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Old 22 February 2013, 20:20   #41
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Ive enjoyed the few Christmas contests Cammy organised over the years, even if I never completed anything on time.
A few Amiga related prizes might be a nice little incentive should there be another game making contest, and could help support the scene too (perhaps things like a copy of Hollywood, Amijewelled, etc.). I also liked the idea of the top "X" places winning help to polish some graphics and sound by volunteers who might have some skills original author(s) dont, and maybe a compilation cd (with inlets) of all entrants. Top few winners could maybe have a solo packaged cd as well.

Just some random ideas mind you, nothing set in stone

These prizes however would have to be funded somehow or another. Is there enough classic users left who are willing to (not just say without delivering) donate to such a thing? Would probably need somewhere in the realm of $1K (give or take a few hundred) to do the prize thing properly, and not just a token gesture.

Not that prizes need to be the focal point, but a few nice little prizes can lend some credence to a contest. The money donated towards them (or lack of) would also demonstrate just how willing an audience is to spend a few $$ for new software, so anyone contemplating spending the time and effort in developing new 68k amiga games could get a feel for what to expect.
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Old 22 February 2013, 20:40   #42
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Originally Posted by Akira View Post
People's acceptance of anything "just because it's for Amiga", a sentiment expressed above in this thread (someone saying they are happy with just seeing the Amiga logo on a game), is not going to lead to proper grade Amiga games to be developed either.

Someone? I am not someone. I am vitux
I did not say "happy". I said "love it". I'm not an idiot about it.
I think I well understood OlafSch. Commercial games help attract more audience, advertising, more public interest is more serious software develope.

Just what I meant
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Old 22 February 2013, 21:22   #43
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Ah, Id thought he was responding to me for saying, "I just think its cool to have a new boxed 'amiga' title, regardless of which flavors theyve omitted, and cant bring myself to begrudge anyone who's decided to have a crack."

Now Im not sure whose sentiments were being contorted
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Old 22 February 2013, 21:22   #44
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I'm sure if folk chipped in a few £/€/$ to the pot and the winner gets it all or like 50% for the first place 33% for the second place and so on

or have a crap games contest, the winner being the worst game, that way programming skill isn't an impediment
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Old 23 February 2013, 00:49   #45
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Originally Posted by fishyfish View Post
Im assuming you mean me when you say, "someone saying they are happy with just seeing the Amiga logo on a game".
No, sorry, but you shouldn't jump to conclusions. Where exactly would you have said that? HOwever, take your time to read the thread and find out that user "vitux" is the one that says, literally, "I love to see the logo Amiga in a box, again, this is very important and can help to encourage other companies."

And it does have to do with my point. My point is, and I said it clearly: accepting any shit just because it's "for Amiga" doesn't help, rather the opposite.

Now let's address you:

Anything people release is going to be compared to what was developed by yesteryears fully fledged commercial companies
Not true. Lobotomika expresses good examples above. I also invite you, again, to look at RGCD's catalogue.

consisting of multiple people, each with a forte, and a development budget.
Again, not true. Commercial gaming development wasn't entirely like that even in Amiga days. There was still a lot of "bedroom coding" and games done by one man teams. Also in most cases, "budget" was a non-existent word. People usually, or many times, make a game and then pitch it to a publisher.

Joe "Homebrew In His Spare Time" Public cant compete here.
Look at Mr. Beanbag and try to say that again. And the developer has even refused many times to make any sort of money out of it. This quite opposes your very point.
A labor of love still requires an audience to keep up motivation to polish something
If the world was like that, we wouldnt have any innovations. Creative people have a will of their own to create quality stuff. If you want to use teh Amiga scene again as an example, as I said, any turd released that is for, runs on or somehow has AMIGA attached to it (even if only by name) is worshiped as if it was the second coming of Jay Miner, so there would be a lot of this "love" you mention in quite an audience , making your point quite moot.

Now this leaves higher spec 68k Amigas as a more interesting target, as it has the potential to do more interesting things than what has been done to death already.
Another very poor argument. Just look at the Commodore 64, which has remained on its stock hardware forever, and what can be possible with it nowadays. Just fire up Coma Light 13 by Oxyron. Go ahead, don't take my word for it.
If a C64 is still today "learning new tricks", how can you say a more advanced machine like an A500 or A1200, in their stock config, are "done to death"??????

