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Old 15 August 2014, 08:11   #41
Toni Wilen
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mequa View Post
Another thing: I am curious why PearPC's JIT was suggested for future WinUAE PPC emulation, since as far as I am aware PearPC is not actively maintained and is considered quite slow. How about a PPC JIT core from QEMU, or Dolphin (Gamecube/Wii emulator) - the latter is quite fast, if a recent i7 can comfortably emulate a 700MHz+ PPC CPU (and potentially more), this may be quite fast for OS4.x (and/or MorphOS).
I explained it in beta thread. Probably twice.

PearPC: simply because CPU emulator was really simple to detach from main PearPC code.

QEMU: Not going to be possible without someone who knows QEMU inside out. CPU cores and JIT (TCG) is deeply connected to QEMU internals.

Dolphin: If someone can guarantee PPC CPU is 100% 603/604 compatible, with some simple tweaks. (I don't think so). It is also console emulator (vs generic computer) and unused CPU features are rarely emulated (that may be used by some computer OS).

Speed is not important, speed comes last if ever. Check any other emulator!

Also, I have seen any qemu vs pearpc tests that actually compare same things. Exact same code generated by exact same compiler running on exact same OS and code that does not depend on any hardware expansions, just pure CPU.

Quote:
My understanding is that the PPC JIT from SheepShaver (PPC classic Mac emulator) lacks MMU support which is needed for OS4.x. I'm not sure if MorphOS (whether the classic PowerUP Free Edition, or the current 3.x builds) has the same MMU requirement as OS4.x there.
Even PowerUP and WarpOS require MMU, at least partially.
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Old 15 August 2014, 10:15   #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mequa View Post
Another thing: I am curious why PearPC's JIT was suggested for future WinUAE PPC emulation, since as far as I am aware PearPC is not actively maintained and is considered quite slow. How about a PPC JIT core from QEMU, or Dolphin (Gamecube/Wii emulator) - the latter is quite fast, if a recent i7 can comfortably emulate a 700MHz+ PPC CPU (and potentially more), this may be quite fast for OS4.x (and/or MorphOS).

My understanding is that the PPC JIT from SheepShaver (PPC classic Mac emulator) lacks MMU support which is needed for OS4.x. I'm not sure if MorphOS (whether the classic PowerUP Free Edition, or the current 3.x builds) has the same MMU requirement as OS4.x there.

PearPC was choosen because it was the easiest to implement according to Toni Wilen. And he has never had that much intresst in PPC so he took the quickest road to get results and thats it. And why he didnt activate JIT to start with is that its easier to debug without. When he reaches what he thinks is enough he will activate JIT and if it works fine, if not then it will be left out, But its open source so "anyone" can replace the PPC part with another.


EDIT: i was to late see Toni´s answer instead.
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Old 15 August 2014, 10:43   #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sandro View Post
can anyone upload please a winuae config with cyberstorm working, thanks

That's very interesting. Do you remember that I can not boot my AmiKit Real with the BPPC config I posted? CWB works with that config.

And now, with my CSPPC config I can boot and run AK Real but it can't boot CWB. I get a black screen with it and not even F12 works...
Attached Files
File Type: uae AmiKit HDF 1.0 RTG CyberStorm PPC.uae (29.5 KB, 145 views)
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Old 15 August 2014, 11:28   #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Retrofan View Post
That's very interesting. Do you remember that I can not boot my AmiKit Real with the BPPC config I posted? CWB works with that config.

And now, with my CSPPC config I can boot and run AK Real but it can't boot CWB. I get a black screen with it and not even F12 works...
I get that when there is an error with the config file. It highjacks windows and your screwed, cant even run task manager to kill it. Have to reboot.
I normally tell it to reboot, then cancel the reboot and it seems to force kill winuae. Saves rebooting then.
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Old 15 August 2014, 11:49   #45
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Toni Wilen View Post
There is some problems with rom selection, it works better if you keep rom selection dialog blank (=autoselect). Should work better in next beta.

btw, attached is some never before seen screenshots..

EDIT: In next beta. Boots horribly slowly but WB runs quite nicely. Should be much better when/if PearPC JIT can be added. Also remember that OS 4 is commercial product, don't ask stupid questions.

Just spotted this - FAN-TAS-TIC
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Old 15 August 2014, 15:08   #46
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Originally Posted by DDNI View Post
@All, here is where you can BUY AmigaOS4.1 classic!
http://amigakit.leamancomputing.com/...oducts_id=1035
I would take a guess that there aren't too many copies of that in stock (I mean, how many PowerPC accelerator boards were ever even made?). Once they sell out, do we expect there to be any more production runs? I've noticed that the Pegasos and AmigaOneXE versions of AmigaOS4.1 has been out of stock everywhere for a while.

