The most badly cracked Amiga game

[n00w]

Originally Posted by TCD

In a few weeks the file server will be back online where you can get individual files from the latest TOSEC set. I'm afraid that until then you'll have to use outdated sources if you can't use torrents.

Thank you! I'm looking forward to this update. Best regards,

Added note: found a way to make broken zips from Archive.org work perfectly. It should give me plenty of things to do before your next update. Also I'd be pleased to collaborate with TOSEC in the future, of course more on the demo/PD side.

[Don_Adan]

Originally Posted by StingRay

128 bytes for a patch are most probably enough, however, even these 128 bytes need to be placed somewhere in memory which can be extremely hard depending on how the game uses memory. Check The Plague f.e., it's a bloody good example, it uses the FULL 512k so patching it is very difficult if you want to make the cracked version run correctly without any bugs on 512k machines.

Are you sure that Plague game used FULL 512k?
Maybe you must think that Plague game used FULL 512k. I'm almost sure that this game used some fake (unused) data for filling FULL 512k. This is very old protection trick from Atari ST.

[Galahad/FLT]

Originally Posted by Don_Adan

Are you sure that Plague game used FULL 512k?
Maybe you must think that Plague game used FULL 512k. I'm almost sure that this game used some fake (unused) data for filling FULL 512k. This is very old protection trick from Atari ST.

With respect, it was an old trick on the ST because with less colours and generally using chip sounds instead of samples, they were invariably left with empty space.

[n00w]

Originally Posted by Don_Adan

Are you sure that Plague game used FULL 512k?
Maybe you must think that Plague game used FULL 512k. I'm almost sure that this game used some fake (unused) data for filling FULL 512k. This is very old protection trick from Atari ST.

Plus let's assume all 512k are fully used. Let's try some imagination. There's most likely at least one full screen picture in memory. Use the bottom line of the picture. Either your resident is very small and you can have it stored in one string. Or you just cut it into parts to fill bitplanes and jump from one to the other whenever you need. I don't know if I'm talking bullshit but at least it seems possible to do that.

ps: thank you to the moderator for deleting all the 'off-topic' stuff.

[Don_Adan]

For me it must be only protection trick, due exist cracked version which works for 0.5MB. Also hard enough is to create game which really used full 512KB of memory for current game level, also perhaps stack space can be used for patches too. Maybe oneday (in next year) I will check this game much exactly. Now is StingRay time

[StingRay]

Originally Posted by n00w

Maybe a bit too subtle for you...

There is shitload in your posts but irony, not even subtle, isn't!

Originally Posted by n00w

Oh, that's ironical, isn't it?
No Rainbow Trio version on TOSEC. Since it's your claim that they did it 100% I guess that you're the only one here with the opportunity to check. And since I've just made a bet, I don't allow you to claim that I "seem to know" anything regarding this.

You can't and won't "allow" me anything, who do you think you are?
Also, of course, I am the only one in the whole world who has the Rainbow Trio crack of DM, sure thing.

Originally Posted by n00w

Some facts maybe?
Rainbow Trio crack release: 1988-04-12.

And these "facts" are based on which evidence?

Originally Posted by n00w

Oh yeah, sure, they had plenty of time to do this!

Yes, it took them several months to crack it, amazing eh?

Originally Posted by n00w

Looks like it was easy, after all...

Of course it was. Because you say so.

Originally Posted by n00w

Dunno why, but you're probably a bit too smart to understand this. And you don't talk too fast without doing any basic checks. No, never. Sure, you don't.

Dunno why but you're probably a bit too "1337" to realise that you don't impress me with your arrogant nonsense you post here. Though I am always entertained to see some more of your "subtle irony" here, go on with it.

Originally Posted by n00w

Truth is that you don't give a f... but still you have plenty of opinions and critics for those who are just making a few suggestions.

Truth is that you can't handle that someone disagrees with your "suggestions". And I actually couldn't care less what you think of me, I do like how big your mouth is though as it's quite entertaining. I also like your "facts" and "opinions", you are an excellent cracker with the biggest knowledge of the whole Amiga scene, you NEVER EVER fail and everything you say is correct because you are the greatest. I bow down.

[StingRay]

Originally Posted by Don_Adan

For me it must be only protection trick, due exist cracked version which works for 0.5MB.

If you had checked the available crack you would have noticed graphics corruption. This happens because the loader overwrites vital parts of the game due to lack of space! So far there is no 100% crack of that game which works on 512k machines.

[Don_Adan]

Originally Posted by StingRay

If you had checked the available crack you would have noticed graphics corruption. This happens because the loader overwrites vital parts of the game due to lack of space! So far there is no 100% crack of that game which works on 512k machines.

I don't remember exactly graphics cooruption, I played this game many years ago. Anyway it was version fixed by G-Force. If I remember right, hiscore saving was fixed, maybe graphics corruption too, but I'm not sure.

