PAL Hires, but with overscan of 1024 x 384 - possible?

[mingle]

Hi,

This is one which may be related to the actual overscan limitations of the various Amiga screen-modes, but I'll post it here anyway, since it's specific to the use of the good old PAL Hires mode in WinUAE :-)

I'd like to be able to open a native Amiga PAL Hires screen (in full-screen mode, but with NO scaling/resizing) that takes advantage of the full resolution of my LCD monitor (1024x768), I also want it to show scanlines, for that authentic PAL Hires experience! :-)

I've included a couple of pics showing what I mean:

The first is what I currently get in WinUAE when I run native full-screen, using PAL Hires at maximum overscan (724 x 283) - I've left borderblank off, to show the screen area that's essentially 'wasted'...

The second pic is what I'd like - it's a PAL Hires screen of 1024 x 384, which completely fills my 1024x768 screen.

It's possible to specify a PAL Hires screen of 1024 x 384 in the Screen Mode prefs, but the overscan prefs only allow a maximum 724 x 283, so the screen just auto-scrolls...

What I'd like to know is would it be possible to somehow hack the Workbench overscan prefs/limits to allow overscan values of 1024x384, or am I dreaming? :-)

Any comments or suggestions greatly appreciated!

Cheers,

Mike.

[thomas]

Put HighGfx into Devs/Monitors, then try again.

http://aminet.net/package/driver/moni/HighGFX40_6

[mingle]

Ah, Thomas, you beat me to it!

I was going to say I've already used HighGFX, BUT it doesn't have those all-important SCANLINES!

Only PAL Hires (with scanlines) will do!

Mike.

[Toni Wilen]

Scanlines don't work (don't exist) in doublescanned modes.
Use D3D filter scanlines/overlays or someone needs to create highgfx-like monitor file without doublescanning.

Everything is possible because emulator allows all kinds of weird modes/refresh rate combinations that would be impossible normally.

[thomas]

I think this is something Toni needs to add to WinUAE. HighGfx:SuperHires non-laced should be as high as HighGfx:SuperHires non-laced (with double or scanlines applied), but it isn't. It is squeezed.

Edit: Toni was faster...

[Toni Wilen]

Superhires = 4x but there is only linedoubling, no linequadrupling (not worth the trouble), easier to use 2xfilter.

[mingle]

Interesting comments guys...

Is there any likelyhood of such a GFX tweak being added to WinUAE?

Cheers,

Mike.

[mingle]

Hi Toni,

Could you please move this thread into req.UAE Wishlist?

:-)

Thanks,

Mike.

[Toni Wilen]

prb.WinUAE is better forum because there are missing features in "non-standard" display emulation, for example all filtered modes only show max 752x572 pixels and more..

Monitor drivers are external to WinUAE.

[thomas]

Originally Posted by Toni Wilen

Superhires = 4x but there is only linedoubling, no linequadrupling (not worth the trouble), easier to use 2xfilter.

Not sure what you mean. HighGfx 1024x768 is displayed full screen with 1:1 aspect. HighGfx 1024x384 is squeezed to half height with 1:1 aspect. IMHO it should be displayed full screen with 1:2 aspect.

1024x768 is interlaced, i.e. each image is already stretched to fit the screen with the odd lines drawn first and the even lines drawn next.

1024x384 is same mode but not interlaced, so naturally it should have scanlines or should be doubled, depending on the display setting.

Just like switching from PAL 640x512 (interlaced) to PAL 640x256 (non-interlaced).

Note that although the 1024xXXX modes are called "superhires" they do *not* need the superhires display setting (unlike PAL:superhires)

[Toni Wilen]

I was thinking about "real" superhires 1280x256 -style resolutions that have wrong aspect ratio without vertical scaling.

Anyway, not all "weird" modes guess scan doubling correctly.

[Ratte]

HGFX 1024x384 with scanlines is working on my setup.

SuperHires 35ns - Mode & Scanline activated.

[mingle]

@Toni,

fair enough...

@Ratte,

I'd be very curious to know your exact WinUAE/Workbench monitor settings.

