PC games that made the Amiga look like Shit

[Megalomaniac]

Launching the A570 just as the machines that could use it were being scrapped was a clumsy move, even for Commodore. Did they ever release a CD-ROM drive for the A600? Only A500+s and internally-upgraded A500s could make full use of it (I believe most CDTV titles actually did work with 512k Chip and 512k other memory, but the A570 was generally presented as needing 1Mb Chip RAM. It was going to be the A690 (to parallel with the A590 hard drive) until the intended budget A300 turned out to cost as much to make as the A500+, so it became the replacement A600 instead. Personally I think they should have scrapped the A600, as it alienated more people than it was ever going to attract, but that's another story.

You could pirate a CD-ROM of course, but writable (let alone rewritable) CD drives were unaffordable for most people for a few years, so it would have killed off bedroom piracy for a while.

Personally I have a fierce hatred of most early CD-ROM exclusive games (on PC, Mega CD or what few the CDTV or CD32 got), as most are completely devoid of gameplay behind the cinematics, which were almost never as well acted or scripted as even a 2-star film. Whether making the available more quickly to only a handful of Amiga users would have actually helped the Amiga longer-term is debatable.

[lmimmfn]

Commodore made an absolute mess of CD-ROM on the Amiga, as said, too early in CDTV, too late for A500, and no official option for the A1200 which is the machine which would have had the most advantage with it(increased sizes of 256 colour gfx etc.) along with allowing for PC versions of games requiring hard drives.

Back in the day in 93/94 I really wanted a CD-ROM for my A1200 and later when Amiga Format had CDs with the magazine made me want it more but I had no interest in hacking my A1200 into a tower or having some other hacked solution.

[sokolovic]

Plus Commodore delaying CD1200 because "if you want a an Amiga CD just buy a CD32"...It was David Pleasance words.
He made great moves, the Batman pack particularly, but everything CD related was a disaster. Like putting DANGEROUS STREETS in bundle with the CD32.

[Megalomaniac]

Knowing Commodore I'm surprised they didn't bundle a game requiring a keyboard with the CD32, but Dangerous Streets was probably the worst of a few awful games bundled with Amigas down the years (most of the other bad ones were at least commercially attractive licenses such as Captain Planet or Nightbreed, or at least technically impressive like Epic or Beast II), but that David Pleasance comment suggests zero understanding of what CD games could offer. A keyboard and mouse massively expand the possibilities for game design, as did having 880k disks to save game positions. Definitely a missed opportunity.

[Marce]

I just remembered another lame Amiga game from the era

F1GP by microprose (1991)

the amiga version is very very bad compared to the PC version which is much more smooth, better gfx, more and better sound fx, etc

[Megalomaniac]

Again marce, you're in a small minority if you consider Amiga F1GP to be lame. Maybe it was slightly better on a PC costing 3 times as much (that stayed cutting edge for a third as long) but it kept plenty of people racing for years. You can turn the detail level down slightly if you find it too slow.

[Marce]

Originally Posted by Megalomaniac

Again marce, you're in a small minority if you consider Amiga F1GP to be lame. Maybe it was slightly better on a PC costing 3 times as much (that stayed cutting edge for a third as long) but it kept plenty of people racing for years. You can turn the detail level down slightly if you find it too slow.

well I know that lot of amiga users liked F1GP on the era, and fact is that I had 2 friends who love it, but I never liked or played it because was so slow and lame , I played Vroom instead which was fast and smooth

but watching this in a real perspective, the miggy game was very inferior to the PC version

[Mad-Matt]

F1GP was a pack in game with my A600. I put a lot of time into that game and enjoyed no matter the chugging framerate. Just like the pc game though it gets better with more cpu power. It runs ok on an an 1200 and smooth with an 030 when patched to 25fps like the pc game. I doubt the pc game would be much fun to play on a 1986 pc like the amstrad 1640.

[Megalomaniac]

Its a shame F1GP was speedlocked when originally released. Once you'd unlocked it to take full advantage of quicker processors, it was as quick on Amigas and PCs of the same power. The PC version looked slightly better with the right kit though - obviously an AGA update would have erased that minor issue.

