Robin Hood Legend of Sherwood - Full Version on Amiga with Apollo V4

[kriz]

But this post from youtube does not seem too positive ..

"
@WillemDrijver
3 days ago
Unfortunately it is still very unclear if we will be able to bring Robin Hood Legend of Sherwood to our Amiga community. We will have to obtain the correct legal rights to do so first and until now we are not successful. However if we would succeed the idea is definitely to make a "Premium Boxed Edition" beside a regular download version. "

Why not just go for an unnofical port requiring the game to run ? Also do it run on Pistorm or other fast Amigas?

[Dunny]

Originally Posted by kriz

Why not just go for an unnofical port requiring the game to run ? Also do it run on Pistorm or other fast Amigas?

I think the point is to showcase the Vamp, and to use their AMMX or whatever it is to get as much speed as possible. Going that route, it ain't ever gonna run on a PiStorm.

[Seiya]

@Dunny

Originally Posted by grelbfarlk

You don't need to, since you have an Amiga 1200, it will run this, since it's also running on an RTG Amiga.

Pistorm with 68080 emulation and ammx support

[willemdrijver]

Originally Posted by Dunny

I think the point is to showcase the Vamp, and to use their AMMX or whatever it is to get as much speed as possible. Going that route, it ain't ever gonna run on a PiStorm.

Hi Dunny, The project of porting and re-coding Robin Hood - The Legend of Sherwood started early 2023 as an internal experiment to see if we could get a relative bulky and complex game developed for PC trimmed down and optimised for Apollo V4 platform.

After a promising (but stil slow) initial stage we were confident that we could move forward and we started sharing our progress and story with Amiga community.

Already in my very first posts I did state that although the Project currently is still focused on Apollo V4 platform and the optimal use of the specific 68080 AMMX instructions and SAGA video/audio/input Chipset features, there has not been made any decision yet on a possible release roadmap, which means that we also did not make any decisions on target Platforms.

As most of you are aware of, we do NOT own any license rights on the game yet and although we are doing all we can (trust me) to obtain these, we do not have any clear view on timeline, nor are we sure we can obtain right at all.

So, first things first and then we will come back to Amiga community with a full transparency on our Roadmap for Release.

Thanks you all for supporting Amiga Development.

[Seiya]

so you work on a game, waste hours of your free time knowing that one day those who own the game copyrights will force you not to publish it?
If you work on a source I imagine it is open-source or are you doing reverse engineering? Only in the latter case they can prevent you from publishing.

[TCD]

Originally Posted by Seiya

If you work on a source I imagine it is open-source or are you doing reverse engineering? Only in the latter case they can prevent you from publishing.

This post answers the question about open source: https://eab.abime.net/showthread.php...75#post1685575

[Dunny]

Originally Posted by Seiya

Pistorm with 68080 emulation and ammx support

That has been suggested, but I don't believe that it's on the roadmap for Emu68

[willemdrijver]

Originally Posted by Seiya

so you work on a game, waste hours of your free time knowing that one day those who own the game copyrights will force you not to publish it?
If you work on a source I imagine it is open-source or are you doing reverse engineering? Only in the latter case they can prevent you from publishing.

Again: this Project was started as an internal experiment to test and improve Apollo V4 using a complex Game like Robin Hood as a test subject to port and re-code using Apollo V4 specific architecture power.

So we do not view all our time spent as wasted in any way. On the contrary; we value the knowledge we gained from this project.

As for the second external stage of this project, I do fully agree with you that it does not make sense to move forward if we cannot obtain legal rights. We are working hard on that and it might or might not succeed.

[Seiya]

Originally Posted by Dunny

That has been suggested, but I don't believe that it's on the roadmap for Emu68

one day, i hope, will be implemend in emu68 and maybe emulated by WinUAE.

[d4rk3lf]

Originally Posted by willemdrijver

we cannot obtain legal rights

Can't you somehow, make a version of the game, that would require original game files (purchased from Gog or Steam)?
Similar how Mame or Winuae works. They are perfectly legal, and it's up to users how they obtain Roms and ADF's.