I've tried using the HighGFX Super-Hires (1024x384), but I can't get scanlines going - it still only fills the top 1/2 of my screen.

I thought that HigHGFX was loosely based on one of the AGA scan-doubled modes (Super72?), so how do you get the scanlines to display?

Cheers,

Mike.

[mingle]

As Ratte mentioned, he was able to get HGFX 1024x384 with scanlines working.

Apparently it doesn't work with the current version of WinUAE, but did work one earlier versions (not sure which version).

Cheers,

Mike.

[Toni Wilen]

After some testing..

Doublescanned modes can never support Display panel scanlines. They don't have scanlines and don't have space for them (it was a bug if they did work previously)

Filter panel D3D scanlines work perfectly fine and they are also much better compared to Display panel scanlines because they are "free" and adjustable and are always 1:1 mapped to display pixels, scaling won't make them ugly.

Even more interesting D3D scanlines can be enabled by using overlay masks.

btw, I was wrong about max display size in filters, just enable superhires to fix partially missing display if mode's maxhpos is larger than standard, filter positioning probably needed to center it, autoscale should also work perfectly with these modes.

[Toni Wilen]

and more.. In next version programmed display modes (= DBLPAL, HIGHGFX etc.. everything except PAL/NTSC and UAE) will be always centered (using autoscale parameters) in filtered modes.

It should be perfectly safe because programmed modes rarely if ever use copper tricks that can confuse autoscale calculations and it will look much better..

note that it is centered using autoscale display detection parameters, not scaled. Autoscale is still available normally if enabled.

[Ratte]

Originally Posted by Toni Wilen

and more.. In next version programmed display modes (= DBLPAL, HIGHGFX etc.. everything except PAL/NTSC and UAE) will be always centered (using autoscale parameters) in filtered modes.

It should be perfectly safe because programmed modes rarely if ever use copper tricks that can confuse autoscale calculations and it will look much better..

note that it is centered using autoscale display detection parameters, not scaled. Autoscale is still available normally if enabled.

Could be nice, if you add an checkmark for it.
Sometimes ... often .. uae helped me developing screenmodes.
(But I think all usefull custommodes are done ... HGFX,HD720,XTREM,SUPER+)

[Toni Wilen]

Originally Posted by Ratte

Could be nice, if you add an checkmark for it.
Sometimes ... often .. uae helped me developing screenmodes.
(But I think all usefull custommodes are done ... HGFX,HD720,XTREM,SUPER+)

Does it really matter? UAE screen in programmed modes can't be really used even for approximate centering on real monitors anyway and you can always make displayable area larger if needed.

Or just disable filters

[Toni Wilen]

Test version attached if someone is interested in programmed modes. They should work better now.

- no more right border background "colorbleed"
- tall modes don't have bottom part clipped in filtered modes ("superhires" resolution mode also increases reserved height area)
- always centered in filtered modes

(always center will be removed, it breaks screen dragging, not sure why I forgot that. autocenter becomes selectable in autoscale select box)

http://www.winuae.net/files/b/winuae.zip

[mingle]

Hi Toni,

I've just tried the WinUAE 2.2.1 Beta 4 with my ClassicWB config, running PAL SuperHires (with the resolution set to 1280x512), which is the optimum horizontal resolution for my 1280x1024 LCD screen.

I've attached a couple of screenshots of my same config, one running under WinUAE 2.2.0 and the second under WinUAE 2.2.1 Beta 4 - there is a slight difference inBeta 4 - the 'blank' grey area at the bottom of the screen.

As you can see the 1280x512 screen (with scanlines enabled) only fills the top half (vertical resolution) of my screen - essentially displaying 1280x256. I have autoscroll enabled in my Workbench Screenmode prefs, so I can see the bottom half when I move the mouse-pointer down the screen.

What I'd like is to have the full 1280x512 screen area displayed without having to autoscroll.

Is this something that should be possible in WinUAE, or would a special screen mode (ala HighGFX) need to be written to enable PAL SuperHires 1280x512 (non-interlaced) and I guess 1280x1024 interlaced :-)

Cheers,

Mike.