Problems with graphics quality when using winuae!

28 July 2004, 03:39

First I'd like to say that WinUAE is awesome. I just found out about this program last weekend after reading about an Amiga emulator for a PDA.
I followed the tutorial at http://jambo.abime.net/howto.php and it worked perfectly.
However when playing games the graphics output looks pretty bad. I have not used my real Amiga which was hooked up to a Monitor in many years but I believe that graphics never looked so bad.
There could be several reasons for this. I am using a resolution of 640*512 (user defiend with my NVIDIA driver) with LINE doubled and Full screen mode. I have a 21inch monitor and it is possible that watching a 640*512 output on such a big screen just does not look good. I also don't know if the setting under FILTER in WinUAE could improve picture quality because I could not find any good description about those settings.

I also installed Picasso96 which provides my workbench with a much clearer picture. However I don't know if there is a way for games to take advantage of Picasso96. I can't start them from my Workbench becuase they are NO Dos and starting them from the emulated Floppy drive does not use the Workbench.

Again, maybe graphics always looked like this on my AMIGA and I just got used to the high resolution of todays PC's, but if anybody has any recommendations I'd appreciate it.

Thanks

P.S. Finally I can play Speedball 2 again which I used to play so passionately that I got blisters from the Joystick.

28 July 2004, 04:09

The games always were like that but the imperfections of the TV screen or the pattern of the commodore 1084 monitor was effecting the overall experience. You're like me so I recommend you to use a filtering mode or if your video card has tv out function, try winuae with your television or even 1084

Games often use very low screen modes like 320x200, your workbench screenmode won't help at all.

28 July 2004, 06:25

Thanks Burseg,

Could you tell me which of these filters are best to improve graphics quality? I tried the direct3d biliniear 32bit which didn't seem to make a difference. What are these Scale2x, Supereagle, Super2xSal and 2xSal filters. Are they gonna improve image quality??
Also, do most people use 640*480 (640*512) resolution with doubled line mode or is there any other setting people prefer? I should mention that I like the Full screen mode!

Thanks

28 July 2004, 06:47

This problem isn't related to the emulation but our damned perfect monitors

In fact image quality isn't low, it's as high as it can be and that's annoying!

D3d Bilinear is different if you compare it to point filter which is sharper but you will still be counting the pixels

bilinear one adds a slight blurring, nothing too important but better than 2xSai which adds the most noticeable but strange effect which you might like after all but the main reason of my using filters is not that I don't like original amiga graphics, bilinear's blur is enough for me but I'm using filters because you can scale your display any way you want that way! There won't be any blank bottoms in pal games any more. You can also load&save your filter settings on the fly. It's better than having an extremely sharp image on an ambigious placement surrounded by black borders or even off screen artifacts.

I'm not using 640xanything mode after the implementation of the filters. I find 1024x768 doubled screen with a d3d bilinear filter as the optimal resolution. Actually resolution doesn't matter regarding image placement as long as you're using a d3d or ogl filter but something below 1024 isn't pleasant on a large monitor.

28 July 2004, 06:54

Well it had been a while since I tried other filters because d3d instantly gave what I wanted but now I checked them again and noticed a mistake I made. I was using doubled screen with 2x modes which led to the abnormal screenmode requirement and slowdowns, that was a stupid thing to do really

Now 2xsai and others look more appealing

D3d is still faster though. Just load James Pond 2 and see how it slows down with a 2x mode.

last minute note: 2x modes don't appear to work under 32 bit.

So the messages are overedited and cluttered but there are things that may help I hope.

27 August 2006, 16:58

The problem is not the quality of the graphics. They were and still are great. Most Amiga Games were designed to support 320x256 with 32 or even more colors (up to 256). Even at 640x480 you have double the pixels, so it is natural that everything looks bad. Try using a 320x256 window and you will see that the graphics look great!
Its better of course to use a big TV or an Amiga Monitor. I have both and depending on mood I choose!

Ironclaw · 27 August 2006, 17:19

Ehhh...

Retro-Nerd · 27 August 2006, 17:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by petvas

Try using a 320x256 window and you will see that the graphics look great!

Good for screenshots but not for playing. Do you use a magnifier to play the games.

Yes, the games were designed for a TV or a 14" monitor. Of couse they looks pixelated on a 19" PC monitor. Connecting the s-video out from the graphic card with a TV works fine.

Ironclaw · 27 August 2006, 17:50

In WinUAE 320x256 is good, if you use fullscreen that is

.