[StingRay]

That version I do not know, I only know the commonly available CLS crack of The Plague. Also, cracking it isn't very hard, but to make it run correctly on 512k isn't easy if you do not want any bugs to occur, in the CLS version screen memory was used for the MFM buffer IIRC which caused the graphics problems.

[n00w]

Originally Posted by StingRay

There is shitload in your posts but irony, not even subtle, isn't!.

Oh, now you look angry. Nice waste of energy. 'shitload': nice vocabulary! Thank you for helping people notice your wonderful arguments.

Originally Posted by StingRay

You can't and won't "allow" me anything, who do you think you are?

My curriculum is easy to find. And yes I don't allow you to lend me intentions and knowledge which are not mine. This has nothing to do with my bio, it's just the normal respect a human being can expect from another one in a public discussion space. Btw, interesting question: who do you think you are, yourself?

Originally Posted by StingRay

Also, of course, I am the only one in the whole world who has the Rainbow Trio crack of DM, sure thing.

Ok, I've recently discovered TOSEC. Thought one site was reference for getting files, it wasn't. Well noted and good that you find it funny, though!

Originally Posted by StingRay

Rainbow Trio crack release: 1988-04-12.
And these "facts" are based on which evidence?

The Rainbow Trio crack intro itself (second part) quote "cracked by Skull on the 12th of April 1988" ...
"Finally" was because World of Wonders rushed two consecutive versions, the second boasting 100%, but it was as bad as the first one.

Originally Posted by StingRay

Yes, it took them several months to crack it, amazing eh?

Mmmh. Between April 1988 official German release, and 12th of April 1988. "Several months". No comment.

Because you are taking several months yourself to issue your HD ports doesn't mean that at the time the crackers took several months. There was competition, thrill, challenge y'know.

Originally Posted by StingRay

Of course it was. Because you say so.

Here I was talking to Galahad. Nice of you to respond in his self. And since it took them maybe several days, and you can't remove their intro because of the patch, well... I guess it was easy enough for them, at least.

Originally Posted by StingRay

Dunno why but you're probably a bit too "1337" to realise that you don't impress me with your arrogant nonsense you post here. Though I am always entertained to see some more of your "subtle irony" here, go on with it..

Here it is. You're welcome.

Originally Posted by StingRay

Truth is that you can't handle that someone disagrees with your "suggestions".

I would have expected some more challenging disagreement, as the case of Dungeon Master appeared interesting enough for me to dig into it in the first place. Truth is that you can't handle people who are calling themselves "1337". But it existed and you can't change the past. I'm not saying you're bad because you weren't part of that scene, and you're probably doing very good things by yourself. And I guess you will have plenty of occasions to prove your valour. I'm not bad because I was '1337' y'know.

Originally Posted by StingRay

I also like your "facts" and "opinions", you are an excellent cracker with the biggest knowledge of the whole Amiga scene, you NEVER EVER fail and everything you say is correct because you are the greatest. I bow down.

Hints again at your complex. Plus I've never been a cracker on Amiga.

On the other hand, I've known and worked with many of them, in different situations notably as original supplier and group organizer. Had a bunch of nice discussions. Learned some tricks about cracking on Amiga by some of them. Had fewer contacts with others. Btw, they were generally nice and not arrogant people, except for a few ones.

[paragraph deleted]

[prowler]

Guys, please limit your discussion to badly cracked Amiga games. Personal insults and innuendo have no place here and should be confined to PMs.

[TCD]

Originally Posted by n00w

Plus I've never been a cracker on Amiga.

And it shows I have to say. By all means you should check your facts twice before doubting that StingRay knows what he talks about...

[n00w]

Originally Posted by TCD

And it shows I have to say. By all means you should check your facts twice before doubting that StingRay knows what he talks about...

I have also mentionned this in my first post, I was a cracker on Amstrad CPC in the 1986-88 period, before I did something else on Amiga. But I understand that there's a lot of info exchanged in these forums and no one is entitled to read and remind everything as we are not robots.

I understand your claim and respect the fact that this forum is not a place for insults. Please understand that on my side I've not used any direct insults towards StinGray in the definition of the word (which he did against me). I regret that bringing a little challenge on the table through provocative stance has slipped into this kind of unobjective and totally surreal discussions.

Now please understand also that nobody is infallible, even Stingray. I've never said that he doesn't know what he's talking about. I've never doubted his skills. But when he says it took months to the Rainbow Trio to crack the game when evidence is there that it took them only a few days at max, and that they used a patch, I wonder who has not checked the facts twice.

I was just introducing Dungeon Master as the only real challenge, besides Dragon's Lair, to which the crackers at that time were really confronted to. I guess that it belongs to a topic such as "The most badly cracked Amiga game ".

This doesn't come out of nowhere and whether I'm not infallible myself, I also know what I'm talking about having been an in-depth active part of that 'scene' since the early years.

