Strange things about modules

Talking about modules, some strange things happen about these tunes

1) Hybris ingame tune is smaller than the real played music

2) Nicky boom world 1 tune has a little restart in the end of the tune

3) Weird Dreams subtune 1 is longer than the real played music

[TCD]

Which versions are you talking about? A bit hard to tell if there is anything wrong without more info

Originally Posted by TheCyberDruid

Which versions are you talking about? A bit hard to tell if there is anything wrong without more info

You simply can use Unexotica archives

[TCD]

Okay, I'll have a look then during the next days.

[mai]

Originally Posted by Another World

Talking about modules, some strange things happen about these tunes

1) Hybris ingame tune is smaller than the real played music

I think song plays in a loop, so you get no song-length,probably not supported by the "Future Player".You can read additional info in the documantation to the "Future Player"Eagleplayer.

Originally Posted by Another World

2) Nicky boom world 1 tune has a little restart in the end of the tune

Try to rip this song for yourself, if the result is the same, then nothing is wrong.

Originally Posted by Another World

3) Weird Dreams subtune 1 is longer than the real played music

I dont know, what you mean: "David Whittaker" music has a playtime of
02:56, then restarts to play.

1) 4:21 is the real time of the song, the song i downloaded from SOAMC is 4:02

2) The result is the same: length is 7:28 and in the end you hear a restart, so it's not strange but at the same time .... it's strange !!!!

3) The song i downloaded from SOAMC is 3:21, but sure the right length is 2:56

[TCD]

It would have been really interesting to know that you talk about the SOAMC verions before Another World That was why I asked about it in the second post...
Anyway, I think only the one who recorded/ripped the tunes for SOAMC can tell you why the differences are there. Maybe you should write him an email

The exhaustive explanation of Stone about module 1 and 3


* DeliPlayer's playlists is the ONLY thing I used to determine the lengths for all songs in my SOAMC archive. Nothing is done manually by ear or by other software.
What it spits out is what I have to use and trust and eventually what is available in the SOAMC collection.
* Songs that are 4:00 are very often unable to show length in DeliPlayer 2.50b for PC (see screenshot, no song length found).
* Songs that are 4:00 WILL have strange looping points, maybe cut off (if the song actually by ear listning lasts for 5:35)
* Here is for instance a screenshot of what the Weird Dreams DW module shows:

---- See attached picture ---

As you can see, it's 3:19 (and yes, if you play the song by ear its actually 2:57 or so as the post mentions).

** This is a DeliPlayer/engine plugin issue, it has problems with some formats to determine the song lengths correctly.**

But, to be sure the recording gets the entire thing, there is a security added to my recording of about 1 to 2
seconds additionally. This is to make sure the recording don't record exactly 3:19, as some modules
require an small amount of init before it actually starts to play on the Amiga. Mostly they start at once,
but sometimes it can take 0.5 seconds before it plays.

That means the recording already should last for 3:19.5 which I round upwards to 3:20 to be sure.
To really be secure, I add 1 second at the end of the recording to make sure I really get everything recorded
automatically. Therefore, this song will be 3:21 as the downloaded MP3 also will show.

In the screenshot you also see what some songs are without length. For those tunes, I always set 4:00 as
recording time (as per DeliPlayer defaults too). If one of these only lasts for 30 seconds and loops, the track
will still be recorded for 4:00 regardsless. I cannot manually go through each song in the archive to determine
by ear and cut the songs. It's about 230000 files you know

As far as I know, DeliPlayer for PC is the best song length detection software for a great lot of different formats.
It also enable me to save the playlists, which I later extract the songs lengths out of. I could not do this so elegantly
on any other software on PC or on Amiga that I know of.

