24 January 2021, 19:06 | #521 | |||
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24 January 2021, 19:12 | #522 | |
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I think it's actually something different altogether and comes under the terminology of "multimedia" system. When my brother got his back in 1991 it came with a keyboard, disk drive and mouse and control pad so I don't think that makes it a console really. But may be I'm wrong? |
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24 January 2021, 20:59 | #523 | ||
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Almost enough to outcome the CD32 hardware advantage. Let's open thread: "What Makes The CDTV better then CD32"? Quote:
@Roondar and others. Please don't stop posting because you can't convince Gilbert. He is not the only one reading your replies, and I personally learnt a lot in this thread. |
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24 January 2021, 22:29 | #524 | |
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And that might give a negative view of the system, while I actually rather like the CD32 even though it has some clear flaws. Now, I personally don't think they're the best Amiga ever (honestly that'd probably be the A500 even though for me personally I had a lot more fun/use out of my A1200), but like I said that doesn't mean I think the CD32 is bad. Last edited by roondar; 25 January 2021 at 00:24. |
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25 January 2021, 00:20 | #525 |
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The premise of the thread is wrong, the cd32 is a gimped 1200 with cdrom, akiko for chunky to planer thats only efficient because its using an 020, 1Kb of NVRam, and MPEG1 add on that was too expensive for your average consumer.
The only good thing to come out of the cd32 is gamepad support. How in gods name would this ever be considered the best amiga is beyond me, A1200 had keyboard, cheap expansion(and upto double performance with cheap fastram), PCMCIA, 2.5" HD ability. Also it had an expansion to upgrade to near A1200 possibilities but again stupidly expensive. Nowadays the CD32 is kinda cool in that its at least upgradeable to close to A1200 but that's it. The CD32 was a dud, Commadore was a dud, they completely missed the business practice of selling consoles below cos and making money on game releases by taking 30% of sales. It also released far too early for games companies to prepare releases hence all the shovelware. This thread is pointless based on the title, if it was called most junk AGA amiga or Commodores second worst Amigs i would agree(CDTV being worst) Last edited by lmimmfn; 25 January 2021 at 00:34. |
25 January 2021, 11:23 | #526 | ||
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Commodore might have went under but you couldn't call them a dud given the success they had for years with the PET, C64, Amiga. They did alright but obviously dropped the ball eventually as many a company has done. Quote:
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25 January 2021, 16:21 | #527 | |
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Yes notice I am not trying to convince other Amiga owners that their machine isn't the best Amiga- even though they are obviously wrong! -------------------------------------------------------------------------- Here is summary of people's choices for the best Amiga so far : 1. A1200 2. A500 3. CD32 4. The Sega Megadrive 5. A4000 6. A1000 7. A2000 8. A600 (no CDTV yet!) |
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25 January 2021, 16:45 | #528 | |
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That was my whole point though - sure the CD32 specs may be misleading but the Megadrive specs are too because unless you know the details of the graphics chip and how sprites are used on a particular machine you can't compare with just stats. All sprite based consoles are completely different and all have different limitations. The CD32 has sprites that can cover the width of the screen AND has a blitter AND an ultra fast and powerful CPU AND a Copper chip AND a CD Drive. That's quite a lot. The Megadrive probaby has a weak soundchip too (amount of channels aside). I haven't looked into it but a lot of consoles can't play sound samples at different pitches and so have to store multiple samples for each note they want to use. The MD could be one of them. It also said about the 320 pixel limit in the earlier link (discussion, btw the Gilbert in that thread is not me. I am not that smart!) I gave you. So I do think this is the case. Musha - not unintentional sprite flicker - but look at how player bullets are displayed on alternate frames - obviously to beat the horizontal sprite limit. Er. I have never said you are a liar or that you are lying about your knowledge of the Megadrive. I think that is excessive to take it like that. But on the other side - you can't say it's the truth and that I shouldn't argue against it - unless you really know that machine in depth and how all the DMA and VRAM business works too. I read what you wrote but seems like all that costs CPU time too, even if DMA is somewhat indpendent - it still really limits how many different graphics images can be used on screen at at a time Well I think in the CPS1 thread we def thought we could get a CPS1 game working in dual playfield mode and with enough colours to look very close. Don't forget it can update display at half the frame rate and still be fast (like Rainbow Islands did and is well loved as a close arcade conversion). And agreed lets end the discussion because seems to be escalating. ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- I'll answer any other responses to me soon. Thanks to the people posting in support of CD32. Is good to hear it has fans. |
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25 January 2021, 17:11 | #529 | ||||||
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Overall though, and this is really important: when I wrote/write that you won't accept the truth I am not talking about individual points, I'm talking about the overall picture - the CD32 just isn't as good as you portray it to be. As such, I'll gladly accept I am wrong about the 320/640 thing, because it doesn't really matter for my point either way. Quote:
The CD32 does not have sprites that can cover the width of the screen unless you limit them to 4 colours each, the Blitter can only do 1/4th the number of objects the MD can display (if we assume the same size), the CPU of the CD32 is only about 2x the speed of the MD one in real life applications (and kind of close to the total CPU power of the 2x 68000 in the MD-CD). I thought the comparison we did was with the Mega CD, so the CD drive is kind of a moot point. The Copper is quite good though and one of my favourite parts of the Amiga. But it generally won't give you the kind of stuff (i.e. raw graphical speed) we've mostly been talking about. Quote:
Anyway, I'm only interested in the truth. Not in pushing one machine over another. If MUSHA is limited by the 320 pixel limit, then I'll accept that. Quote:
Anyway, all GFX actions on both machines cost CPU time and I'm not so sure Amiga GFX operations are actually less CPU intensive to set up than MD GFX operations. If I had to guess, I'd say it's rather the reverse. Quote:
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25 January 2021, 18:02 | #530 |
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@roondar: I've stopped replying to Gilbert in this rubbish thread, as really there's no point
I've noticed a lot of other members doing the same. ...but I've even gone a step further; I don't even check / read now. That's saying a lot; as I guess old habits die hard from being a Global Moderator... I still read all threads. I suggest you do the same, and stop wasting your valuable time / energy replying Last edited by DamienD; 25 January 2021 at 18:17. Reason: Fixed spelling mistakes... |
25 January 2021, 19:10 | #531 |
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Exactly, DamienD.