Ironclaw · 27 August 2006, 17:51

Some games look awesome in 320x256 windowed, but as soon as you double the size or use full screen it looks crap, which is what I think he meant. But... a game like Elfmania looks soooo wonderfull now matter how big it is

.

Hard to believe it's not an AGA game.

Retro-Nerd · 27 August 2006, 18:01

All games looks awesome in 320x240 or 320x256. No problem in this stamp size.

Ironclaw · 27 August 2006, 18:29

Lionheart is also one of those games that in double size, it looks amazing.. like Elfmania....

But I'm a pixel lover so

.. but they still look amazing.

viddi · 27 August 2006, 18:36

Well, of course, we are used to high resolutions today.

I think it was the same, when we moved from 8-bit to the Amiga.
I had a Schneider CPC and it was crazy so see those unblocky graphics made by Amiga. (btw: I still own some CPCs, of course

)

So, for us 320 x 256 (or even 640 x 480) seems to be blocky.

But I thought about it and now I think it´s really okay.
It´s good to play, it´s some sort of style, and unbelievable how many details can be in there.

The same comes to the limitation of 32 or 256 colours.
Because of this you had to find out cool techniques of color cycling, shading and so on...
No need to mention the copper effect in combination.

I think all this together formed a certain Amiga-style gfx.
(sometimes similar on MegaDrive)

Some old 32 colour Amiga screens look better than a polished modern e.g. Jump´n´run.

Don´t get me wrong, a real-time strategy game should be at least in 640 x 480.

But handdrawn Action- or even Adventure-titles are good to play in low res even today.

Ironclaw · 27 August 2006, 19:11

Made a 1 min recording of the above stage of Elfmania, to show this old and wonderfull game.... it's in the zone.... it's in mp4, so you need that codec...

so if you can't view the movie, install this codec thingy http://www.free-codecs.com/FFDShow_download.htm .

28 July 2004, 03:39	#1
Unregistered Posts: n/a	Problems with graphics quality when using winuae! First I'd like to say that WinUAE is awesome. I just found out about this program last weekend after reading about an Amiga emulator for a PDA. I followed the tutorial at http://jambo.abime.net/howto.php and it worked perfectly. However when playing games the graphics output looks pretty bad. I have not used my real Amiga which was hooked up to a Monitor in many years but I believe that graphics never looked so bad. There could be several reasons for this. I am using a resolution of 640512 (user defiend with my NVIDIA driver) with LINE doubled and Full screen mode. I have a 21inch monitor and it is possible that watching a 640512 output on such a big screen just does not look good. I also don't know if the setting under FILTER in WinUAE could improve picture quality because I could not find any good description about those settings. I also installed Picasso96 which provides my workbench with a much clearer picture. However I don't know if there is a way for games to take advantage of Picasso96. I can't start them from my Workbench becuase they are NO Dos and starting them from the emulated Floppy drive does not use the Workbench. Again, maybe graphics always looked like this on my AMIGA and I just got used to the high resolution of todays PC's, but if anybody has any recommendations I'd appreciate it. Thanks P.S. Finally I can play Speedball 2 again which I used to play so passionately that I got blisters from the Joystick.

28 July 2004, 06:47	#4
oldpx Posts: n/a	This problem isn't related to the emulation but our damned perfect monitors In fact image quality isn't low, it's as high as it can be and that's annoying! D3d Bilinear is different if you compare it to point filter which is sharper but you will still be counting the pixels bilinear one adds a slight blurring, nothing too important but better than 2xSai which adds the most noticeable but strange effect which you might like after all but the main reason of my using filters is not that I don't like original amiga graphics, bilinear's blur is enough for me but I'm using filters because you can scale your display any way you want that way! There won't be any blank bottoms in pal games any more. You can also load&save your filter settings on the fly. It's better than having an extremely sharp image on an ambigious placement surrounded by black borders or even off screen artifacts. I'm not using 640xanything mode after the implementation of the filters. I find 1024x768 doubled screen with a d3d bilinear filter as the optimal resolution. Actually resolution doesn't matter regarding image placement as long as you're using a d3d or ogl filter but something below 1024 isn't pleasant on a large monitor. Last edited by oldpx; 28 July 2004 at 07:05.

28 July 2004, 06:54	#5
oldpx Posts: n/a	Well it had been a while since I tried other filters because d3d instantly gave what I wanted but now I checked them again and noticed a mistake I made. I was using doubled screen with 2x modes which led to the abnormal screenmode requirement and slowdowns, that was a stupid thing to do really Now 2xsai and others look more appealing D3d is still faster though. Just load James Pond 2 and see how it slows down with a 2x mode. last minute note: 2x modes don't appear to work under 32 bit. So the messages are overedited and cluttered but there are things that may help I hope. Last edited by oldpx; 28 July 2004 at 07:09.