Therefore there will be songs from strange formats that sounds "wrong", but are not really since it's the same result anybody
would get if they tried to record it automatically via playlists for such a wealth of formats and tunes that I'm processing too )

To add to the problem list, there are also differences in playing modules on DeliTracker(Amiga), EaglePlayer(Amiga) vs
Deliplayer(PC) too. I've encountered a lot of strange playback problems (often due to different player engine plugins), but
what I present is the best I could make of it (during a week of bug/random playback testing before the recording started)
without spending a life time creating the archive

The exhaustive explanation of Stone about module 2


""2) The result is the same: length is 7:28 and in the end you hear a restart, so it's not strange but at the same time .... it's strange !!!!""

The song is shown as 7:28 in DeliPlayer:

---- see attached picture ----

But if you listen to it by ear, you will see that the music ends at 7:21 approx (which is the same as
the downloaded MP3 file). The reason for the remaining seconds in DeliPlayer is that the current
end pattern is just silence before it re-starts. Therefore calculation of the module will show 7:28, it
does NOT detect "end of sound/silence" but calculates the time based on the pattern speed & length.
That means it plays for 7:28, where the last 7 seconds is just silence during playback.

For my recordings I have applied a wav cutting procedure cutting away all that is silence. So during
recording the file was actually 7:30 probably, but due to the silence cut off it ended up
to about 7:21. No need to record/store silence you know

[TCD]

See, sometimes the answer is so easy No really, I can understand Stones point and also that you can't check each of the 230000 files. Another miracle of the Amiga solved I would say

[Don_Adan]

Perhaps some music from SOAMC are saved on 60Hz (NTSC Amiga), when must be saved on 50 Hz (PAL Amiga).

[OddbOd]

Good point, do you have any idea how many replayers rely on vblank for their timing?

[Don_Adan]

Originally Posted by OddbOd

Good point, do you have any idea how many replayers rely on vblank for their timing?

Most of Amiga soundformats works under VBI, and if no special handling
for PAL and NTSC Amiga, then always works with different speed. Only a few soundformats works on timers f.e. Ron Klaren (Custommade), SoundFX, Silmarils.

Stone message about PAL vs NTSC


Ahh, yeah the dreaded PAL vs NTSC issue. Same problem caused a lot of re-recording and headaches on the SOASC= project. Kinda solved, since I aquired NTSC machines.
For the Amiga, I hoped that the timers in EaglePlayer would take care of that for me. I haven't checked timing issues on the PAL vs NTSC. My entire collection was recorded on a PAL A1200.
So in general one can end up with a lot of confusions, this beause:
Set Machine in PAL, mix that with buggy player engines, choose different Timings, where as CUST modules have different timings than its original counterparts modules...like Hybris.... CUST format and Future Player differences
THEN: Double the problems dealing with NTSC.
Could be a very hard research project to pull off. One basically have to test around 100 formats, all player engines available and mix that with a couple of thousand different music files mixed with
3 different timing methods. Heh, surely not a task for me.

[Don_Adan]

Originally Posted by Another World

Stone message about PAL vs NTSC


Ahh, yeah the dreaded PAL vs NTSC issue. Same problem caused a lot of re-recording and headaches on the SOASC= project. Kinda solved, since I aquired NTSC machines.
For the Amiga, I hoped that the timers in EaglePlayer would take care of that for me. I haven't checked timing issues on the PAL vs NTSC. My entire collection was recorded on a PAL A1200.
So in general one can end up with a lot of confusions, this beause:
Set Machine in PAL, mix that with buggy player engines, choose different Timings, where as CUST modules have different timings than its original counterparts modules...like Hybris.... CUST format and Future Player differences
THEN: Double the problems dealing with NTSC.
Could be a very hard research project to pull off. One basically have to test around 100 formats, all player engines available and mix that with a couple of thousand different music files mixed with
3 different timing methods. Heh, surely not a task for me.

Future Player format works under timer, not VBI, if I remember right.Then playtime for NTSC and PAL Amiga must be almost identical.Perhaps you can detect (by your ears) if module is played too shortor this module is played on different speed only.