I already said, this thread would be utterly moot if the CD-ROM drive for the A1200 had been launched, as there would be no NEED for the CD32 AT ALL. But of course, it never was, so... |
25 January 2021, 20:30 | #532 | |
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25 January 2021, 20:46 | #533 |
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25 January 2021, 20:49 | #534 |
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Well done Gilbert for this thread. Great discussion and I’m on your side mostly but ports with out adding extra buttons is inexcusable.
What’s your history? When did you first get one? |
26 January 2021, 17:23 | #535 | ||||
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(that's just a friendly bit of banter btw, I have to make this clear or people get mad at me) Quote:
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I mean I probably agree the Mega CD is more powerful in some ways (it has that mode 7 + thing too), but I do think the CD32 could beat most "normal" Megadrive games Jungle Strike on CD32 is probably a good example, and that's just a conversion. And the Megadrive could never do something like Gloom Deluxe (which isn;t even using CD32 to the full). Sure there are games that use the Megadrive hardware to the max but the CD32 could do very good versions of those - if not completely copy them. As for sprites - what you say about the CD32 I'm sure is right but I would guess if either of us coded a Megadrive game we would probably find out some more limitations it has - like drawing to map tiles in VRAM must be slow (I would guess that is how the 3D games work) but CD32 can display 128 sprites also and I think it can maybe tile the same big sprite twice horizontally on a screen? (can it do this? just asking) So if that's true it could fill the screen with 16 colour sprites. Also it can do transparency (like the clouds in banshee) and color blending which the MD can't do legit ( I guess it could display a sprite/playfield on alternate frames on a CRT but that's not as flexible). And like I said the sound on the CD32 is much better than the Megadrive, so overall the CD32 could be the more capable Seems like the only thing the MD is better at is - load times, and slightly better at moving more objects/sprites around. Fightin Spirit looks way better than any MD one-on-one fighter - more colours, more background animation, better music and it was probably just made by a couple of guys in a barn. Quote:
Apart from that I like CD32 a lot.Yes those shovelware games are shocking - how long would it take it change a few line of code?? (A1200 owners love those games as they are though....) But I started to get some good games for CD32 about 1-2 years ago. Just became a bigger fan since then, and I love the console and reading about it. Screenshots in magazines for CD32 look great and I like reading about when they enhance games for it - like Fire & Ice. You have a CD32 too? Last edited by Gilbert; 26 January 2021 at 17:28. |
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26 January 2021, 21:23 | #536 |
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I just can't believe how he's managed to extract a months worth of blatant trolling. I honestly can't comprehend how anyone can waste their time with the guy - I had his number well before Christmas.
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26 January 2021, 22:32 | #537 | |
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No more CD32 hating in this this thread please! |
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26 January 2021, 22:44 | #538 |
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Joking or not, this is trolling at its best - subtle trolling.
You see, as many have come to realise and as I've said before you're simply an idiot. You write stuff that gets people's backs up and then when they respond to you with pure FACT you redirect and bend the discussion to suit your needs, which is to further fuel the thread and carry on the pointless discussion. The thread should have been closed around Christmas eve, lots of time would have been saved doing so. Last edited by mcgeezer; 26 January 2021 at 22:50. |
26 January 2021, 22:45 | #539 | |
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I'd rather have: A) My fully-featured and expandable A1200 with optional HDD and the CD-ROM drive added via the PCMCIA port, with maybe a bit of circuitry inside including Akiko for compatibility's sake, than B) A much more limited CD32 with a massive box plugged into the bigger expansion slot in the back with all of the A1200 ports in it, and that's before I have to plug in a keyboard purchased separately, and in the end it looking like a weird Frankensteinian hodge-podge When honestly, the option A) is better and much more elegant, not to mention, as I suspect, cheaper. |
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26 January 2021, 22:57 | #540 | |
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I was a little critical of the hardware earlier in this thread but for solely playing games it's nice with the right controller. (I had five CD32s a while ago.) ..be nice if someone could refresh the CD32 with a slot loading mechanism, internal enhancements (new system board perhaps? ).... |
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