And, while I'm repeating myself a bit, you're comparing an A500 which cost £400 when this game was released in late 1991 with a £1000 286 or £2000 386 PC at that time (the PC version of F1GP was 1992, but that's splitting hairs), and the A500 kept getting good new games for a lot longer than the 286 (and about as long as the 386, especially a 386SX). If money was no object or you needed it for something serious then maybe a PC was worth it by 1991, though you'd need something else as well if you wanted to play action games, but Amigas were still far better value for money and more future proof.

[sokolovic]

Absolutely no one thought that F1GP was lame on the Amiga, even compared to PCs. That's rewriting History to say that.

[Seiya]

agreed.
F1GP on PC is identical to Amiga version a part texture on the road and the grass close the road. PC version has 256 colors, but again Amiga version is very close to PC version.
Performance in these 3D games depends from processor.

[dr.zeissler]

WingCommander1 386/VGA/MT-32 was the game changer.

[Zak]

When I think about 1991, the thing about PC was that everything was just much faster and more convenient than on Amiga. Games like Battle Isle played much more smooth on a 386. Even stuff like calculating Mandelbrots was more fun on PC.

You can always claim that on an accelerated Amiga, Battle Isle would be a charm. But who had accelerated Amigas anyway in 1991 and you always had the problem that the software didn't run on accelerated Amigas because of hardware incompatibility (Battle Isle does run on 68030 but not higher than that without WHDload but many games that could have used more power didn't even accept an 020).

Also, at my school we had a selfmade simple network multiplayer game, a topdown view labyrinth where simple figures ran through the maze shooting with lasers that reflected from the walls. What I want to stress out is that no Amiga user would ever have such network technology available anywhere even with enough money on his hands and that you couldn't easily use Turbo Pascal to make such a game for it. When you wanted something done useable on Amiga you would always need to use Seka Assembler which is something I never understood how to use and is complicated AF.

That's also something that the Amiga never had the professional software of the PC and even when it was just something like a good mathematics program at the time or any other program we used at the school PC's in 1991. It was only ever a gaming console. My most favorite gaming console though.

[Bruce Abbott]

Originally Posted by dr.zeissler

WingCommander1 386/VGA/MT-32 was the game changer.

I've never played it. Actually I've never even seen it on a PC, even though I sold and serviced PCs from before 1990 to 2002. I don't think I have ever seen a Roland MT-32 either.

Wing Commander

The game was considered a major step forward for space dogfight games, featuring graphics, audio, and a story...

Woohoo!

Chris Crawford said of Wing Commander that it "raised the bar for the whole industry", as the game was five times more expensive to create than most of its contemporaries. Because the game was highly successful, other publishers had to match its production value in order to compete. This forced a large portion of the video game industry to become more conservative, as larger budgets required greater sales to be profitable

Now we know who to blame for lack of innovation in the video game industry.

[ExiE]

Originally Posted by TCD

That's Amiga (in the 90s) for you. Yes, and Day Of The Tentancle could have gotten a really neat (minus the speech) port on the A1200, but at that time LucasArts didn't think about it anymore.

During my Czech Amiga News days, I get the information from one of the ex-LucasArts employee. The DOTT was under development for Amiga. 64 color gfx was nearly done, no music so far. Than cancelled. I still may have the email somewhere.

[Bruce Abbott]

Originally Posted by Zak

You can always claim that on an accelerated Amiga, Battle Isle would be a charm. But who had accelerated Amigas anyway in 1991

I did. So did several of my friends. Not that you needed one when there was such a vast library of games that ran fine without acceleration.

..and you always had the problem that the software didn't run on accelerated Amigas because of hardware incompatibility (Battle Isle does run on 68030 but not higher than that without WHDload but many games that could have used more power didn't even accept an 020).

Partially true, but most accelerated systems could be downgraded to run those naughty A500 only games.

PCs had similar problems too, particularly with older games that ran too fast. That's why many PCs had a 'turbo' button to slow the CPU down. With newer games you had the opposite problem (too slow, which only a massive cash infusion could fix), and of course getting drivers working without running out of memory was always a struggle.

Also, at my school we had a selfmade simple network multiplayer game, a topdown view labyrinth where simple figures ran through the maze shooting with lasers that reflected from the walls. What I want to stress out is that no Amiga user would ever have such network technology available anywhere even with enough money on his hands

Guess I must have just imagined having a network card in my A3000 then.

