Amiga vs Windows

[kgc210]

Originally Posted by AMIGASYSTEM

But are we talking about emulation on Windows? because otherwise the choice is SheepShaver

MigaTech the original poster on this topic was asking about running Windows on an actual Amiga using hardware such as a Zorro / SBC.

I don't think WinUAE performance is relevant.

[Retro1234]

Again never tried but theres is a PPC version of Fusion IFusion that I think emulates PPC Mac so maybe could have later versions of SoftWindows etc.

[Gorf]

I was kind of fascinated from a technical point of view (goes for emulation in general), but always wondered about it's actual usefulness.
When I compared prices back than, such a board would usually cost as much or more than a full PC - so nothing saved but space.
Is there someone out there, who actually bought and uses such a PC-bridgeboard back in the day?

[kgc210]

Originally Posted by Gorf

I was kind of fascinated from a technical point of view (goes for emulation in general), but always wondered about it's actual usefulness.
When I compared prices back than, such a board would usually cost as much or more than a full PC - so nothing saved but space.
Is there someone out there, who actually bought and uses such a PC-bridgeboard back in the day?

I agree with you, they always interested me on a technical point.

I think their marketing sums it up for me looking back on the product.

"Use Windows 3 on your Amiga!" Why?
OK PC's took over, but back then for me I don't understand why you would want to run inferior software on your Amiga.

A friend of mine was round my house the other weekend and we were playing about with my CDTV loading mod files up and messing about on WorkBench.
We both came to the conclusion. Why did we leave behind this multitasking GUI Operating System that essentially had mp3 files (mods) back in the late 80's early 90's to have to go and learn Command Prompt to be able to use PC's even Windows up to about 2000 heavily relied on the Command Prompt.
Linux is worse still.

Seems odd how they had it all worked out back then but cocked it up...

Back on topic, I may buy an SBC one day to have as a dedicated DOS / Win95 System to play the old PC games that didn't come out on the Amiga.

[UberFreak]

Originally Posted by kgc210

"Use Windows 3 on your Amiga!" Why?
OK PC's took over, but back then for me I don't understand why you would want to run inferior software on your Amiga.

It was an attempt to enter the business market, where PC was king and had a variety of business related software.
I guess the point was that buying an Amiga + Bridgeboard was cheaper than (or equal to) a PC, and let you run both Amiga and PC software.

I think it made some sense, if you take into account the market situation back then.

[Gorf]

Originally Posted by UberFreak

I guess the point was that buying an Amiga + Bridgeboard was cheaper than (or equal to) a PC, and let you run both Amiga and PC software.

Thats not how I remember the prices - the board alone would cost as much as a full pc - and a A2000 (or 1000 for the sidecar) was never really cheap.
In fact the 2000 costed more than twice than the 500.

(can't have peen that more expensive to produce. Not a very wise price policy - getting more people to buy a 2000 would have helped C= to create a more work oriented user base, and less likely to switch to PC once you have invested so much...)

I think it made some sense, if you take into account the market situation back then.

But C= was producing an selling PCs themselves ... that was one of the problems: Commodore was never really fully committed to the Amiga.

[pandy71]

Run emulated Amiga within Windows. There is no added value trying to do reversed way (running Windows on Amiga) - it was quite popular to run PC software on Amiga in a past as hardware was very expensive (frequently more expensive than software) - nowadays computing hardware doesn't cos too much and it is usually fraction of a cost of software.

Memory cost (RAM) was significant part of total system cost, same for storage - reusing some HW at a cost of slower emulation was acceptable.

[kgc210]

Originally Posted by UberFreak

It was an attempt to enter the business market, where PC was king and had a variety of business related software.

Commodore also sold PC's though. (Oops Gorf already mentioned that)

Only real benefit I can think of is space. Two computers in one footprint.

[MigaTech]

Was thinking that it would be good to run some of those really old simple PC DOS games and programs, from back in the day. I figured that if we could get a 386/486 environment fully working on Amiga, then this would be possible.

There is another DOS card for Amiga 500 called KCS Power PC Board.

Check this link if you cannot remember this one:http://www.bigbookofamigahardware.co...ct.aspx?id=334

@All EAB members involved in this thread: How efficient do you think this would be?

[Gorf]

Originally Posted by MigaTech

Was thinking that it would be good to run some of those really old simple PC DOS games and programs, from back in the day. I figured that if we could get a 386/486 environment fully working on Amiga, then this would be possible.

There is another DOS card for Amiga 500 called KCS Power PC Board.

Check this link if you cannot remember this one:http://www.bigbookofamigahardware.co...ct.aspx?id=334

@All EAB members involved in this thread: How efficient do you think this would be?

With that card? not efficient at all. Later Amiga models could do a 8086 (clone) in software. Now you can use Bochs or others for this kind of stuff.

And most 486 era things will still run on a normal PC or virtual-box...

I am really not sure what you are after :-/
Why would you want "386/486 environment fully working on Amiga"? There ist no advantage at all.

Or you can try to find one of these:
http://www.bigbookofamigahardware.co...ct.aspx?id=350
Than you can put a real 486 in your real Amiga.
(probably still more pain than gain)

[MigaTech]

There are many reasons why it would be great to have Windows on Amiga. Remember although we do not like to admit it, we all converted to PC's in the late 90's.

