03 April 2023, 17:38 | #21 | |
Registered User
Join Date: May 2017
Location: Munich/Bavaria
Posts: 2,425
|
Quote:
So this remains to be seen ... Last edited by Gorf; 04 April 2023 at 01:19. |
|
03 April 2023, 18:24 | #22 | |
Italian Amiga Zealot
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Italy
Age: 36
Posts: 1,913
|
Quote:
That’s what happened here - Hyperion has times and times again (more info in my previous post) breached the agreement they had with the previous owners. While it’s true that Cloanto has to upheld that agreement even when becoming the new owner, he can now also sue them for breach of contract in case they don’t respect their part of the deal - and this is what happened here. |
|
03 April 2023, 18:28 | #23 | |
Registered User
Join Date: Jun 2015
Location: Germany
Posts: 1,924
|
Quote:
|
|
03 April 2023, 19:10 | #24 | |||||
Zone Friend
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: Germany
Posts: 812
|
Quote:
In response, Hyperion then sued four companies in total - for no other reason than to make this as complicated and expensive as possible. But yeah, "Cloanto sued first, they must be the bad guys". Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
I'm glad that you don't have a problem with this "nonsense", but maybe you should sometimes try out other sources than just Ben? Last edited by Korodny; 03 April 2023 at 19:40. |
|||||
03 April 2023, 19:32 | #25 | |
Registered User
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Nuernberg
Posts: 816
|
Quote:
|
|
03 April 2023, 20:34 | #26 | |
Registered User
Join Date: May 2017
Location: Munich/Bavaria
Posts: 2,425
|
Quote:
Forcing them to only sell it as a bundle would not be effective, since then they simple could sell 3.x together with a minimal (and useless) version of 4.x in digital form... Making the download 1MB bigger and nothing more So I guess Mike's Amiga will try to argue Hyperion overstepped the last agreement by claiming copyright and registering trademarks and therefor lost all granted rights completely - the court will then usually tell both parties to work on a new compromise .... |
|
03 April 2023, 22:13 | #27 | ||||
Registered User
Join Date: Jan 2019
Location: Germany
Posts: 3,303
|
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Code:
/* Project AmigaOS4 CDFileSystem ** ** AudioCD FS and CDXA (VideoCD) functions. ** ** Written 2002-2007 by Jörg Strohmayer <j_s@gmx.de> for Hyperion Entertainment. ** (c) 2002-2007 Hyperion Entertainment. */ Quote:
The only source I'm trying is the Settlement Agreement. |
||||
03 April 2023, 22:28 | #28 |
J.M.D - Bedroom Musician
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: los angeles,ca
Posts: 3,590
|
A note aside, Herr Hermans favorable judgement make me fear for AROS that he often disliked, and is not news that hyp in the past wanted to be the only game in town; while the API problem is partially voided by the oracle vs google outcome, still i keep an eye open
Last edited by saimon69; 03 April 2023 at 23:07. |
03 April 2023, 22:34 | #29 |
Registered User
Join Date: Oct 2021
Location: England
Posts: 1,240
|
|
03 April 2023, 22:37 | #30 | |
Registered User
Join Date: May 2017
Location: Munich/Bavaria
Posts: 2,425
|
Quote:
3.1.x and 3.2 (and so on) are of course not originally developed by Hyperion, but in significant (or overwhelming) portions it contains code from Commodore. The wording "The Operating System developed by Hyperion" is clearly used as a description for OS4, with the purpose to differentiate it from OS3 - I would think this intend will be be quite obvious to the judge. Your interpretation of this wording is clearly far too literal and neglects the context. Especially since such an interpretation would be equivalent of forfeiting any rights to AmigaOS - but if that would be the intent, the whole agreement would make no sense. Ergo this was not the intent of the agreement. In addition: at the point in time this agreement was made, Hyperion had NOT yet done any development on OS3.x. Therefor it is very clear, what system exactly is meant by that particular wording: OS4. Something like that will probably brought forward by Mike's legal team, if Hyperion really would try to pin its presumed rights on this paragraph of the agreement. Last edited by Gorf; 03 April 2023 at 23:29. |
|
03 April 2023, 22:39 | #31 |
Registered User
Join Date: May 2017
Location: Munich/Bavaria
Posts: 2,425
|
|
03 April 2023, 22:54 | #32 |
Registered User
Join Date: Jan 2019
Location: Germany
Posts: 3,303
|
The problem is that even Os 4 code is pretty much CBM code, or in many parts derived from it, so it is not quite so obvious where to draw the line what "developed" actually means. Os 4 was by no means a "clean room" approach. Given its history, it was neither intended to be one.
