KarlosTKG now on GitHub

[Karlos]

Originally Posted by BigD

The Mod works at 20FPS on an 060/105 AGA and at about 14FPS on a 060/50 RTG! Not bad! Obviously a PiStorm32 runs it great and I personally class that as 'real' hardware.

I mean 105MHz 060 is kinda wild. I remember when the Czubatech 100MHz 060 cards came out for the Atari Falcon. Pure top-shelf stuff back then, that was.

[Karlos]

Originally Posted by eXeler0

So in a moment of "because why not" I decided to remake Level A for Quake 1 in order to have some sort of performance comparison between the original game vs Quake engine. ;-)

Tbh, I have not tested it on a real Amiga myself, but I did test it in old WinQuake to make sure it runs (it does, but some weird draw bugs on the bridge).

Anyway, here's a link to a zip containing the .bsp and .wad files.
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1pXN...ew?usp=sharing
Unpack to Quake directory and in console type "map ex_TKG-A_beta1_q1"

Just tried it (darkplaces, GL), no obvious performance issues on that system. Weirdly familiar and not at the same time.

[eXeler0]

Originally Posted by BigD

The Mod works at 20FPS on an 060/105 AGA and at about 14FPS on a 060/50 RTG! Not bad! Obviously a PiStorm32 runs it great and I personally class that as 'real' hardware.

So I do have a 100MHz 060 + RTG in my A4000 but I do feel base clock 060 + AGA is a reasonable minimum spec for something thats still playable.
(KK Altair: ”Hold my beer”)

[Karlos]

Originally Posted by eXeler0

So I do have a 100MHz 060 + RTG in my A4000 but I do feel base clock 060 + AGA is a reasonable minimum spec for something thats still playable.
(KK Altair: ”Hold my beer”)

How is the base Team17 release (with current engine) on that specification?

[Dunny]

Originally Posted by Karlos

Just tried it (darkplaces, GL), no obvious performance issues on that system. Weirdly familiar and not at the same time.

Can't get it to work for either quakespasm-spiked or vkQuake - cannot spawn map error

[Karlos]

Originally Posted by Dunny

Can't get it to work for either quakespasm-spiked or vkQuake - cannot spawn map error

You need to put the files into the correct location under quake and if your filesystem is case sensitive, the map name actually begins eX, not ex.

[Dunny]

Originally Posted by Karlos

You need to put the files into the correct location under quake and if your filesystem is case sensitive, the map name actually begins eX, not ex.

Windows 10, so not case sensitive. Just says cannot spawn server.

[eXeler0]

Originally Posted by Karlos

How is the base Team17 release (with current engine) on that specification?

First release was not that good. Then the Akki Laukanen patch fixed the c2p but its never been great. Im getting slightly better fps from your mod, but it can vary of course. But since there is a chance to make some clever optimizations while rebuilding levels you do have the chance to actually improve on the original not only in looks, which you have by some margin ;-) but also (probably) performance.
That being said, you should focus on the fun stuff. Optimizing levels aint ;-)

[Karlos]

Originally Posted by Dunny

Windows 10, so not case sensitive. Just says cannot spawn server.

It's a remake of the original Level A, complete with what i used to call the "urinal walls" - which is actually some sort of speakers according to the texture name.

[eXeler0]

Originally Posted by Dunny

Windows 10, so not case sensitive. Just says cannot spawn server.

Howdy,
just make sure your folders look like this:

Your Quake Dir with the .exe /id1/maps
put the "map.bsp" here so that its in the "maps" folder.

in Root folder (where the exe is) also make sure there is a folder named "wads"
Place the "TKG.wad" there.

Final step, pull down the console in Quake, type "map eX_TKG-A_beta1_q1" without the qotes and press Enter

[Karlos]

Something about the scale of the quake map feels off. I can't put my finger on it exactly, but everything seems smaller.

[eXeler0]

Originally Posted by Karlos

It's a remake of the original Level A, complete with what i used to call the "urinal walls" - which is actually some sort of speakers according to the texture name.