After reading the interesting text about Meynaf's crack provided by Don_Adan (thanks!), it appeared that the possibility of a patch was eluded from the explanations given about this version.

Also Stingray came with the Rainbow Trio German release (thanks for the info).

Since then, according to the method used by Meynaf, and the much later English version released by Eagle Soft Inc., it appeared very unlikely that The Rainbow Trio would have used it in such a short time, thus my suggestions that they had found another way to proceed. And according to experience, this other way was possibly a patch.

So I did everything to find this version, at least the intro, to double check by myself. Which I did, hence the facts I'm providing there. And although you are moderator, for good faith, it's not very fair from you to accuse me of not double-checking my facts.

By the way, I'm in my right to respond to such accusations. For the rest, I hope that the discussions will resume in a normal way on the topic of this thread.

[StingRay]

Originally Posted by prowler

Guys, please limit your discussion to badly cracked Amiga games. Personal insults and innuendo have no place here and should be confined to PMs.

Agreed and as such I will not reply to "off-topic" stuff from a certain person anymore.

The Rainbow Trio crack intro itself (second part) quote "cracked by Skull on the 12th of April 1988" ... [B]

dc.b "Cracked by Skull of Rainbow Trio on the 12th of April."

'Nuff said.

[TCD]

Originally Posted by n00w

So I did everything to find this version, at least the intro, to double check by myself. Which I did, hence the facts I'm providing there. And although you are moderator, for good faith, it's not very fair from you to accuse me of not double-checking my facts.

Seems like it was fair. For cross-reference: http://bitworld.bitfellas.org/demo.php?id=2378
Next time do your homework a bit better before you come across as bold as you did. I hope you can at least admit that you stand corrected and next time approach a topic with a bit more care.

[n00w]

Ok guyz, I assume everything I have written, including the fact that I was wrong. My responsibility.

I double checked before claiming and I was sure that what was written was 1988 and not 1989. So checking was not the problem. Most likely I'm very tired, stressed by work and irascible.

Last thing I've done now before responding has been checking the files directly on disk, just in case I would find something of help, but obviously found that you were right.

Btw I'm not very confident in the data on Bitfellas. Have seen many bullsh*t there, including fake dates, wrong countries for members, and many kinds of errors.

I must add once again not in my advantage that in the intro text the cracker explains everything he has done, i.e. a full crack of the game.

I swear I never take drugs and rarely drink alcohol.

Either I should work less and have more sleep, or I should go out and profit from the sun instead of claiming facts that are not facts.

Or I should buy me glasses [joking].

Anyway please accept my sincere apologies for all this mess.

"I'm too old for this sh*t!" (famous quote)

Have fun dudes!

[prowler]

Originally Posted by n00w

Anyway please accept my sincere apologies for all this mess.

Your apology is accepted.

Thanks for that. I hope that you won't be deterred from posting in these forums again.

[n00w]

No problem. I'm not going to be deterred from posting as long as there's no good reason for this.

Btw, I've seen a few other threads here which are talking about games difficult to crack, notably this one:
http://eab.abime.net/nostalgia-memor...ugh-crack.html
... and yes it reminds me about Hook.

Here I'm not sure that Fairlight was the only group to release it (badly) at the time. I remember I had the original just a few days after I supplied Push Over to Crack Inc. but we decided not to release it because of the Fairlight crack.

I then checked on he BBSs as usual and If I remember well there was another release of Hook which had just been uploaded.

Maybe Fusion as they were quite active at the time, or another less known group like Agile. Dunno if it was 100% if it was real.

Btw I had the original in my hands so it didn't need to download any version at all.

[Galahad/FLT]

Originally Posted by n00w

No problem. I'm not going to be deterred from posting as long as there's no good reason for this.

Btw, I've seen a few other threads here which are talking about games difficult to crack, notably this one:
http://eab.abime.net/nostalgia-memor...ugh-crack.html
... and yes it reminds me about Hook.

Here I'm not sure that Fairlight was the only group to release it (badly) at the time. I remember I had the original just a few days after I supplied Push Over to Crack Inc. but we decided not to release it because of the Fairlight crack.

I then checked on he BBSs as usual and If I remember well there was another release of Hook which had just been uploaded.

Maybe Fusion as they were quite active at the time, or another less known group like Agile. Dunno if it was 100% if it was real.

Btw I had the original in my hands so it didn't need to download any version at all.

At least two other groups fucked up but different language versions. I of course cracked all versions 100%

[n00w]

Originally Posted by Galahad/FLT

At least two other groups fucked up but different language versions. I of course cracked all versions 100%

Well done! I've seen that you did English as well as Spanish and Italian versions.

It's possible it was a localized version I've seen released, but I would have ignored Italian and Spanish releases. If Fusion, it was likely the French version as at the time they had both Bomberman+Willy and ED209+Order all suppliers based in France, and Phil Douglas (at Thrill Kill Kult) cracking for them in Belgium. Too bad most BBS's cannot be accessed anymore ...