directions. CIA = Fire/left mouse. Paula = other buttons and analog joystick.

majsta · 27 May 2012, 16:46

Yes that was the info I needed I was trying to find MOV, MOH lines but didn't find it until you told me that Denise is dedicated for that I ll try to replace Denise now.

majsta · 27 May 2012, 16:56

Huh 8 minutes to replace chip

Results the same no vertical movement.

kasio · 27 May 2012, 17:05

There are some suggestions in this thread on Amibay:
http://www.amibay.com/showthread.php?t=29366

majsta · 27 May 2012, 17:19

Yes checked that all, capacitors every connection but no luck...but thanks

Photon · 27 May 2012, 23:30

Not enough to go on. Please explain in detail how you have tested the mouse, and how you have tested that the chips you put in the nonworking Amigas are working.

It would be nice to know how many motherboards show the exact same problem for the same mouse.

rampartsagain · 28 May 2012, 01:38

have you checked the cable ??? some damaged line???

MalleII · 29 May 2012, 18:26

The problem in the described behavior is not the Amiga, but the mouse itself.
The Infrared LEDs or the opposite IR-Sensors are flakey. Sometimes the LM339 is bad.
Grab your LogicAnalyzer and measure the 4 input signals from the 2 sensors vs. the corresponding output pins on the LM339 and you will see the problem.

Photon · 29 May 2012, 19:20

But he says the mouse is fine.

And I'm not sure that he has a logic analyzer if he doesn't have a joystick.

majsta · 29 May 2012, 20:26

Heh as I m working on Amiga fpga accelerator for 2 years or more I have tools like small factory

But don't have another mouse but this one worked on some other motherboards. So today I decided to left this board as is and to use it for testings with accelerator and maybe I ll find problem later. I tested mouse cable and it is fine but again maybe it is the mouse I ll check that when I repair another A600 board. Thanks...

attilio · 07 October 2013, 00:00

Hello, any update about this issue ? I am experienceing the very same issue with my A600. Thanks.

majsta · 07 October 2013, 00:05

I resolved it long time ago but to tell you the truth I have no idea what I did.

Lord Aga · 07 October 2013, 00:21

I had a jerky movement on Y axis, but a better PSU solved this.

attilio · 07 October 2013, 08:46

Uhm, in my case the PSU seems rock solid, so I'd rather factor it out. There is this post [1] where Zetro suggests some common points of failure. Plus, I have checked the schematics and the mouse moviments are handled by denise an a buffer chip and not by the CIAs, as toni suggestes in this thread. I will do some further tests and let you know.

[1] http://www.amibay.com/showthread.php?t=29366

27 May 2012, 13:35	#1
majsta www.majsta.com Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: Banjaluka/Republic of Srpska Age: 43 Posts: 448	Amiga 600 mouse problem with Y I m in process of repairing one A600 board. I repaired most of the things on the board but I just can't resolve mouse problem. Mouse works left to right so X is fine and buttons are working but mouse don't work in Y. I have number of boards with this problem but can't understand what's wrong here. Mouse is ok and I replaced U34 on board but no Y movement again. Maybe someone have experience with this.

27 May 2012, 16:27	#5
Photon Moderator Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Eksjö / Sweden Posts: 5,652	You don't have a joystick? You'd need that or another mouse, or you'd just be swapping chips around with no possibility of eliminating fault sources. You could conclude that the mouse or mouse cable is the source, if you have multiple boards that fail the same way. But if you move chips from one board to the other to test this, you can't conclude that, because the fault could be with the chips and the fault move to the board you put them in. Last edited by Photon; 27 May 2012 at 16:32.

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27 May 2012, 15:54	#2
Photon Moderator Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Eksjö / Sweden Posts: 5,652	I guess you don't have another mouse to test with, or you'd have concluded that the boards share the same problem, almost certainly the CIA. If back and right works in a game with a joystick, everything is OK and the mouse is bad. http://old.pinouts.ru/Inputs/AmigaMouseJoy_pinout.shtml

27 May 2012, 16:07	#3
majsta www.majsta.com Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: Banjaluka/Republic of Srpska Age: 43 Posts: 448	I don't have other mouse to test it but this one worked just fine on other boards. OK I replaced Paula also but the same, but looking at the schematics you could be correct and maybe problem is with U7 and even maybe U8. Thank you I ll check that.

