13 April 2024, 16:01 | #41 |
Not a Rebel anymore
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In my opinion business is business and I think the ones who really love the Amiga are the Devs so I support them.
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13 April 2024, 16:10 | #42 | |
Gimmemore Commodore
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"We are not paid, and that is how we explicitly want it to be. While AmigaOS is a huge success the Amiga market is not big enough to pay us more than pocket money anyway. Internally, it would also mean we would have to argue over how much we should each get paid. And we would suddenly be obliged to actually produce something. Right now, we can work all weekend, or do nothing at all for months. No one is yelling at us. We work on it when we have time and when we feel it is fun." They volunteered to work for free and that's how they want it. Last edited by sean_sk; 13 April 2024 at 16:15. |
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13 April 2024, 16:13 | #43 |
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13 April 2024, 16:16 | #44 | ||||
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Do they pay their developers? Well, I received my free copy of Amiga Forever, but I did not receive payment. Does Cloanto have employees? And if so, what for? For selling the next copy of Amiga Forever, the same stuff as always?
I wasn't aware that I was ever employed by them. Neither am I employed by iComp, nor Cloanto. Quote:
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Indeed, if you believe that Cloanto would. Frankly, look at the "market" we have. The user base is probably ~10000 people. How can you derive from that a steady income of funding permanent employees of a company? The money is instead wasted in useless court cases instead of cooperation - and it always takes two persons for a struggle. I'm not pointing fingers, but if you believe that any of the two is "innocent", you are indeed a bit naive. Quote:
Look what's on Amiga Forever. Last time I checked it contained a good subset of the programs I put into Aminet. If I recall, ViNCEd, the mmulib, the IoTools and many other things were there. Don't get me wrong, I'm fine with that, that's all ok, I didn't expect anything. My license even says so. But I wasn't paid either. If you compare how "dead" AmigaForever is compared to how "dead" AmigaOs 3.2 is... well, my pick is rather clear. Quote:
I do not know which alternative you suggest to our system, but in the end, someone has to support me, but there is not sufficient interest in Amiga to make that a viable option. My money comes from other sources, and I'm perfectly happy if you continue to pay AAC encoded music or anything else related to video or audio coding, because *that* brings in the money into our institute and by that into my pockets - and I'm also happy to be part of it. |
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13 April 2024, 16:17 | #45 |
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13 April 2024, 16:19 | #46 | |
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13 April 2024, 16:22 | #47 | |
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"If Hyperion wants to release it as a free update, Amiga has no objection, but Hyperion can't exceed its rights AND profit from it." Ergo this stance works for the 3.x team from multiple standpoints. Just to clarify if the above is not obvious: If the above settlement had succeeded then there would be no proceeds for Hyperion to pay the devs with anyway. Therefore the result of "working for free" becomes a moot point. Additional detail, since some seem unaware of this event. This was indeed cleared by attorney for posting by Amiga Corporation on May 28, 2021: "Timothy De Groote and Mike Battilana negotiated a settlement agreement that was agreed to by Ben Hermans in writing on January 20, 2021. (He also represented this to the Court.) Eleven days later, he reneged." and "Under the agreement Ben Hermans reneged on, Amiga would have granted Hyperion the right (which it currently doesn't have) to release AmigaOS 3.2. If Hyperion wants to release it as a free update, Amiga has no objection, but Hyperion can't exceed its rights AND profit from it." The attorney was Eric Harrison, who resigned shortly thereafter: Reference post from June, 2021 #6 Last edited by number6; 13 April 2024 at 17:34. Reason: Multiple clarifications |
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13 April 2024, 16:36 | #48 |
Not a Rebel anymore
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Location: UK
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By building my own software that utilises their OS and by contributing to their work however I can. I did also purchase OS 3.2 which you don't seem to see as supporting them (which it isn't financially) but I still see it as supporting them.
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13 April 2024, 21:51 | #49 | |
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14 April 2024, 22:19 | #50 | |
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14 April 2024, 23:12 | #51 | |
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I really doubt anyone believes that, either. (-; It would be as far from the truth as Cloanto showing "true Amiga Love". For records, Hyperion paid for the ClassAct sources such that the "reaction" classes could be worked on, improved and shipped with 3.2. (It's really "ClassAct" and not "reaction", but the latter name stuck). In the end, everyone attempts to earn some money here. For me, that's ok, and I believe that a system also requires some commercial vendors. |
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15 April 2024, 00:02 | #52 |
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Both companies seem to be douchebags. The Amiga really is sad considering 20 years later people are fighting over the dead carcass rotting before them as many many people won’t touch Amiga because of these legal problems. Too bad we cannot just flush both Hyperion and Cloanto down the toilet. The world would be better without either of their problems. It really is sad.
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15 April 2024, 01:01 | #53 |
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15 April 2024, 05:45 | #54 | |
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15 April 2024, 06:57 | #55 | |
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IMO the problem is the same as it ever was, Amiga fans not appreciating what they get. By rights Amiga OS should have died 20 years ago, since it has no commercial value to speak of. The fact that it is still being developed and sold in commercial shops like the Amiga products of old is awesome. It's like being back in the 90's but better! But some people are hell-bent on jinxing that miracle in favor of punishing those they have decided are 'douchebags'. My own policy on stuff I create is anyone can do whatever they like with it - make a million bucks and don't give me a dime I don't care. I'd actually rather not take money for it since then I would have some responsibility. And I can totally see why other developers might think the same. The only reward we want is seeing it out there with people enjoying it. People who purport to be fighting for developers should consider the possibility that they themselves are indulging in 'douchebaggery'. |
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15 April 2024, 08:10 | #56 | |
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If you think that's a viable business model, more power to you. |
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15 April 2024, 09:45 | #57 | |
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15 April 2024, 10:17 | #58 | ||||||||||||
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Good thing we’re in a democracy here and you can’t just silence people you don’t agree with - especially if they make good points :-) Quote:
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Again, AmigaOS3.2 isn’t the dead-end, AmigaOS4 is and I was very clear in that, try to not subvert my posts to fit your agenda. Quote:
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I am glad that Camilla feels that way, but I am sure there are other devs that don’t share her view of AmigaOS development. On the other hand, it would just be fair if the system was published for free. No obligations for the devs and no profits for anyone else, while the users benefit. Oh what a utopia that would be. Quote:
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That’s not the case - Cloanto promised to open-source AmigaOS if they ever get the rights to it. Then devs could continue their work unimpeded. Instead they’re blocked by Hyperion and their buddies A-EON as opensourcing AmigaOS would remove profits from their pockets. Last edited by jbenam; 15 April 2024 at 10:26. |
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15 April 2024, 10:22 | #59 | |
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In the end you think you're only worth of scraps... I think their work should be valued. |
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15 April 2024, 10:31 | #60 | |
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Hyperion is that tenant that decides that he might do whatever it please with the house of his landlord, and people just go with it. |
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