Lol ye, I got some of the textures from the Amiga Format TKG Sources CD, but its a mess and I couldn't find more than a few of them. The rest are photographed off the screen with my phone, then pimped up in Photoshop using Neural filters to make them look less horrible ;-)

[eXeler0]

Originally Posted by Karlos

Something about the scale of the quake map feels off. I can't put my finger on it exactly, but everything seems smaller.

Well it might very well be. Because here you hit the size limit issue. I placed a screenshot of the map over the entire level and mapped it onto a "plane" that is the max limit supported by Vanilla quake (if I recall the limits correctly) then the size was whatever fits on that. It might b like 75% of the original, who knows.
For the purpose of comparing rendering speed on real hardware though, it doesnt really matter

[abu_the_monkey]

Originally Posted by eXeler0

Well it might very well be. Because here you hit the size limit issue. I placed a screenshot of the map over the entire level and mapped it onto a "plane" that is the max limit supported by Vanilla quake (if I recall the limits correctly) then the size was whatever fits on that. It might b like 75% of the original, who knows.
For the purpose of comparing rendering speed on real hardware though, it doesnt really matter

The coordinate system used in Quake allows you to walk from the point [-4096, -4096] to [4096, 4096] because coordinates are converted to SHORTs (2^16). By increasing this to LONGs, the coordinate system will increase to [-1048576, -1048576] by [1048576, 1048576] meaning you now have the power to walk through 256*256 Quake maps.

[Dunny]

Originally Posted by eXeler0

Howdy,
just make sure your folders look like this:

Your Quake Dir with the .exe /id1/maps
put the "map.bsp" here so that its in the "maps" folder.

in Root folder (where the exe is) also make sure there is a folder named "wads"
Place the "TKG.wad" there.

Final step, pull down the console in Quake, type "map eX_TKG-A_beta1_q1" without the qotes and press Enter

Got it - folder was "id" in the zip and I didn't notice

Renamed it to id1 and after merging it's fine! Nice job, though as mentioned the scale is a little off. Does work though.

[Karlos]

Originally Posted by abu_the_monkey

The coordinate system used in Quake allows you to walk from the point [-4096, -4096] to [4096, 4096] because coordinates are converted to SHORTs (2^16). By increasing this to LONGs, the coordinate system will increase to [-1048576, -1048576] by [1048576, 1048576] meaning you now have the power to walk through 256*256 Quake maps.

How come the range is 4096 and not 32768?

[abu_the_monkey]

Originally Posted by Karlos

How come the range is 4096 and not 32768?

I don't know. this was the answer I was given when I asked the Quake engine moders 10+ years ago and it worked so I looked no deeper into it.

[Karlos]

Regarding (some of) the PVS problems in Level A, for the low spec version I met the problem half way by doing a manual BSP.

Segmenting both zones in half like this creates a plane which means that prevents the the rendering of wrong part of the big room from the smaller one and vice versa. Where the big room is visible from the smaller one, the existing clips code handles it properly.

It might be a challenge to add this fix to the high spec version because I think level A is out of zones.

[Karlos]

Originally Posted by abu_the_monkey

I don't know. this was the answer I was given when I asked the Quake engine moders 10+ years ago and it worked so I looked no deeper into it.

Maybe it actually uses fixed point precision for placement of objects at a more granular scale than the overall coordinates?

[Karlos]

Originally Posted by Karlos

Regarding (some of) the PVS problems in Level A, for the low spec version I met the problem half way by doing a manual BSP.

Segmenting both zones in half like this creates a plane which means that prevents the the rendering of wrong part of the big room from the smaller one and vice versa. Where the big room is visible from the smaller one, the existing clips code handles it properly.

It might be a challenge to add this fix to the high spec version because I think level A is out of zones.

I -just- managed to squeeze that one into the high spec level A. Just.

Now I just have to redo all the control point associations because for whatever reason, despite zones actually containing an ID value, this always gets shot to shit when making any changes like thus.