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Old 19 March 2003, 02:58   #21
Korodny
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@Burseg:

Quote:
This is the way today's fake amiga developers try to make you think.
That's an outright insult. Watch your wording.

Quote:
These type of "developers" appeared since the demise of commodore.
They did not "appear", they were always here. Check Aminet for lots of examples.

It's pretty obvious that only smaller teams (with a smaller budget) are left if the big boys leave.

Quote:
They are designing shit games
Care to name a few examples? Here's a list of all commercial titles released in the last three years:

Tales From Heaven
Seaside
Foundation: The Undiscovered Land
Heretic 2
Foundation Gold
Joyride
CodeName Hellsquad
Bubble Heroes
Virtual Ball Fighters
Nightlong
Earth 2140
Simon the Sorcerer 2
Exodus: The Last War
Aqua
Payback
Land of Genesis
Shogo
Freespace: The Great War
PuzzleBOBs
The Feeble Files
Software Tycoon
Tales of Tamar
Quake 2
Crossfire 2

The only "bad" title in this collection would be "PuzzleBobs", but that was sold for 15 EUR. The quality of some other titles (Joyride, Aqua) is not overwhelming but far from making me shout "SCAM!" immediately.

Where are all those shitty titles you're talking about?
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Old 19 March 2003, 04:00   #22
oldpx
 
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So I'm obligated to create a long list just because I said this game is shit eh?

Ok!!

Quote:
That's an outright insult. Watch your wording.
That's outright fact. I know what I'm saying though this does not mean there are no good games. I listed many on my post. If one is to be insulted by my comments it won't be my loss.

Quote:
They did not "appear", they were always here. Check Aminet for lots of examples.
Sure, and they earned what they deserved, nothing. Bad scores on mag reviews. Now some of us are supporting newer poor titles just because they are released. Most of the games you mentioned are PC ports, others are bad or even good games!

-----------------------------------------------------------

Nightlong
The Feeble Files
Heretic 2
Earth 2140
Simon the Sorcerer 2
Payback
Shogo
Freespace: The Great War
Software Tycoon
Tales of Tamar
Quake 2
Virtual Ball Fighters

PC ports! Payback is a GTA clone. Not sure about tales of tamar here, it can be good. According to screenshots, it probably is.
but...
THESE ARE NOT AMIGA GAMES
This is not a bad thing but these titles simply can't be listed in this debate. They are not designed on amigas/for amigas.

Bubble Heroes-
Puzzle BOBs - clones of a well known/bygone game. nice graphics but nothing else is worth mentioning here. These fit in my description well. You can't play these games longer than 15 minutes. Is designing a good looking tetris game mean anything than designing a good looking tetris game?

Tales From Heaven - Looks nicer than many games listed here but it's still impossible to understand why developers prefer ugly 3d to 2d here. Anyway if amiga HAS TO have 3d games, this is sadly one of the best this platform offers. It looks ugly but does look interesting so I don't want to be prejudiced. If I am to play 3d games, PC is the "real thing" here. and I accept no imitations

Crossfire 2-
Looks ugly but my standards are high, I'm undecided. It can even have good gameplay but it suffers from ugly 3d disease. Super Stardust looked better, was released years ago and required just AGA.

Aqua -
Seaside - Myst wannabes, that PC-only game type is long abandoned yet amiga developers still envy it. Prerendered crap point'n clickware. These games fit in my description. Especially Aqua is utter crap.

Joyride - This is a joke. I prefer Lotus any day.

CodeName Hellsquad-
Foundation: The Undiscovered Land-
Foundation Gold-
Land of Genesis-
Exodus: The Last War- This ones are professional looking good games. (c'mon, no need to list the same game twice) Again, these are R-Type, Settlers, Starcraft, Another World clones (I did not say shmup or RTS for these are made to look exactly like listed games) New and innovative stuff is yet to be seen still I'm grateful this stuff is released!

----------------------------------------------------------

Quote:
Where are all those shitty titles you're talking about?
Hilt, Hilt2, Trapped, Trapped 2, Mobile Warfare, Genetic Species, Master Axe, Olofight, Blade, Sword, Bograts and many others I can visualize the horrible screenshots in my mind but gladly forgot the names of. Do you like to hear more? Ok hmm, we'll have Birdie Shoot soon

I can list good non commodore-era games as well. Uropa, final odyssey (though the intro is the worst I've seen on any game on any platform), Enemy: Tempest Of Violence, Napalm, Damage ensure not only bad games are released on Amiga platform and drawing the line between those two is easy.

Last edited by Burseg; 19 March 2003 at 04:40.
 
Old 19 March 2003, 07:54   #23
sylvio k.
 
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Thumbs down

@Burseg
Hey if you dont like this game(dont know why you should) OK.
But stop flaming around! What do you think you are?
I think you are one of those people who always say
"Whooo poor amiga no good games on it we need better games an aplications..."
and on the other side you hurt the developers like us.
Such users like you are the reason why amiga dies!
And please THINK ABOUT the word Alpha Engine !!!!!!

