13 March 2017, 23:21 | #41 |
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On topic - apparently lot of research done on who exactly owns what and why.
Interesting that the legal transfer of copyright from CBM was never offered as evidence in court... also interesting that the author is still looking for some "explosive" official documents. https://sites.google.com/site/amigadocuments/ |
13 March 2017, 23:53 | #42 | |
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Ambitious document.. Lots of research went into it.. I suppose just to add more confusion there are individuals listed on this page that own some bits and pieces of what is OS3.9 and part of the Official Amiga brand/product? http://www.haage-partner.de/amiga/aos39/aos39who.htm |
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14 March 2017, 00:53 | #43 |
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(Scratches head)
Nope, no claims of ownership, just claims of project management and work done... ... not a dig at 3.9, I never even saw it running or touched a copy of the thing so I cannot really offer an informed opinion on that. Perhaps one of these days I'll buy a copy and see just what I've been missing... |
14 March 2017, 23:05 | #44 | |
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I'm sure you've ran across a "whats new in OS 3.9 -list" like this? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AmigaO...aOS_3.5.2C_3.9 If you ask me, OS3.9, (while modernizing the Amiga OS experience (anno 2002) and in many cases simply updating the codebase so it would compile on more common compilers as we heard in stories from Olaf Barthel) is kind of a leap away from the elegant simplicity of 3.1 In fact, just the other day I decided to update my aging install on the A1200 by doing a clean OS3.9 install on PFS (Professional File System -allowing partitions bigger than 4GB) I did the the whole process from WinUAE and it took a bunch of hours to set everything up.. but while most stuff worked, screen prefs crashed every time I tried to start it for some reason then minutes later the whole thing froze, and now I think the whole CF card went corrupt and is no longer recognized. Sigh... OS3.1 you can easily install from floppies on a real Amiga from CLI without installer disk and it just works. Most of the crap in OS3.9 you can add later form Aminet. ;-) |
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14 March 2017, 23:28 | #45 |
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thats what i have told you earlier in the thread about opening the sources. os 3.9 in comparison with 3.1 is for a large part clumsy and overblown package of independant patches and contributions. especially that they eventually introduce new bugs and incompatibilities, that would have to be handled by subsequent boing ball packages and individual patches. in result the system needs to patch the kickstart and reboot, which may finally take about a minute alltogether, while the genuine amiga experience is almost instant on.
this whole management mess is fine if the user has means, patience and knowledge to tinker and set his system up. but generally each and every upgrade solution after 1993 was a sort of hack, be it hardware or software. amiga doesnt need to be like this. the system should install by drag and drop decompressing to a boot drive, work on any configuration out of the box, be simple , up to date and maintainable by the community. |
14 March 2017, 23:35 | #46 |
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It's no wonder your OS crashes if your installation medium has gone bad. Would happen under 3.1 and 1.3 as well.
People tend to fixate on the crap in OS 3.9 instead of focusing on the fact that the core OS has been updated. You can throw out the crap from 3.9 just as easily as you can add it to 3.1. |
15 March 2017, 02:26 | #47 | ||||
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I don't believe much changed with the compiler situation other than cleanup for maintainability. Most of the code is still compiled with SAS/C which uses SAS/C features which were requested by C= AmigaOS developers (read ThoR comments for verification). The intuition.library was compiled with the ancient Green Hills compiler and was such a mess that it was difficult to update to even SAS/C (read Olaf comments). There are a few of the third party utilities which are compiled with GCC also. I doubt there is less elegance or simplicity to the sources now. Rather the old code probably used macros and special handling of C code to optimize to the limits of what compilers were capable of then but at the expense of simplicity, readability and maintainability. Quote:
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15 March 2017, 22:41 | #48 | ||
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What I tried to say is that particular moment I realized the CF had gone bad I really wished I had chosen the much quicker OS3.1 install. (= less wasted time.. I do this like every 5 years, so I don't have a good/quick routine) Quote:
Or maybe I should go "All in" and try something like AKReal @thread : sorry for drifting OT |
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16 March 2017, 01:07 | #49 | |
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They actually wrote very little code - pretty much only those things that never made it into AmigaOS 4: IIRC, the new installer used in 3.5+ (which could run on its own screen and pop up pictures while installing) and a few prefs programs which had been rewritten to use a Reaction GUI - that's it.
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The license from AInc was limited to a few years and it was revoked early anyway, due to unpaid royalties and/or disagreements regarding Amithlon's legal status. The licenses from the external developers (for the improvements/new modules they had contributed to 3.5/3.9) all had a limited lifetime aswell and have all expired long ago. These days, H&P only owns the right to the code that was written in-house (not much, see above). |
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16 March 2017, 03:25 | #50 | |||
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16 March 2017, 06:09 | #51 | ||||||
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As for 3.9: Everybody pretty much begged Amino-AmigaInc for permission to release another AmigaOS update, but they blocked it because they were only interested in pushing their new AmigaDE. Only when they realised they had nothing to release for christmas, they would give in. Quote:
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16 March 2017, 06:29 | #52 | |
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they seem to be interested in getting money for no work (i dont think olsen has been paid for his bugfixes, he probably provided for free, being an idealist). but they wouldnt want to allow to establish another viable alternative to their own primary "product". so similarly as many times before we are seening here a deadlock of interests. its there to stay. |
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16 March 2017, 12:39 | #53 | |
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16 March 2017, 12:52 | #54 | |
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I guess if both companies think there is no market for such a product, then they can hardly claim to be losing money when folks burn their own. |
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01 April 2017, 22:57 | #55 |
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(I read through that copyright analysis page - what a nightmare.)
Is it clear who owns the rights to the chipset schematics? |
01 April 2017, 23:20 | #56 |
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Is it even clear if the schematics exist anymore?
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02 April 2017, 01:12 | #57 |
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i tell you what made me sell my amiga 4000 and buy a pc , i went to town and walked past a computer shop and in the window was a pc playing rebal assault and watcing the fantastic out of this world graphics seeing tie fighters and xwings i though holy hell amiga is dead and i was right , the amiga lacks the 3d acceleration graphics and that killed it and pc games doom quake made the amiga look plop thats what changed me into a pc fruitcake lol.
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02 April 2017, 03:28 | #58 | |
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Sure. Jeri Ellsworth has them and respects them more than any of the entities claiming to own the rights to them.
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02 April 2017, 06:06 | #59 | |
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02 May 2017, 15:39 | #60 |
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