Similar Threads
Thread	Thread Starter	Forum	Replies	Last Post
WinUAE 2.3.1 & The quality Picture !!!	meme	support.WinUAE	39	06 April 2011 16:15
Better quality graphics??	SHU	support.WinUAE	12	09 May 2005 19:34
New PC graphics board causes problems	TonyR	support.WinUAE	10	18 January 2004 05:05
New graphics card...New problems!	AdamSelene	support.WinUAE	13	20 July 2002 04:07
winuae sound quality test released	Toni Wilen	support.WinUAE	30	29 April 2002 08:23

28 July 2004, 04:09	#2
oldpx Posts: n/a	The games always were like that but the imperfections of the TV screen or the pattern of the commodore 1084 monitor was effecting the overall experience. You're like me so I recommend you to use a filtering mode or if your video card has tv out function, try winuae with your television or even 1084 Games often use very low screen modes like 320x200, your workbench screenmode won't help at all.

28 July 2004, 06:25	#3
ener555 Posts: n/a	Thanks Burseg, Could you tell me which of these filters are best to improve graphics quality? I tried the direct3d biliniear 32bit which didn't seem to make a difference. What are these Scale2x, Supereagle, Super2xSal and 2xSal filters. Are they gonna improve image quality?? Also, do most people use 640480 (640512) resolution with doubled line mode or is there any other setting people prefer? I should mention that I like the Full screen mode! Thanks

27 August 2006, 16:58	#6
petvas Posts: n/a	The problem is not the quality of the graphics. They were and still are great. Most Amiga Games were designed to support 320x256 with 32 or even more colors (up to 256). Even at 640x480 you have double the pixels, so it is natural that everything looks bad. Try using a 320x256 window and you will see that the graphics look great! Its better of course to use a big TV or an Amiga Monitor. I have both and depending on mood I choose!

27 August 2006, 17:19	#7
Ironclaw Banned Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: ... Age: 46 Posts: 3,313	Ehhh...

27 August 2006, 17:50	#9
Ironclaw Banned Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: ... Age: 46 Posts: 3,313	In WinUAE 320x256 is good, if you use fullscreen that is .

27 August 2006, 17:51	#10
Ironclaw Banned Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: ... Age: 46 Posts: 3,313	Some games look awesome in 320x256 windowed, but as soon as you double the size or use full screen it looks crap, which is what I think he meant. But... a game like Elfmania looks soooo wonderfull now matter how big it is . Hard to believe it's not an AGA game.

27 August 2006, 18:01	#11
Retro-Nerd Missile Command Champion Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Germany Age: 52 Posts: 12,458	All games looks awesome in 320x240 or 320x256. No problem in this stamp size.

27 August 2006, 18:29	#12
Ironclaw Banned Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: ... Age: 46 Posts: 3,313	Lionheart is also one of those games that in double size, it looks amazing.. like Elfmania.... But I'm a pixel lover so .. but they still look amazing.

27 August 2006, 18:36	#13
viddi Moderator Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Germany Age: 44 Posts: 4,015	Well, of course, we are used to high resolutions today. I think it was the same, when we moved from 8-bit to the Amiga. I had a Schneider CPC and it was crazy so see those unblocky graphics made by Amiga. (btw: I still own some CPCs, of course ) So, for us 320 x 256 (or even 640 x 480) seems to be blocky. But I thought about it and now I think it´s really okay. It´s good to play, it´s some sort of style, and unbelievable how many details can be in there. The same comes to the limitation of 32 or 256 colours. Because of this you had to find out cool techniques of color cycling, shading and so on... No need to mention the copper effect in combination. I think all this together formed a certain Amiga-style gfx. (sometimes similar on MegaDrive) Some old 32 colour Amiga screens look better than a polished modern e.g. Jump´n´run. Don´t get me wrong, a real-time strategy game should be at least in 640 x 480. But handdrawn Action- or even Adventure-titles are good to play in low res even today.

27 August 2006, 19:11	#14
Ironclaw Banned Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: ... Age: 46 Posts: 3,313	Made a 1 min recording of the above stage of Elfmania, to show this old and wonderfull game.... it's in the zone.... it's in mp4, so you need that codec... so if you can't view the movie, install this codec thingy http://www.free-codecs.com/FFDShow_download.htm .

Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)