DUNE Remake version AGA

[Team_Hoi]

Originally Posted by Team_Hoi

I like using specialized AI models for processing pixel art in the chaiNNer application…

chaiNNer (read the introduction text for info)

Pixel art AI models (can be used in chaiNNer)

chaiNNer Discord (for answers to chaiNNer usage questions)

Enhance Everything Discord (for general info and tips regarding enhancement and upscaling)

Examples of what's possible

Have fun!

Just to make sure there's no misunderstanding: these are AI-aided image processing tools, such as upscalers, JPEG compression fixers, denoisers, etcetera. Not generative AI with prompts, as the self-proclaimed "AI artists" are using.

[saimon69]

Originally Posted by Bren McGuire

no you cannot and that is not what i am asking but then the problem is different if people do not want to pay what is worth to do a handcrafted game i think most of the "consumers" especially in this "community" have incredibly unrealistic expectations of independent games

Welcome to the Amiga community! First time? ^_______^

[sokolovic]

Originally Posted by Team_Hoi

Just to make sure there's no misunderstanding: these are AI-aided image processing tools, such as upscalers, JPEG compression fixers, denoisers, etcetera. Not generative AI with prompts, as the self-proclaimed "AI artists" are using.

And that is probably what it is used in the Dune remake. Graphics are clearly not just a prompt on a machine.

[sokolovic]

Originally Posted by Bren McGuire

no you cannot and that is not what i am asking but then the problem is different if people do not want to pay what is worth to do a handcrafted game i think most of the "consumers" especially in this "community" have incredibly unrealistic expectations of independent games

It is not only about what people want to pay but what market you're aiming at and the amount of hours you can spend to make a game that would be bought by 500/1000 people at the end.
People pays for Amiga game but not in a volume that could justify spending thousands hours on it expecting them to be paid at a full price per hours (you would'nt buy many Amiga games at 250€ would you, even is they where fully "handcrafted" and perfectly polished ?).
There is modern tools to facilitate this work and prevent it to be too much time consuming so they should be used (and are, in fact used. AI isn't just a prompt on a search engine).

[gimbal]

Originally Posted by cloverskull

Auto-generated maps are part of what makes Roguelikes so fun, though! I know, I know, OT.

No that is actually the least fun part of such games, they have to thrive on perfect gameplay. The levels are soulless.

[TCD]

Originally Posted by sokolovic

And that is probably what it is used in the Dune remake. Graphics are clearly not just a prompt on a machine.

Which is why it's a bit disappointing to see (not only here) the 'if it uses AI it is worthless' attitude towards this or any other game.

[Predseda]

More than graphics I would be afraid of right holders.

[modrobert]

Originally Posted by Bren McGuire

not a dick question at all very good question and i welcome discussing topics like this

yes i would rather not have a game made at all this way especially since this is a remake i value quality and craftmanship above everything

to clarify i am not against "computer generation" as a tool to create content that is systematic i am against "let an algorithm pretend to be an artist" i do not think there is a replacement for humans in that regard and results are always horrible no matter how much a real human "trained" those algorithms

I agree about craftsmanship and quality by human artists, but still think those creating the game (actually doing something) should feel free to use whatever tools they want.

That said, when the game characters look like modern stock photo actors with oil paint filter applied, completely losing the original character comic book style in the process, it will definitely impact my review score in a negative way.

[BSzili]

They are of course free to use whatever tool they want, just like people are free to voice their opinion about it. The new character graphics of AI origin (I hope this is PC enough ) have a completely different style from the originals. If the goal was to save time, then the PC version already has 256 color graphics that can be converted in much less time.

[Aardvark]

Originally Posted by BSzili

They are of course free to use whatever tool they want, just like people are free to voice their opinion about it. The new character graphics of AI origin (I hope this is PC enough ) have a completely different style from the originals. If the goal was to save time, then the PC version already has 256 color graphics that can be converted in much less time.

This is not 1:1 remake though, as the developer stated that he will add new content and characters, as well as making each existing sietches unique.

[copse]

Originally Posted by Bren McGuire

not a dick question at all very good question and i welcome discussing topics like this

yes i would rather not have a game made at all this way especially since this is a remake i value quality and craftmanship above everything

to clarify i am not against "computer generation" as a tool to create content that is systematic i am against "let an algorithm pretend to be an artist" i do not think there is a replacement for humans in that regard and results are always horrible no matter how much a real human "trained" those algorithms

I think there is an overlap here with food labelling. In an ideal world food made with something that people want to avoid should be clearly labelled, whether this is GM (genetically modified) ingredients or seed oils or meat or or gluten or whatever. In the real world unfortunately, this is not adhered to clearly, consistently or even at all.

I sort of feel like non-skilled use of AI can indeed be something deleterious to the viewer, where it smooths out things in ways that are unnatural for instance and you may not be quite sure but you're being uncanny vallied. In an ideal world any use of AI for asset creation should be labelled.

[copse]

Originally Posted by Bruce Abbott

I'm against auto-generated maps and 'fractal' terrain for the same reason.

Procedural generation was huge back in the day, but unfortunately it created bland mish-mash. Humans can also create bland mish-mash. But good humans could use procedural generation as a base and flesh it out. We see the most modern form of this in the new Unreal 5 PCG.

[ Show youtube player ]

IMO it is reasonable to assume that the use of AI will facilitate skilled humans to create better stuff and lesser skilled humans to create more bland mish-mash.

[copse]

Originally Posted by Team_Hoi

Just to make sure there's no misunderstanding: these are AI-aided image processing tools, such as upscalers, JPEG compression fixers, denoisers, etcetera. Not generative AI with prompts, as the self-proclaimed "AI artists" are using.

This is very interesting, thanks for sharing the links! It'd be great if we could have a thread here where people who follow these things can share information about it and possibly tips on how to use it for Amiga games.

[Fery]

One of my favorite games, awesome!

[gimbal]

I like how there is a Dune resurgence now. All kinds of Youtube channels revisiting the old Dune games. LGR did the original Dune game a couple of days ago for example.

But most notably Stephane Picq came out of hiding and did a remaster of the Dune: Spice Opera soundtrack (https://www.youtube.com/@StephanePicqDune/videos, https://stphanepicq.bandcamp.com/alb...-2024-remaster). What a time to be alive.

[cloverskull]

Y'know, I never got into the Dune games back in the day. How straightforward is it to jump in and figure things out?

[TCD]

Originally Posted by cloverskull

Y'know, I never got into the Dune games back in the day. How straightforward is it to jump in and figure things out?

Not that hard for both of them I'd say. The Cryo game introduces you to the game mechanics bit by bit and the Westwood game is quite easy to get into even if you have never played another RTS before.

[sokolovic]

Last news, the game will be 640*200 and use 512 colors at once on screen. It will be divided in 6 chapter. Chapter 1 is currently being finished and will be released as a demo.
(And don't underestimate French developpers, some of the greatest Amiga games ever made were done by French).

[Predseda]

Originally Posted by sokolovic

(And don't underestimate French developpers, some of the greatest Amiga games ever made were done by French).

Dune, for example ;-)

[Hedeon]

Originally Posted by sokolovic

(And don't underestimate French developpers, some of the greatest Amiga games ever made were done by French).

I love North vs South!