If you are at all interested in getting a copy, now may be the time to buy, especially before the few places selling it realize that there is a newfound demand for it.

I didn't wait until they were out of stock.

Just a bit of advice.
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Old 15 August 2014, 15:36   #47
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if there is demand they just could make new CD I guess.
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Old 15 August 2014, 15:38   #48
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I'm sure if there's demand it will be easy enough to restock, thety are just printed boxes with manuals and printed CDROM, it's very cheap and fast to get such an item produced.

@Toni,

Is it possible that the 3D Hardware Effects in OS4.1 under Radeon Cards would work on WinUAE?

Steve.
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Old 15 August 2014, 16:38   #49
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Here is an interesting discussion on the same topic -> http://amigaworld.net/modules/newbb/...=38669&forum=8
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Old 15 August 2014, 16:41   #50
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Can anyone here that's had experience with OS4.1 (or 4.0) for Classic systems tell me if the boot diskette is absolutely necessary, and what's on it? Is it required to install the OS, and/or is it available in .adf?
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Old 15 August 2014, 16:45   #51
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MickJT View Post
Can anyone here that's had experience with OS4.1 (or 4.0) for Classic systems tell me if the boot diskette is absolutely necessary, and what's on it? Is it required to install the OS, and/or is it available in .adf?
Its available on the OS4.1 CD and no its not required if your able to boot from disc. Its only needed if you need drivers to activate CD ROM drive.
If you really need boot disk, just use the cd in WB3.9 and create the boot floppy from there.
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Old 15 August 2014, 16:48   #52
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MickJT View Post
Can anyone here that's had experience with OS4.1 (or 4.0) for Classic systems tell me if the boot diskette is absolutely necessary, and what's on it? Is it required to install the OS, and/or is it available in .adf?
It is necessary to install the Cd for the first time. It is available also in adf; I had problems with the original floppy disk so I downloaded -Registered users only- an adf from them. Edit: Or did I take it from the Cd? Now I don't remember.

Sorry I won't tell about the contents.

Edit: Thanks Fol for the info; I didn't know.

Last edited by Retrofan; 15 August 2014 at 16:56.
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Old 15 August 2014, 16:51   #53
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IIRC there is an ADF of the install floppy on the CD.

CSPPC users can just boot from SCSI CDROM to install, A1200 users will need to boot from floppy to get the CDROM driver loaded and continue booting from CD.

This is because BPPC's SCSI isn't supported by OS4.x

If you talk about WinUAE I guess it should be possible just to boot from the CD?
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Old 15 August 2014, 16:53   #54
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fitzsteve View Post
IIRC there is an ADF of the install floppy on the CD.
There's a script that creates disk.


Quote:
Originally Posted by fitzsteve View Post
If you talk about WinUAE I guess it should be possible just to boot from the CD?
Correct.
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Old 15 August 2014, 17:12   #55
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@Retrofan

I didn't mean a listing of the files on it, but just info on what it's for, what it does, and if it's necessary.

@FOL

The installation script works on 3.9?

Thanks both of you, & fitzsteve.
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Old 15 August 2014, 17:30   #56
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(I mean, how many PowerPC accelerator boards were ever even made?).
BlizzardPPC 10.000 units were sold and 2.000 CyberStormPPC
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Old 15 August 2014, 17:40   #57
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Quote:
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@FOL
The installation script works on 3.9?
Correct, you can also boot OS4.1 from 3.9 if needed.
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Old 16 August 2014, 00:02   #58
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I wonder when the first emulated AOS4.1 classic thread will appear in the Hyperion support forum?
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Old 16 August 2014, 00:14   #59
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I wonder when the first emulated AOS4.1 classic thread will appear in the Hyperion support forum?
If they have bought OS4.1, I cant see a problem in them asking questions on Hyperions forum.
Even if people haven't, Im sure they will still ask questions.
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Old 16 August 2014, 08:17   #60
Toni Wilen
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About QEMU and Dolphin:

Dolphin does not support MMU in JIT modes (Non-JIT MMU is also only experimental). Also it does not support all integer exceptions (for example overflow/division by zero), [EDIT: general purpose computer] emulator that does not run buggy/crashing programs correctly (without crashing emulator or emulated operating system) is not that useful. PearPC has same problem, minimal exception support.

It leaves QEMU which seems to do everything. Which is unfortunately also the most complex beast with huge dependencies with other QEMU modules and objects.. Including GCC-only features.
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