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Old 01 June 2017, 13:03   #1
Seiya
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Possible to emulate between graphics card; the Cybervision64 3D or S3 Virge?

there is a possibility to emulate between graphics card, the Cybervision64 3D or S3 Virge?
i have found (and i don't know if it is possibile to integrate in WinUAE) its source code.
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Old 01 June 2017, 13:07   #2
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i have also find voodoo emulation source.
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Old 01 June 2017, 13:17   #3
Toni Wilen
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Wrong thread! See the first post!
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Old 01 June 2017, 13:37   #4
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Posts moved from WinUAE 3.5.0 beta series (was 3.4.1) thread for you Toni
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Old 01 June 2017, 13:55   #5
Toni Wilen
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I said in some other thread, long time ago requirements for other boards.
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Old 01 June 2017, 19:31   #6
Seiya
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What other boards you search?
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Old 01 June 2017, 22:07   #7
Toni Wilen
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Search?

You didn't answer "why" question. (Worst reason is to be able to run (crappy) Amiga ports of PC (3D) games! Just use PC!)

Only display card may happen someday is single 3d capable card that is compatible with all AmigaOS versions. When/if some license compatible PC emulator/whatever implements one. Voodoo 3 probably is the most obvious one. (Most other old ones have too limited max VRAM size)

Getting some display card emulation from some other emulator work is huge amount of work, it needs to interface to memory handling (lots of annoying banking), display handling (color conversions etc), interrupts and more.

(and don't think I didn't notice what you said in some other forum...)
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Old 01 June 2017, 22:31   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Toni Wilen View Post
(and don't think I didn't notice what you said in some other forum...)
That infamous magical crystal ball of yours again!
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Old 02 June 2017, 01:33   #9
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Originally Posted by Toni Wilen View Post
Search?

You didn't answer "why" question. (Worst reason is to be able to run (crappy) Amiga ports of PC (3D) games! Just use PC!)
Getting some display card emulation from some other emulator work is huge amount of work, it needs to interface to memory handling (lots of annoying banking), display handling (color conversions etc), interrupts and more.
WinUAE need more developers!

so its source is completely free?
A coder could be make any change and compile a new version completely different from this one?

Quote:
(and don't think I didn't notice what you said in some other forum...)
very well. I'm happy you notice!
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Old 02 June 2017, 08:22   #10
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A coder could be make any change and compile a new version completely different from this one?
Help yourself: https://github.com/tonioni/WinUAE
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Old 02 June 2017, 09:39   #11
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That is much easier said than done..

Emulator code can be very difficult to understand if you aren't already familiar with them. For example emulator needs to emulate multiple chips sequentially (in worst case switching between chips cycle-by-cycle) that in real world run simultaneously and still be fast. It can make code really weird and ugly..

Anyway, you still didn't say why S3 based display cards are needed? They have usual low VRAM limit, "low" resolutions -> not very useful as RTG boards. Only useful feature is to be able to run some programs (is there even any?) that directly access the hardware.

Also does existing emulation implement chip's blitter fully? Picasso96/CGFX drivers use chip's blitter heavily, more heavily than some original Windows 95 drivers! (Original QEMU Cirrus Logic blitter emulation had lots of bugs that only triggered in Amiga RTG modes.)

Something like HD controller does not need to make any sense because adding one is few hours of work.
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Old 02 June 2017, 10:21   #12
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Anyway, you still didn't say why S3 based display cards are needed? They have usual low VRAM limit, "low" resolutions -> not very useful as RTG boards. Only useful feature is to be able to run some programs (is there even any?) that directly access the hardware.

because in WinUAE there are many RTG Board from Picasso II to Piccasso IV and many others well known on Amiga Universe.
CyberVision64/Cybvervision64 3D are also well known, so it will be nice to have full supporto to Virge for some software/games.
WinUAE has emulate very well some particular hardware, supports unimplmented fpu instruction, soft fpu, so i think it's time to supports also RTG with 3D support to have complete hardware emulation.

You said right when you say that better play on PC for 3D Acceleration, but i would be nice play also on Amiga side right
for a complete retrogaming.
i can play at Wiepout 2097 with PC and instead i play on DOSBox with emulated 3dfx.

I don't know WinUAE source, i'm not a coder, but if you are alone to develop it, i understand that is a huge works to supports various hardware emulation.
i can help you only providing some source from other emulators

Last edited by Seiya; 02 June 2017 at 13:17.
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Old 02 June 2017, 14:53   #13
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I'd like to see the Cybervision 64/3d emulated just so I can fully duplicate my A4000T in WinUAE. It was doable when I had a Picasso II installed since that card's emulation is available.

It's not an issue, just would be nice. As it seems to be the only S3Virge based card for the Amiga, I completely understand it not being emulated.
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Old 02 June 2017, 17:54   #14
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I thought that most / all games which use the 3D hardware in these cards do so using a 3D API like Warp3D?

I also thought that a long time ago (2003) Toni added the ability to write a Warp3D or StormMESA driver for uaegfx?

Someone (possibly more than one?) wrote drivers and you can run 3D accelerated games under WinUAE

http://aminet.net/package/driver/video/QuarkTex
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Old 02 June 2017, 18:31   #15
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quarktext is old and very buggy.
A part GLQuake i never found others working games
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Old 02 June 2017, 18:34   #16
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If you really insist theres also Allan's http://thellier.free.fr/Wazp3D.htm

He posts here regularly so if you need help or something i suppose just creating a thread about it would be the right way to go.
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Old 02 June 2017, 18:34   #17
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Maybe but that is probably the best start? It needs a new maintainer?
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Old 02 June 2017, 18:55   #18
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As i said, he posts here regularly, ask him your questions.

Start reading his webpage on what it is and what it does.....
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Old 03 June 2017, 00:12   #19
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However, Cybervision 64/3D should be supported because it is one of the best Amiga RTG Boards.
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Old 03 June 2017, 01:13   #20
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However, Cybervision 64/3D should be supported because it is one of the best Amiga RTG Boards.
Easy for you to say that but what / how are you actually contributing to this request that is so important to you?!? You have no idea how difficult this possibly is. Toni tried to explain but it seems it fell on deaf ears...

On my own personal level, there has been many a thing that I would love either fixed in WinUAE or ported to the Amiga

Regarding both of the above, I don't have the skills (like yourself) to make things happen sadly...

...so, all I can do to encourage effort is donate to these guys in order to give some kind of incentive.

WinUAE is a free emulator and Toni works 24 / 7 improving, fixing, supporting it. Whenever something I've requested gets fixed I donate, it's that simple.

With Amiga ports; "Karateka" and "Arctic Moves", I donated €200 for each game to meynaf. This is peanuts considering the time he spend trying to achieve these requests...

Anyway, my point is, if you really want Toni to take on the laborious task of implementing something sooooo difficult / boring then put your money where your mouth is and hopefully he can make it happen.
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