27 May 2012, 16:22	#4
majsta www.majsta.com Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: Banjaluka/Republic of Srpska Age: 43 Posts: 448	Just changed U7 but it is the same mouse moves up and down for just one pixel and then back to previous position.

27 May 2012, 16:31	#6
majsta www.majsta.com Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: Banjaluka/Republic of Srpska Age: 43 Posts: 448	No I don't have joystick, but mouse is fine like I said. There must be something else I can check. I checked every component and replaced everyone I suspected that something is wrong with her but situation remain the same.

27 May 2012, 16:36	#7
Toni Wilen WinUAE developer Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Hämeenlinna/Finland Age: 49 Posts: 26,567	Does mouse work in joystick port? (Use for example 2 player Lemmings to test) Denise handles joystick/mouse directions. CIA = Fire/left mouse. Paula = other buttons and analog joystick.

27 May 2012, 16:46	#8
majsta www.majsta.com Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: Banjaluka/Republic of Srpska Age: 43 Posts: 448	Yes that was the info I needed I was trying to find MOV, MOH lines but didn't find it until you told me that Denise is dedicated for that I ll try to replace Denise now.

27 May 2012, 16:56	#9
majsta www.majsta.com Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: Banjaluka/Republic of Srpska Age: 43 Posts: 448	Huh 8 minutes to replace chip Results the same no vertical movement.

27 May 2012, 17:05	#10
kasio Registered User Join Date: Jan 2011 Location: Stockholm Posts: 41	There are some suggestions in this thread on Amibay: http://www.amibay.com/showthread.php?t=29366

27 May 2012, 17:19	#11
majsta www.majsta.com Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: Banjaluka/Republic of Srpska Age: 43 Posts: 448	Yes checked that all, capacitors every connection but no luck...but thanks

27 May 2012, 23:30	#12
Photon Moderator Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Eksjö / Sweden Posts: 5,652	Not enough to go on. Please explain in detail how you have tested the mouse, and how you have tested that the chips you put in the nonworking Amigas are working. It would be nice to know how many motherboards show the exact same problem for the same mouse.

28 May 2012, 01:38	#13
rampartsagain Registered User Join Date: May 2012 Location: Porto/Portugal Posts: 385	have you checked the cable ??? some damaged line???

29 May 2012, 18:26	#14
MalleII Registered User Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: Germany Posts: 28	The problem in the described behavior is not the Amiga, but the mouse itself. The Infrared LEDs or the opposite IR-Sensors are flakey. Sometimes the LM339 is bad. Grab your LogicAnalyzer and measure the 4 input signals from the 2 sensors vs. the corresponding output pins on the LM339 and you will see the problem.

29 May 2012, 19:20	#15
Photon Moderator Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Eksjö / Sweden Posts: 5,652	But he says the mouse is fine. And I'm not sure that he has a logic analyzer if he doesn't have a joystick.

29 May 2012, 20:26	#16
majsta www.majsta.com Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: Banjaluka/Republic of Srpska Age: 43 Posts: 448	Heh as I m working on Amiga fpga accelerator for 2 years or more I have tools like small factory But don't have another mouse but this one worked on some other motherboards. So today I decided to left this board as is and to use it for testings with accelerator and maybe I ll find problem later. I tested mouse cable and it is fine but again maybe it is the mouse I ll check that when I repair another A600 board. Thanks...

07 October 2013, 00:00	#17
attilio Registered User Join Date: Jul 2013 Location: Turin Posts: 11	Hello, any update about this issue ? I am experienceing the very same issue with my A600. Thanks.

07 October 2013, 00:05	#18
majsta www.majsta.com Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: Banjaluka/Republic of Srpska Age: 43 Posts: 448	I resolved it long time ago but to tell you the truth I have no idea what I did.

07 October 2013, 00:21	#19
Lord Aga MI clan prevails Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: Belgrade, Serbia Posts: 1,443	I had a jerky movement on Y axis, but a better PSU solved this.

07 October 2013, 08:46	#20
attilio Registered User Join Date: Jul 2013 Location: Turin Posts: 11	Uhm, in my case the PSU seems rock solid, so I'd rather factor it out. There is this post [1] where Zetro suggests some common points of failure. Plus, I have checked the schematics and the mouse moviments are handled by denise an a buffer chip and not by the CIAs, as toni suggestes in this thread. I will do some further tests and let you know. [1] http://www.amibay.com/showthread.php?t=29366

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