Sonnet 7200 PCI programming

[grelbfarlk]

Originally Posted by spudje

Yes, I thought so too, but my first 3000 with black heatsink still reported as 3000. Maybe flashed firmware? Anyway I'm hoping I'm finally on the road to success

On the Voodoos I have the big silver ones that have the pushpins through the heatsink are the V3-3000@166MHz and the ones with the smaller black heatsink glued to the chip are 143MHz. If you're in doubt you might consider underclocking it down to 143MHz in the Devs:Monitors/Voodoo tooltype.

[trixster]

Interesting reading regarding Deneb DMA incompatibilities with mediator 4000Di. I wonder if those issues had been addressed by the time the final firmware was released for the Deneb? I ask this because in all other instances the Deneb appears to work fine in DMA mode - I've copied several GB of stuff from ide to Deneb USB stick with no issues, and I can run mp3s off a USB stick on the Deneb to the prisma megamix with no issue. The only lockup occurs when trying to execute Sonnet stuff from a USB stick when the Deneb is in DMA mode.

[alexh]

Originally Posted by trixster

Interesting reading regarding Deneb DMA incompatibilities with mediator 4000Di. I wonder if those issues had been addressed by the time the final firmware was released for the Deneb?

You have V11 firmware? It has :

Originally Posted by Michael Bohemer

* Mediator workaround.
Fixes DMA related errors when a certain Mediator model is in the system.
Zorro III address setup and hold time is increased to ensure operation with that bus board.

Ask Michael Bohemer? He's a very amenable guy who usually responds.

Originally Posted by trixster

I ask this because in all other instances the Deneb appears to work fine in DMA mode - I've copied several GB of stuff from ide to Deneb USB stick with no issues, and I can run mp3s off a USB stick on the Deneb to the prisma megamix with no issue. The only lockup occurs when trying to execute Sonnet stuff from a USB stick when the Deneb is in DMA mode.

I don't know how the Sonnet works. Or how it interacts with AmigaOS. The USB stack, Poseidon, together with the Deneb driver determine how and where the data gets from USB into RAM. Perhaps these USB read data buffers are in a particular RAM location not accessible via Sonnet? Can the Sonnet access all RAM in the system? CHIP RAM, motherboard FAST RAM, Zorro III FAST RAM etc.?

[Hedeon]

Originally Posted by alexh

I don't know how the Sonnet works. Or how it interacts with AmigaOS. The USB stack, Poseidon, together with the Deneb driver determine how and where the data gets from USB into RAM. Perhaps these USB read data buffers are in a particular RAM location not accessible via Sonnet? Can the Sonnet access all RAM in the system? CHIP RAM, motherboard FAST RAM, Zorro III FAST RAM etc.?

Answer is 'No' to all those. When the Sonnet tries to access that RAM a PPC exception is generated and the 68K is ordered through an INT2 to put the requested data in PCI memory where the Sonnet can pick it up.

Or when storing; then the 68K is ordered to pick it up from PCI memory and write it to the memory ranges you mention above. takes 300 microseconds per write or read. Thought about buffering, but not a lot of programs suffer from it. Only those that write directly to Paula like PayBack WOS.

Other way around: The 68K can access PCI memory at CHIP mem speed.

Loading from USB should work though. LoadSeg() which is 68K picks up the WOS executable and puts it in Sonnet RAM. Maybe if the PPC then needs data from the USB it hangs?

[alexh]

Interesting stuff.

Out of curiosity does the same apply for PCI cards? Do the PCI device drivers normally run on the 68k and PCI data passes between Sonnet RAM and Amiga 68k RAM? Even though they could *in theory* stay completely within the PCI memory space?

[Hedeon]

68k drivers can access pci config and memory through the Zorro-pci bridge. Most pci cards don't require DMA stuff. The ones that do like 100MBit Ethernet cards and NEC USB cards use a part of the VGA memory to put data in. Problem can be screen mode switching from LE to BE and vice versa.

The sonnet PPC can directly access the pci config and memory from its side of the bridge. Only Warp3DPPC is a driver that works directly, I think.

[spudje]

Yeah, more testing still stable CSPPC setup. More than an hour of Quake2. Payback worked as well (PPC version). I only have a weird issue with Wipeout. I only have audio in windowed mode, no audio in full screen mode, regardless whether AHI is checked or not. I didn't have this problem on my previous setup, so maybe due to a different AHI version?

Well, anyway, I guess it's on to the next steps:
1. rearrange PCI cards (add Sonnet and LAN and put Voodoo in different slot) See if that still works with CSPPC
2. Clone setup and configure it for the Sonnet and test!

[Hedeon]

Payback is not a good game to test the sonnet btw due to hardware banging.

[spudje]

Yes I know, but I only played it in AGA and really wanted to see it on a full spec Amiga

[spudje]

OK before really doing my next steps I wanted to fix the Wipeout audio issue and I did and my setup still seems stable.

First I downgraded AHI to 4.18, this didn't help, but fortunately everything still seems stable.
Then I changed some ENVs, so deviating from https://github.com/Sakura-IT/SonnetA...ki/Good-Config
VoodooMem to 15 (was 13)
Memsize to 8 (was not set)

And then audio worked and as an added bonus Wipeout actually works with full texture memory. Before this I had to lower it below 1,5 MB. And, system still stable! And I even also already added my BigRAMplus again.