1989: Commodore introduces the A560 ARCnet expansion for the A500. It has 300kB/s transfer rate (faster than the A590 hard drive!) autoboot ROM, and up to 1MB FastRAM on board.

1989: Creative Microsystems create a MultiPort card for the A2000, which includes an RS422 port with AppleTalk networking software.

1990: Commodore produces the A2065 Ethernet card for the A2000.

1990: Hydra Systems release their AmigaNet 500 Ethernet expansion for the A500, which is just their Amiganet Zorro II card in a box with Zorro I adapter. GVP market the same card under their own name.

1991: Progressive Peripherals & Software introduce their DoubleTalk AppleTalk interface for the A500, networking up to 32 Amigas and supporting distributive software.

1992: Hydra Systems develop the AmigaNet PCMCIA card for the A600 and A1200.

1994: Interworks sell their iCard PCMCIA Ethernet card for the A1200.

1997: Bruce Abbott releases the first open-source driver for PCMCIA Ethernet cards on the Amiga. "They said it couldn't be done".

...and that you couldn't easily use Turbo Pascal to make such a game for it.

Sadly Turbo Pascal was never ported to the Amiga (they announced it in 1985 with a big flashy advert in the first issue of Amiga World magazine, but nothing came of it). But plenty of other programming languages were available.

When you wanted something done useable on Amiga you would always need to use Seka Assembler which is something I never understood how to use and is complicated AF.

So you never heard of Hisoft DevPac, Hisoft BASIC, AMOS, Blitz BASIC, Lattice C, Amiga E, Oberon?

[Weasel Fierce]

"Amiga Whinging Syndrome" is so strong now we are moving into revisionist history!

Amiga World and Amazing Computing ran articles about using your Amiga online from the very beginning in 85. It was a very popular option too. Network cards showed up for the big box machines too quite early as mentioned above.

Hard drives were advertised for the Amiga from 1985 onwards, accelerator boards showed up early too and were pretty widely advertised. Plenty of people bought them.

When I got back into Amiga circa 2010, I ran floppy disk games on my 030 A1200 for a few years and I am hard pressed to think of any game that didn't work just fine. Im sure theres one out there, but "always" problems is clearly not true.
As noted above, the Amiga handles it far better than DOS PCs get. Most Amiga games wont get screwed up speed-wise and more games than you think benefit from a bit more CPU.


Good lord.

At this rate by next year, the story will be that the Amiga was never actually invented

[sokolovic]

Originally Posted by ExiE

During my Czech Amiga News days, I get the information from one of the ex-LucasArts employee. The DOTT was under development for Amiga. 64 color gfx was nearly done, no music so far. Than cancelled. I still may have the email somewhere.

Wow, that's an interesting information ! 64 colors would have been a nice choice IMHO.
This was the game that I really wanted to see on the Amiga, much more than Doom. I would have definitively bought an Hard Drive if it was necessary to play it.

[TCD]

Originally Posted by ExiE

During my Czech Amiga News days, I get the information from one of the ex-LucasArts employee. The DOTT was under development for Amiga. 64 color gfx was nearly done, no music so far. Than cancelled. I still may have the email somewhere.

Interesting. Would be great if you could find that email.

[grond]

I always believed the low hardware specs of the base configuration over such a long period of time were the biggest problem of the Amiga going into the 90s and thought slow CPU and missing chunky pixels in an already slow graphics system. This thread made me realise that both would have been less of a factor in strategy games, RPGs and similar which actually are the type of games I enjoy most. Clearly the market transformed from the 8-bit era where many platforms got technically very diverse ports of a given game into one where nobody bothered porting games from the PC but rather tackled the next PC project instead. Nontheless the contrast between the number and quality of new titles for the Amiga and the PC might have been less crass, if the Amiga had had a widely adopted mass storage medium. I now realise that the lack of this probably was a much bigger factor than slow CPUs and graphics.

DD floppies clearly were a problem (not making HD a standard for AGA Amigas probably was a big mistake that also made AGA-only games less likely to appear). Perhaps it would also have been a wise move to put IDE into the A500+ and ship every AGA computer with an HDD so that developers could rely on an HDD being present.