To all:This game is in Development! We are so kind to show
the users how far we are. All screenshots are ALPHA!!!
So stop telling shit about it if you dont know how the
Engine looks in realtime and finished! >:-|
 
Old 19 March 2003, 10:43   #24
oldpx
 
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I am not flaming around but from now on I will be. I am the type of person you don't want to see. Go on demonize me, but you still make poor games and a poor website and you are hurt because I'm saying what is there. If amiga needs shit releases to survive, it better dies soon. And rather than taking YOU seriously I'd rather stick to my first post in this thread and take that thumbs down in your post and stick it somewhere. If all that you read on thread, you think I'm "flaming around", that sentence is well deserved by you

YOUR GAME IS SHIT

And I can do nothing about that

@steve
Either support your own comments longer than 24 hours or don't make them the way they are.

Last edited by Burseg; 19 March 2003 at 11:49.
 
Old 19 March 2003, 10:51   #25
sylvio k.
 
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Wink

*wuahh* wake me up when you have finished..
 
Old 19 March 2003, 10:54   #26
oldpx
 
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Your post didn't make any sense.
 
Old 19 March 2003, 13:18   #27
kriz
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Say what Burseg ???!! Why complain about something thats not finished yet, and why flame the developers ?? Surely you know about how small the amiga scene is these days, why not give them some credit for developing new games for the amiga ???

And games ported from pc is not amiga games ??? They may not be amiga-original games but when they play on amiga, they are amiga (not all older games were amiga only either...). Its easier to port something than to start developing something completely new ... (and there is a lot of good games out there that should have been ported)

And Genetic Species being bad ? Have you ever played it ? And how about Foundation, have you ever played it ??

sylvio k.: Dont listen to the people who complain, they probably doesnt even have a new ppc amiga ... Keep up the great work !!!

btw. I see Epic is going to port Divine Divinity, to MorphOS now, great news ...
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Old 19 March 2003, 13:21   #28
RetroMan
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Quote:
Originally posted by Burseg
I am not flaming around but from now on I will be. I am the type of person you don't want to see. Go on demonize me, but you still make poor games and a poor website and you are hurt because I'm saying what is there.
Well, this is EXACTLY why the Amiga Community is going down at the moment

Why canīt people just be happy that new games are being made ??? If they are good or bad, hey it DOESNīT MATTER ! These flame wars getting a bit out of hand (and I do NOT mean the EAB community here ) ..... doesnīt matter what you do as a game developer, you surely do it wrong ! If you announce a game for Classic Amigas that will also run on a standart A500, all those people with PPC/060 etc. will cry around : "Why no gfx card support, why donīt you use higher resolution ???" .... but if you do it the other way around, the others will shout : "WHAAAAAT ??? Itīs PPC only ???? But I want to play this on my A1000 with 256KB Chip Mem !!!!"

Anyway, these are just my 2cent ! If you donīt agree with it, just keep your mouth shut

@sylvio k.

Just keep up the way you do it Many people here know of the word ALPHA ENGINE and appreciate the things you do, but I guess they are too shy to comment here
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Old 19 March 2003, 13:24   #29
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That's it, that's fuckin' it. I'm pissed off now!
 
Old 19 March 2003, 13:41   #30
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Quote:
Originally posted by Steve
What would be really awesome would be if new generation Amiga games started coming out. Like 3D versions of old 2D classics. That would be well amazing. Imagine Banshee 3D or Roadkill 3D. Mmmmm. Kickass.
Oh dear. Then why would you need an Amiga? It will be a PC then by attempting to make all gaming a 3D experience.. <yawn> Why does *everything* have to be 3D? Jeezus! The Amiga made its name in 2D and lives today in the hearts and minds of its loyal fanbase because of its excellence in mainly 2D games. Those games still rock today. Amiga gaming's lowest period is when it tried to be a PC and followed the glut of 3D and FPS games - already done to death everywhere else. I'll take a round of Turrican II or Rainbow Islands anyday over this 3D dreck. Nicky Boom, even! Most of the Amiga's best action games have never been able to be successfully done on the PC for reasons which I'll not delve into (all this thread needs is the PeeCee zealots of the board to start flaming yet again over how the PC can do anything and everything!)

Quote:
Originally posted by Steve
Oh one more thing. I reckon the game title could do with a change.
Hmmm...I actually like the game name.

My apologies to sylvio k. if my negative comments about the screenshots were taken offensively. I didn't take the Alpha stage into consideration, but regardless I hate the most hailed 3D games out there anyhow, so keep that in mind. To me, the game looks like a PC game, which is perhaps the cruelest thing I can say about it.

@All
We really need to calm down here and keep it civil. This is a discussion board and we should respect each other.

Peace!
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Old 19 March 2003, 13:42   #31
IanS
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Bursreg. Why don't you go and moan at something else. You're talking a load of twaddle. You're rude and insulting, and we don't need that on EAB. You SHOULD know better!