This game for example isnt even finished and people are already quick to dismiss it, citing it as "homebrew looking", and other such nonsense.
It's not nonsense. It's how it looks. It's a fact. It's toted as "AAA+" when an "AAA+" title would be something like Watchdogs. Do you get the difference?

There are exceptions though and some 68k fans do seem to appreciate peoples efforts without the need to know better, but honestly, given the reception people typically get, why would anyone try developing a good quality game these days for classic amiga?
It's funny because most of the people will accept anything made for Amiga, as I said before, and only because a few of us don't, you say it's "everybody" that "discourages".

In regards to c64 development, its a different kettle of fish with its much more limited graphics, and simplistic gamestyles.
In brief: you have no idea of what you are talking about.

Last edited by Akira; 23 February 2013 at 00:59.
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Old 23 February 2013, 02:06   #46
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Being that youre one of the people I mention that "knows it all", while doing nothing youre very hard to take seriously, however,.....

Perhaps you could try to understand to interperet? Most of your "points" are to things Ive not said, but rather a twist on them. Also, are you familar with the idea of "figure of speech"? I cant help but get the impression you'd be "correcting" me if I used the term "bitten off more than he can chew" with some explanation of how its not possible because of mouth structure (or similar). Language isnt always literal.
C64,.... yes, less time consuming to develop for a limited machine with 16 colors in 320x200 (effectively 160x200 in multicolor, although with provisos), and 64KB. Yes it still has its challenges, but to produce a title people perceive as quality is more time consuming on a more modern machine.
In brief: Being that Ive developed for c64 and Amiga I know what Im talking about. I'll happily pit my skills and knowledge here against yours with both formats if you care to do something other than "know-it-all" for a change?
Im already familiar with RGCD thanks.
Now clearly people do compare what has come before. Look at this very thread as an example.

Now as for the idea of people "accepting shit", ever think that most people are trying to encourage? Constructive criticism is much more effective than saying something is shit.
This Kickstarter project isnt even finished, yet people are already dismissing it.
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Old 23 February 2013, 02:20   #47
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Sometimes it feels like these 'discussions' are a part of the problem... I don't even see why this thread turned out into yet another 'Y U NO MAKE 68k GAMES?' flame war... it's pointless and it happens all the time. I know that Akira often enough offered to help with game projects, so it's surely not his fault and that fishyfish right now wants to make a game... so it's in a way really sad to see how those energies get wasted over something that isn't even related. Just my 2 cent and maybe some food for thoughts how to change the situation about non-turdish 68k games.
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Old 23 February 2013, 02:52   #48
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fishyfish: then I think understand that you too love seeing the logo Amiga in a box. right?

Oh Akira, I see that you belong to Modds Plateau, demoscena I love, I appreciate your productions. I also see that you are Argentine. greetings brother.
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Old 23 February 2013, 03:01   #49
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Originally Posted by Retro-Nerd View Post
A decent looking, fully polished, 68k game
What do "decent looking fully polished games" have to do with this discussion? You already explained that the game we're discussing has a "homebrewish look".

would certainly sell many more games than this OS 4/AROS aimed game. Even as a by-product.
It doesn't matter if it would - because it would be a lot harder to do. You'd probably have to rewrite the whole engine. And you'd have to find somebody with experience in programming the Amiga's custom chips first.

An OS4/AROS/MOS version on the other hand is mostly a recompile (provided the required libs are ported already, e.g. the game's based on something like SDL). It's simply not all that much effort.

Yes, it's way too expensive, and they're probably including NG Amiga systems mostly because their users are known to be vocal and willing to spend money on pretty much anything as long as it's supporting their system of choice. But bitching about the lack of a 68k version just doesn't make any sense.

And the game in question looks extremely boring anyway.
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Old 23 February 2013, 03:02   #50
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I'm just reminded why I shouldn't post in forums. Thanks TCD for the bucket of cold water
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Old 23 February 2013, 03:12   #51
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Hmmm, it could be good, but the Dreamcast games I bought that were made recently (over the past 5 years) have mostly been side-scrolling shooters, easy to pick up and play. The other one was Cool Herders which plays similar to Bomberman, but you are trying to herd up sheep as you go through the level.