I actually got a 286 to run WIN95C last edition and it was painfully slow but worked stable.

If we could get Windows 98 or even ME on Amiga then maybe early additions of Photoshop? Amongst other cool early programs that the PC offered back then. The DOS games alone were great fun. All this and more on your Amiga!! < Got to be worth while.

[Gorf]

Originally Posted by MigaTech

There are many reasons why it would be great to have Windows on Amiga. Remember although we do not like to admit it, we all converted to PC's in the late 90's.

Not me. I waited until the next millennia.
And gave it up quickly again, to become a unix user.

I actually got a 286 to run WIN95C last edition and it was painfully slow but worked stable.

not only painfully slow but an overall painful experience, I can imagine.

If we could get Windows 98 or even ME on Amiga then maybe early additions of Photoshop?

Just use it on your PC. It probably still works even with windows 10.

Amongst other cool early programs that the PC offered back then.

Many still work with no change.
For those that don't any other emulation or virtualization on any PC will do just fine - why spoiling the Amiga with that?
Honestly I don't understand the benefit :-/

The DOS games alone were great fun. All this and more on your Amiga!! < Got to be worth while.

I don't see it

[Retro1234]

Use Fusion or ShapeShifter Mac68k emulator its fast and has MsWord,Photoshop and lots of good games and with SoftWindows you might get some DOS games running.

But PC-Task and PCX will run some old games and reportedly so does Dosbox for Amiga.

[MigaTech]

Originally Posted by Retro1234

Use Fusion or ShapeShifter Mac68k emulator its fast and has MsWord,Photoshop and lots of good games and with SoftWindows you might get some DOS games running.

But PC-Task and PCX will run some old games and reportedly so does Dosbox for Amiga.

PC-Task I have had that on file for a while. Never tried the Fusion or ShapeShifter packages. I think I might have them somewhere? Got that much software for the Amiga not sure what I do and don't have for it.

@Gorf, do you not think that both Amiga and PC all under one roof would be cool? There are a lot of PC users in here that think so, only the other way round. WINUAE Users, OK so I know it is more for convenience or the fact that original Amiga hardware is very expensive, rather than anything else. Still I just think that if new ventures are to found within Amiga, maybe this overlooked area nowadays, is one to bring to the forefront.

Anyone else agree with this, or is it just pointless?

[Gorf]

Originally Posted by MigaTech

@Gorf, do you not think that both Amiga and PC all under one roof would be cool?

Not cooler, than trying to build a truck-engine into a DeLorean and adding some more wheels.
Or railroads for jetplanes.
Using your Stradivari as a percussion instrument.
A rooftop-restaurant take-away
A panorama window in your street-level toilet
A microwave oven in your subwoofer
Holding a sheep in your herb garden
Wearing a sombrero while under a umbrella
...

[MigaTech]

LOL! I guess if this was Dragon's Den, then you'd be OUT !

[Daedalus]

For doing modern computing tasks you most likely need a separate machine. And if you've got that sort of machine nearby, what's the point in emulating on the Amiga other than for pure curiosity? That's about the only reason I can think of for that sort of thing. I even had a setup on my A1200 at one stage that let be boot into OS 3.1, BSD, or DOS/Windows 3.1 or Mac OS 7 emulated environments from a boot menu. Worked well, and the Mac emulation was pretty useful... But the PC emulation was purely "because you can". Any sort of Amiga-based bridgeboard/SBC is in a similar situation these days.

There was a machine advertised at some point that used the Siamese system to link a PC and Amiga in the same case - I guess that would be the only "reasonable" way to do it these days, but in reality you'd have to be very hard up on space to have to consider that.

Remember although we do not like to admit it, we all converted to PC's in the late 90's.

You often seem to think that everyone shares your experience and opinion. I never "converted" to PCs - they were always another platform that I used as a tool for certain tasks. Those tasks became more and more common, and it probably overtook my Amiga for many computing tasks around 2004 or 2005, but I never stopped using that Amiga and still use it to this day, complementing my PC usage.

[MigaTech]

Originally Posted by Daedalus

You often seem to think that everyone shares your experience and opinion. I never "converted" to PCs - they were always another platform that I used as a tool for certain tasks. Those tasks became more and more common, and it probably overtook my Amiga for many computing tasks around 2004 or 2005, but I never stopped using that Amiga and still use it to this day, complementing my PC usage.

Please do not misunderstand me. What I meant, was that at some point we were all forced to convert to PC, as the Amiga was no longer the front runner.

I NEVER stopped following or using Amiga, despite acquiring my first PC in 1998. There were many occasions I would defend Amiga against all my PC user friends. When I showed them Quake on my Amiga 1200 in 1999, they were still unconvinced. Just like you, I have always kept my true allegiance to Amiga.

[trixster]

Have a look at this thread on eab and tell me a big box amiga with a bridgeboard isnt cool! It's what prompted me to get a goldengate for my 3000. In reality a bridgeboard is not much more than a curiosity, but isn't that the case with a lot of 'retro' computing these days?

[pandy71]

Cool is to run 32 bit Linux on no-MMU 8 bit uController.
http://dmitry.gr/?r=05.Projects&proj...ux%20on%208bit
If you have sufficient determination (time) you can do same on any HW.