[Hedeon]

CyberstormPPC is not the same as Sonnet regarding the amount of zorro space you need. It can clash with the BigRAMPlus. The Sonnet I mean.

But grats on making it all work on the CSPPC :-)

Originally Posted by spudje

OK before really doing my next steps I wanted to fix the Wipeout audio issue and I did and my setup still seems stable.

First I downgraded AHI to 4.18, this didn't help, but fortunately everything still seems stable.
Then I changed some ENVs, so deviating from https://github.com/Sakura-IT/SonnetA...ki/Good-Config
VoodooMem to 15 (was 13)
Memsize to 8 (was not set)

And then audio worked and as an added bonus Wipeout actually works with full texture memory. Before this I had to lower it below 1,5 MB. And, system still stable! And I even also already added my BigRAMplus again.

[trixster]

I have a ZorRam 256mb here working ok so I would assume a BigRamPlus would be ok too.

[spudje]

Yeah, I had no doubt it would work. I just removed it to focus testing on bare minimum setup. Now I'm building it up again and the BigRAMplus was already in there yesterday. So hopefully I can also contribute some photos in your mediator 4000di thread

[spudje]

Too bad, so far for the euphoria... With everything in place again:
PCI from top to bottom
- PCI LAN card (not operational yet, no software installed)
- Sonnet (not operational yet, no software installed)
- Voodoo3
- bracket with Ratte Switch (operational)
- mediator bridgeboard

Zorro from top to bottom
- BigRAMPlus
- empty
- Highway USB (not operational yet, no software installed)
- mediator bridgeboard

The machine starts crashing again, not so quickly and frequently as the previous setup, but surely. I am pretty convinced now that this is heat, the voodoo gets quite a bit hotter with the other cards around it then when sitting there all by itself in the A4k.

I don't think I have the patience to follow a step (card) by step (card) approach. I think I first am gonna install the Sonnet again and see if I as a simple end user see much difference in speed etc. If not I may consider selling the Sonnet and rearrange the rest of the cards in a less heat generating configuration. Running that initial stable CSPPC + Voodoo setup was already very fast and enjoyable in itself. If the sonnet shows a lot of perceivable improvement I still may consider the step by step approach.

[Hedeon]

Did you use the csppc for anything? I mean the ppc side like for games or anything else? Otherwise if you are enjoying it now it is all 68k and the sonnet won't add to that.

If you sell it, consider to sell to a developer.

[trixster]

It could be a power issue. A system like yours with all those cards and a CSPPC will be rather power hungry. Now you've put a load of PCI and zorro cards in it as well, if the psu isn't able to handle everything it could be the source of your instability.

Regarding whether the sonnet is perceptibly faster than the CSPPC - well I have never had a CSPPC so I can't provide you with first hand evidence, but Wrangler and I discussed this a few months ago and he found the 400mhz sonnet to be roughly twice the speed of a 360mhz CSPPC in quake 1 and quake 2 timedemos.

[spudje]

Yes power could be an issue, but it would be odd as I have a real "Chucky modded ATX PSU" in my A4000 PSU housing And with the other Voodoo cards (with smaller heatsinks) it already crashed without the other cards installed, while with this recent voodoo card the system is stable.

On the other hand I had some instability with my CDROM player, some time ago. I moved it to a different power cable and then it was stable.
Is this a matter of not enough amps, or not the exact voltage?

I'm officialy an electrical engineer, but I haven't done anything with my degree the past 20 years, so consider me a newby in troubleshooting this

What PSUs are you guys using? Refurbished original ones or ATXs?

[trixster]

Stock A4000 one but it's been checked and recapped by someone who knows what they're doing (not me).

[Hedeon]

Stock A3000D PSU. Not as many cards as you, though. Has PCI network, voodoo and sonnet (I have 1 PCI slot less than A4000) and no Zorro cards. Has a 15GB SCSI drive which draws some power and a CSMK2.

I noticed some random bus errors with the G4 card and am wondering if it was related to power. Not sure how the 400MHz G4 compares to the 500MHz G3 on power consumption.

[grelbfarlk]

Originally Posted by spudje

Yes power could be an issue, but it would be odd as I have a real "Chucky modded ATX PSU" in my A4000 PSU housing And with the other Voodoo cards (with smaller heatsinks) it already crashed without the other cards installed, while with this recent voodoo card the system is stable.

On the other hand I had some instability with my CDROM player, some time ago. I moved it to a different power cable and then it was stable.
Is this a matter of not enough amps, or not the exact voltage?

I'm officialy an electrical engineer, but I haven't done anything with my degree the past 20 years, so consider me a newby in troubleshooting this

What PSUs are you guys using? Refurbished original ones or ATXs?

A frequent problem is the power supply connector on the A4000 motherboard. The 5V supply to the motherboard all goes over a single pin on the connector. The inside of that connector gets oxidized and when that happens you get ripple, low voltage and instability. You can try to clean it but chances are the connector from the power supply is also fouled. I replaced my power supply with an SFX, and that connector, and made a new ATX adapter and it has been stable ever since.

This is not as much of a problem in other models like the A3000 since the 5V bus is split over three pins.