|
03 April 2023, 23:06 | #33 |
J.M.D - Bedroom Musician
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: los angeles,ca
Posts: 3,590
|
|
03 April 2023, 23:08 | #34 |
Ex nihilo nihil
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: CH
Posts: 4,995
|
Even if not over, I am glad the Amiga is still going forward
[ Show youtube player ] |
03 April 2023, 23:12 | #35 | |
Registered User
Join Date: May 2017
Location: Munich/Bavaria
Posts: 2,425
|
Quote:
Taking one step back and looking at it from a distance: yes it is very messy. But I think it is pretty clear, what was intended by Amiga Inc. - and also pretty obvious, that Hyperion was planting legal traps ... But like Bush Jr. famously said: “There's an old saying in Tennessee — I know it's in Texas, probably in Tennessee — that says, fool me once, shame on — shame on you. Fool me — you can't get fooled again.” Clearly Amiga Inc. back then was not led by intelligent people. And not even represented by intelligent layers. Ben Hermans had a pretty easy game here... Nevertheless, that of course does not make Hyperion or Hermans & Co. the good guys! Not by a long shot! (And sorry: I still can not unterstand, why someone would agree to work for them - with all the information out there... let alone working for free ) All in all: The contract was a big mistake from the very beginning, IMHO. And IF one would make such a contract, every sensible entity would retain the copyright for the result of the contracted work ... (I managed to do something similar on a smaller scale ... but who knowns what the scales really are... keeping my copyright on a peace of software, that is now used by my hometown more and more extensively ... and will probably allow me to retire a couple of years earlier.... But again: that is not the way things are usually done!) |
|
03 April 2023, 23:18 | #36 | |
Registered User
Join Date: Sep 2017
Location: USA
Posts: 154
|
Quote:
Note this is Steven Solie speaking, so he kinda *cough* knows what he's talking about here. Apparently my text got replaced by show utube player and also the timestamp is lost, so I'll try again. Hyperion is known to change copyright names and dates to suit their current situation. Period. Use time 24:12 for a laugh. [ Show youtube player ] #6 Last edited by number6; 03 April 2023 at 23:32. Reason: Fixed message and timestamp listed |
|
03 April 2023, 23:20 | #37 | |||
Italian Amiga Zealot
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Italy
Age: 36
Posts: 1,913
|
I have wasted ten minutes of my life reading that accursed Settlement agreement just to get facts straight before answering.
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Which in many points exclusively refers to AmigaOS4. Trying to make it refer to AmigaOS3.x is a very big stretch that probably won’t fly in a court of law. |
|||
03 April 2023, 23:39 | #38 |
Registered User
Join Date: May 2017
Location: Munich/Bavaria
Posts: 2,425
|
|
04 April 2023, 00:22 | #39 | ||
Zone Friend
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: Germany
Posts: 812
|
Quote:
Jörg Strohmeyer is claiming publicly that (a) Hyperion's license to his code was PPC only and (b) he deleted his code from the OS4 source code repository after not getting paid. He was still posting on amigans.net yesterday or the day before that about how he's going to sue Olaf Barthel (the maintainer of the OS4 repository) - presumably for undeleting his code. Ben Hermans started to push developers to assign copyright to their code to Hyperion years later, amongst other things by forcing them to sign a newer NDA that allegedly contained a copyright assignment clause - or at least something that Ben Hermans considered a copyright assignment clause. I wouldn't put much weight on what Thomas found in a Hyperion controlled source code repository a decade after Jörg ran away screaming. Quote:
|
||
04 April 2023, 01:02 | #40 | ||
Registered User
Join Date: Sep 2017
Location: USA
Posts: 154
|
Quote:
Evert Carton was managing partner by title. He was also majority shareholder. Be aware others claimed to be "major" shareholder, which does not mean the same thing at all. Lastly he has already been deposed and there is yet to be any ruling made in regard to this deposition. Source deposition Somewhat pertinent: Quote:
Last edited by number6; 04 April 2023 at 01:13. Reason: Added source |
||
Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests) | |
Thread Tools | |
Similar Threads | ||||
Thread | Thread Starter | Forum | Replies | Last Post |
Who owns which rights? Amiga Inc/Commodore Inc/Cloanto/Hyperion? | 1988 | Amiga scene | 49 | 25 December 2022 05:36 |
How much did Commodore have to pay Atari in their lawsuit? | PatmanQC | Nostalgia & memories | 1 | 03 March 2021 01:34 |
Oh come on Hyperion... | Locutus | Amiga scene | 89 | 12 September 2017 02:01 |
Official Kickstart Roms - Cloanto/Hyperion | antiriad76 | support.Hardware | 3 | 26 April 2017 08:20 |
|
|