Kickstart to fast RAM (MC68000 w/o MMU)

[ShK]

Is there any program for the basic Amiga (MC68000 w/o MMU), that could remap Kickstart ROM to fast RAM (even without a reboot)?

[demolition]

Originally Posted by ShK

Is there any program for the basic Amiga (MC68000 w/o MMU), that could remap Kickstart ROM to fast RAM (even without a reboot)?

http://aminet.net/package/util/boot/skick346

[ShK]

Originally Posted by demolition

http://aminet.net/package/util/boot/skick346

I examine it, but I don't understand that with what command it remap? It seems always to need kick + rtb -files.

[alexh]

What is the purpose of doing this? Do you have a hard disk drive?

The SKICK application works with Kickstart ROM images. AFAIK it doesn't have the option to copy the physically installed ROM into fastRAM.

You will need to use TransROM to dump your ROM to your drive before you can use SKICK.

[ShK]

That is what I thought. Is there any alternative program for the MC68000 w/o MMU, that could just remap Kickstart ROM to fast RAM? Was it the ACA card's own software, which does not even have to reboot.

[alexh]

The ACA500 has it's own mini MMU in the CPLD which forms the brains of that card.

It is very basic, a form of kickstart switcher which intercepts addresses to the kickstart ROM and remaps them to it's own flash/RAM.

http://wiki.icomp.de/wiki/File:Inside_ACA500.pdf

[ShK]

Yes, I have ACA620 and 1231, but I can't find program for the basic Amiga that only just remap Kickstart 3.1 ROM to fast RAM.

http://aminet.net/search?name=kick&path[]=util/boot

[demolition]

Originally Posted by alexh

The SKICK application works with Kickstart ROM images. AFAIK it doesn't have the option to copy the physically installed ROM into fastRAM.

Sure it does. If you start its GUI you can choose between the ROMs on the HDD and your own real ROM. If you choose the latter, it will remap your ROM to fast RAM. It does require an RTB file for the ROM you have though. It is not possible to remap a kickstart without either an RTB file (or similar), an MMU or external logic to remap the kickstart addresses like many accelerators can. But the skick package contains RTB files for most kickstarts except 2.05.

For a plain 68000 there is not much point in remapping your physical ROM into fast RAM though - the speed will be the same and you'll just waste RAM.

[ShK]

It seems that with the GUI it still requires kick + rtb -files, even if you select the same version of the kick, what is in your real ROM.

[demolition]

Originally Posted by ShK

It seems that with the GUI it still requires kick + rtb -files, even if you select the same version of the kick, what is in your real ROM.

That could be right since I had several ROMs on the HDD when I used it, but then it seems odd why you can select either the version from HDD or the one from ROM when they're the same.

So what's your reason for wanting to do this? If you have a physical 3.1 ROM, then why try to remap it?

[ShK]

I'm trying to make a bootable test floppy for the Amiga FPGA Accelerator. The current versions of the Core does not really like the SKICK program's reboot. That's why I try to find alternative program to remap kickstart and which is compatible with the MC68000 w/o MMU. I'm not sure if the problem is in reboot or SKICK. VBRMove 2.3 runs smoothly.

BusSpeedTest 0.19 (mlelstv)   Buffer:     262144 Bytes, Alignment: 32768
========================================================================
memtype   addr       op         cycle     calib         bandwidth
fast      $40020000  readw     205.1 ns   normal       9.8 * 10^6 byte/s
fast      $40020000  readl     328.9 ns   normal      12.2 * 10^6 byte/s
fast      $40020000  readm     277.8 ns   normal      14.4 * 10^6 byte/s
fast      $40020000  writew    159.5 ns   normal      12.5 * 10^6 byte/s
fast      $40020000  writel    206.3 ns   normal      19.4 * 10^6 byte/s
fast      $40020000  writem    176.7 ns   normal      22.6 * 10^6 byte/s
chip      $00018000  readw    1036.2 ns   normal       1.9 * 10^6 byte/s
chip      $00018000  readl    2072.1 ns   normal       1.9 * 10^6 byte/s
chip      $00018000  readm    2087.7 ns   normal       1.9 * 10^6 byte/s
chip      $00018000  writew   1161.9 ns   normal       1.7 * 10^6 byte/s
chip      $00018000  writel   2227.1 ns   normal       1.8 * 10^6 byte/s
chip      $00018000  writem   2085.6 ns   normal       1.9 * 10^6 byte/s
rom       $00F80000  readw     577.1 ns   normal       3.5 * 10^6 byte/s
rom       $00F80000  readl    1011.1 ns   normal       4.0 * 10^6 byte/s
rom       $00F80000  readm     904.0 ns   normal       4.4 * 10^6 byte/s

[alexh]

Get the FPGA developer to add hardware MMU maprom

[ShK]

Sure, it would be the best option. But in the meantime, there is already expansion board like Kipper2k's A600 8MB Fast Ram Memory (which I also have). That's why I thought that, there are other programs than SKICK, which just remap Kickstart ROM to fast RAM. But, on the basis of our discussion, it seem that at least rtb -file is required without MMU.

[alexh]

Does that matter? The RTB files are included in the SKick program for many ROMs

[ShK]

No, kick40063.A600.RTB file is just a 4,88kb. If only I could find alternative program for the MC68000 w/o MMU for the testing.

[demolition]

Originally Posted by ShK

I'm trying to make a bootable test floppy for the Amiga FPGA Accelerator. The current versions of the Core does not really like the SKICK program's reboot. That's why I try to find alternative program to remap kickstart and which is compatible with the MC68000 w/o MMU. I'm not sure if the problem is in reboot or SKICK. VBRMove 2.3 runs smoothly.

I think it might not be possible to remap the kickstart without a reboot unless you're using an MMU or external circuitry to do the mapping. Some references might be wrong in the running software and the only way to set them straight would be to reboot.
Also, I didn't think that VBR move should be possible on a plain 68000? Should be 010+.

[ShK]

Originally Posted by demolition

I think it might not be possible to remap the kickstart without a reboot unless you're using an MMU or external circuitry to do the mapping. Some references might be wrong in the running software and the only way to set them straight would be to reboot.

I think you're right. Like Alexh already said, the MMU emulation would be the best to get in the VHDL-code. However, this FPGA thing is only a one-man hobby project and made ​​of free will. Majsta struggles with the IDE controller right now and I can't help him, because I'm just a hobbyist and not an expert. Also, his time is spent to help the Apollo team's Phoenix-Core development. I don't want to disturb him now with my nonsense.

Originally Posted by demolition

Also, I didn't think that VBR move should be possible on a plain 68000? Should be 010+.

This is true. TG68.C-core must be version 1.0 (2Way cache -MC68020) with the VBR move.