These guys are working on something, and some constructive criticism would help no end. That way they can improve things. Give them a chance and we might be in for a pleasant surprise. And if at the end of the day we're disappointed... so what. At least somebody is giving us the chance to try something new.

Keep up the good work guys, and good luck.
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Old 19 March 2003, 23:06   #32
sylvio k.
 
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thanx,
ive nothing against some advices.
If someone has questions simply ask.
 
Old 19 March 2003, 23:59   #33
wakeupbomb
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god this is depressing

why can't we all just get along??

I ain't passin judgement on the game till its finished and to be honest i'm just happy someone is making games for the amiga.
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Old 20 March 2003, 00:04   #34
Steve
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Cool

Quote:
Originally posted by Twistin'Ghost
Oh dear. Then why would you need an Amiga? It will be a PC then by attempting to make all gaming a 3D experience.. <yawn> Why does *everything* have to be 3D? Jeezus!
Everything doesn't "have to be" 3D at all. I don't know what you have against 3D games Twist. Personally I love both 3D and 2D games. I think the best console at the moment is the GBA which is a 2D machine. Remember there has been loads of "classic" Amiga 3D games. 3D isn't just for the PC geeks. Anyway when I refered to "new generation" 3D Amiga games, I was talking about the AmigaOne. If it wants to be any sort of success in the games market then they will need to be 3D as that's what the "general consumers" want. I've been in games shops loads of times and overheard (mainly kids) picking up a 2D game and going... oh look at the shit game, the graphics are crap.. etc. All I was saying was it would be nice to see the classics given a new lease of life on the new platform.

Quote:
Most of the Amiga's best action games have never been able to be successfully done on the PC for reasons which I'll not delve into (all this thread needs is the PeeCee zealots of the board to start flaming yet again over how the PC can do anything and everything!)
These PC is better than Amiga arguments got boring 10 years ago. So if I see that boring crap on EAB I just ignore it.

Quote:
My apologies to sylvio k. if my negative comments about the screenshots were taken offensively. I didn't take the Alpha stage into consideration.
Same here. I also wasn't aware the screenshots were only alpha screenshots. Which anwers this from Burseg:

@steve
Either support your own comments longer than 24 hours or don't make them the way they are.

Quote:

@All
We really need to calm down here and keep it civil. This is a discussion board and we should respect each other.

Peace!
Here here!

It's a subject that shouldn't really start flame wars. I bet if we were all discussing this face to face it wouldn't end up in a punch up. It would be a good healthy debate. Oh well, that's the limits of these forums. I hope Burseg and the others who have left EAB return one day. Peace guys.
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Old 20 March 2003, 00:47   #35
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First off, a perfect example of how such a debate can and should go is the way we are debating, for example, the 3D thing. We express of opinionated bits and respect each other's views (even if you are wrong...LOL!)

Quote:
Originally posted by Steve
I don't know what you have against 3D games Twist.
Jane, you ignorant slut!
But seriously, I've outlined this before...the poorly applied textures, the unneccesary blurriness (is that supposed to represent depth?!?) and the dizzying perspectives. And the samieness, the shallow expressions and movements of the characters...most everything, really.
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Old 20 March 2003, 01:14   #36
Akira
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Quote:
Originally posted by IanS
[B]How many people with really good coding, rendering, artistic and design skills are going to plough all their time, for many months, in to a dead end platform?
I pointed you to the C64 scene but you don;t want to look at it, it seems.
Quote:
Originally posted by Steve
[B]I agree totally. I don't think either Akira or Burseg have the talent so that's out of the window straight away.
Well, you have no clue about what I can or cannot do. You could be surprised though.
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Old 20 March 2003, 01:24   #37
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Quote:
Originally posted by Akira
Well, you have no clue about what I can or cannot do. You could be surprised though.
I was just teasing ya.
So tell me what you can do.
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Old 20 March 2003, 01:26   #38
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Quote:
Originally posted by Steve
I was just teasing ya. So tell me what you can do.
I won't, you pir8 bitch ()

Regardless of what I can or cannot do, I still feel the C64 scene is a marvelous example to follow. I wish people worked on the Amiga as hard as on the C64, perhaps we have to let 10 more years pass?
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Old 20 March 2003, 01:44   #39
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Evil grin

Quote:
Originally posted by Akira
I won't, you pir8 bitch (
Oh, that does it!
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Old 20 March 2003, 10:58   #40
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Akira, I don't look at the C64 scene simply because it holds absolutely no interest for me. Besides, the limits of the old 8 bit hardware on the C64 almost precludes the need for bigger teams of programmers, artists and the like. Nobody is going to see giant 24 bit rendered scenes, flashy lighting effects and hear multi-channel stereo music/sounds on a C64. It's a question of scale (and economics... 'commercial' C64 games? I don't think there's a big market!). The range of skills needed to make a modern game are greater for an Amiga than the C64, 'cos the Amiga has broader capabilities. Therefore more time and money and are needed. And who has enough of those to make it a viable commercial project?

All of the above effects are 'expected' from a modern game. The C64 doesn't compare with an Amiga of any description.
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