The other problem I have is the price. The Dreamcast games mentioned above were between £15 and £30. Paying £60 for a game (which could be potentially very annoying and frustrating) is far too much - I wouldn't pay that for any recent game on *any* format. The last time I paid £60+ for a game was when I bought Turok 2 (plus memory expanion pak) for the Nintendo 64 about 15 years ago.

As for Amiga versions... does anyone actually want to pay for new Amiga games when loads of PD stuff is uploaded to Aminet each month?
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Old 23 February 2013, 05:18   #52
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I got a bit carried away and I do apologize. Sometimes a lack of tone and/or infliction can lead to misinterpretation, which can lead to arguments that never needed to occur.

Disregarding, or trying to reshape context (as has occurred here) can also end up with people arguing over things that are different to what someone has said. A "back and forth" or two later, and the end result is something akin to arguing via Chinese whispers.

Regardless of what people believe this whole thing has been interesting, and kinda demonstrates that maybe its not worth investing the time and effort required trying to produce something of commercial quality for 68k amiga. People are pretty quick to dismiss something based on its current state to a point that its not surprising all we have new is a bunch of pd quality new titles.

Yeah, I think its great that someone is trying to provide new games for amiga-oid systems. While I personally wont buy it (too pricey for my blood) I hope they succeed. If they do then there's potential for them to make something else, and as they say, "practice makes perfect", so successive games might be more to my tastes (and that of my wallet). I'll pitch in a few dollars though, just for the encouragement. Their experiences (and not just in producing the game itself, there's more to it than that) could also prove useful to others who are contemplating having a go.

Last edited by fishyfish; 23 February 2013 at 05:25.
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Old 01 March 2013, 23:02   #53
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Originally Posted by dlfrsilver View Post
if the game runs on amiga 1200 with turbo cards and is great for 60 pounds, i'll be in

your be the only 1 at that price lol.
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Old 01 March 2013, 23:06   #54
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They cut the price to £15 for an Amiga download.
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Old 01 March 2013, 23:13   #55
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Originally Posted by DDNI View Post
They cut the price to £15 for an Amiga download.
Perfect, it is more reasonable

Damn, that is download! :-(

Last edited by vitux; 01 March 2013 at 23:38.
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Old 01 March 2013, 23:23   #56
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Originally Posted by imigger View Post
your be the only 1 at that price lol.
If the game is well polished, and well coded, playability good, since it won't make 5000 copies sold, i understand the 60 bucks.

I add: the kickstarter principle is easy : making the biggest money rise for a project. Considering how much amiga guys with Morphos or even amiga OS 4.1 there is VS classic miggy users with 680X0 machines, what's the point ? they will never do the game on amiga for 10 or 15 guys at much.

Last edited by dlfrsilver; 01 March 2013 at 23:30.
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Old 16 March 2013, 15:02   #57
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Looks like another Kickstarter fail. Hardly suprising. The project presentation and the shown game quality doesn't even attract Dreamcast fans.
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Old 16 March 2013, 19:58   #58
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It looks to me a very generic game that could be good or bad and that would not be the point still.

It looks more like an attempt to push some generic content towards a specific market niche to exploit the rarity of a game developed for Amiga on kickstarter as a way to reach the funding.

Which is even not a problem per se, but does it do good to the Amiga community necessarily? Does it incite other devs to do stuff for amiga again? I fail to see the link.
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Old 16 March 2013, 20:05   #59
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They should've gone for the retro look with the promotional art and the logo the way they did with the game itself but I doubt anything related to art direction here was intentional to begin with. Generic is indeed the word.
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Old 16 March 2013, 22:43   #60
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A decent enough 68000 Amiga game by download should do well. Yes, no doubt it will be pirated to death, but, there are enough people around at the moment that like supporting good Amiga software.

You only have to look at the success of WHDLoad to know that.

A decent 68000 Amiga game would work, the only problem is that games of the Amigas past have set the bar exceptionally high, which is probably why people are reluctant to make the effort lest they be constantly compared to the Amigas past glories.
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