Would that remove any need for legal rights?

Sorry, I am not much into these legal rights.. maybe it's stupid idea.. that's why I ask.

[kriz]

Apollo Robin Hood Legend of Sherwood Beta Preview 2
[ Show youtube player ]

"@jaycee1980 1 month ago
@slaapliedje The Linux port was done by Runesoft, as were the Mac and MorphOS ports. Gunnar worked on the MorphOS port for Runesoft, and I guess he still has the source code. However, he has no right to legally use it in this way."

So if used the source code it makes it problematic...

[TCD]

So this is really a 'it can be done' rather than a 'this will be available to you' thing. The using things you aren't allowed to theme is at least consistent.

[dreadnought]

Originally Posted by d4rk3lf

Can't you somehow, make a version of the game, that would require original game files (purchased from Gog or Steam)?
Similar how Mame or Winuae works.

Mame and WinUAE are platform emulators. They don't contain any game code.

[Daedalus]

I think the parallel being drawn was to do with not including any proprietary code like Kickstart ROMs or software images, without which the emulators are useless, but freely distributed. A similar principle can be applied to reverse engineered game engines that requires the original files, which is a common work-around for this problem (e.g. Freeserf). That way, the distributed package contains no protected code and no protected data files, so can be freely distributed.

However, in this case it would appear that requiring the original game data files wouldn't be enough; using the original source code would mean that the game engine itself can't be distributed either unless the appropriate licence is obtained.

[jaycee1980]

Originally Posted by Daedalus

However, in this case it would appear that requiring the original game data files wouldn't be enough; using the original source code would mean that the game engine itself can't be distributed either unless the appropriate licence is obtained.

Correct, it is based on original game code without license. If it was a clean room implementation then that would be legally permissible.

Technically there are two rights violations here - the IP now belonging to Anuman/Microids, and the port source code belonging to Runesoft. They have permission for neither.

[Dunny]

Originally Posted by Seiya

one day, i hope, will be implemend in emu68 and maybe emulated by WinUAE.

At least as far as Emu68 goes, the response was "no"

[sean_sk]

Originally Posted by jaycee1980

Correct, it is based on original game code without license. If it was a clean room implementation then that would be legally permissible.

Technically there are two rights violations here - the IP now belonging to Anuman/Microids, and the port source code belonging to Runesoft. They have permission for neither.

Genuine question: Permission for what specifically? Can you elaborate?

[jaycee1980]

Originally Posted by sean_sk

Genuine question: Permission for what specifically? Can you elaborate?

Gunnar was given permission to use Runesoft's version of the source code for a MorphOS port around 2006. He was not given permission to do anything else, and certainly not to transfer the code to another programmer to work on!

[sean_sk]

Originally Posted by jaycee1980

Gunnar was given permission to use Runesoft's version of the source code for a MorphOS port around 2006. He was not given permission to do anything else, and certainly not to transfer the code to another programmer to work on!

Do you have the details of what was specifically in the contract between him and Runesoft regarding any code that he developed himself in the conversion?

While I do understand what you're saying and the legal issues that you mention, I also understand the reason why they may have decided to do a proof-of-concept first to present to the rights holder to show what can be done. I'm speculating here, but perhaps they feel it could be problematic to enter an agreement first only to find out afterwards the port wasn't possible. They certainly have stated that they do not intend to sell or distribute the game if they cannot enter into an agreement.

At the end of the day, none of us know what has already or not already happened behind the scenes, so it's probably best to wait and see how this plays out.

EDIT: Also adding to that, the Apollo Team did a survey to determine who would be interested in buying the game and saw the need to show it off in order to generate interest. It may be that they feel it necessary to present a plan to the rights holder which could include possible sales forecasts, so doing what they have done shows what's possible. I don't detect any deliberate intent to be malicious, under-handed or subversive on their part, other than trying and attract publishers to the platform. Whether they are able to do this remains to be seen.

[Pyromania]

Great game and effort for the Vampire V4!