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Old 07 January 2015, 12:26   #361
Toni Galvez
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This is analyzing your palette, look how close some colors are, you are wasting at least 3-4 colors here, and you have only one green
As I told before, I am sure I can do better, but not color waste in this palette, as you see in my graphics, the colors works very well. The dark color for the green is there, works, but not exactly dark green.

Show your proposal color conversion for the entire ingame graphics in 16 colors.

Of course, every person has his own taste, maybe you preffer somethin different color scheme.

Last edited by Toni Galvez; 07 January 2015 at 12:34.
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Old 07 January 2015, 13:22   #362
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Okay. In this archive are FFECS1 and FFECS1_NM.
NM is the one without music.
You will still need 2mb chip. Use NM if you have that but no fast mem.

I've reduced the number of goons to 4 which is what we had for the Snes and MD/Genesis.
This is the same as the AGA version from a few months back collisions are off for re-structuring of this and that including AI. It's a little buggy, but will hopefully run.
No parallax background because no sprites used! And I was too lazy top put a copper background in for now, sorry. Also no sprites = no moving train, expect some weird effects...

ESC quits, game will crash if you try to advance too far in the subway stage you can cheat the scroll lock here at the end of the stage by jumping so be warned. You will be jumping into an area where there is no data for the gfx.

NM version is in the zip file only - so you must copy it over if you need after unpacking lha archive.

http://lostinthefens.com/uploads/FFECS.zip

http://lostinthefens.com/uploads/FFECS1.lha
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Old 07 January 2015, 13:39   #363
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Thank you.

Now I see why the game needs so much memory, because you use the entire frames in the sprites when they make a kick or puch, this is not the correct way to do it. You need to cut the legs and the arms when the characters attack and put them on other location in the sprite sheet, because you will save so much blank space in the sheet and the drawing speed will be faster. This is so much important for the game.
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Old 07 January 2015, 14:12   #364
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I would go with this 16 color palette for Capcom games (or better Final Fight only as i checked only that graphics)



And the result would be
http://postimg.org/image/8zdbv9nvz/full/

Can be improved more but its useless as none will use them :P

Last edited by nobody; 07 January 2015 at 14:18.
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Old 07 January 2015, 14:32   #365
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Good try, but hey are so dark and washed for my taste.
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Old 07 January 2015, 14:46   #366
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Good try, but hey are so dark and washed for my taste.
Dark? Certainly not, this is how it should look with some copper effect

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Old 07 January 2015, 16:13   #367
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Click image for larger version

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I said for my taste, I preffer this ones I made it, they have a large of variety of colors.

16 colors are so limited, then, when you change one colors for others, alwais there will be some parts that loose quality.

Do you see the dark green in the cars?

Let's see what people prefer.

Last edited by Toni Galvez; 07 January 2015 at 17:06.
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Old 07 January 2015, 17:08   #368
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At some point many moons ago I had to make a decision. Blitz imposes a limit on the amount of frames you can have in memory at one time, with a maximum of 1024 frames.

That may sound like a lot, but you basically have an object designation vs memory limit compromise to make. Generally speaking (and I'm not saying I go about things the best way) I've put this together using the maximum of resources available to me and made changes along the way to make it all fit in other words, I'm all for doing it the easy way (you may call that lazy if you will) but necessity is the mother of invention. In other words the games uses 2mb of memory because that is what I have available =).

For my 2mb machine I've not had to split the torso and legs into 2, when I looked at doing so for the player characters there was little benefit to be had (the legs are all different for the player punching frames, by the way I appreciate this is not so for all the goon types).

Even so, I'm utilising and shuffling every available frame designation constantly within the memory limitations. So we split the frames in 2 and suddenly there won't be enough frames for many different goons in memory at once. It may be a concession that's needed further down the line for whatever reason, but for the current development it isn't, and I stand by that.

Many wish to see an ECS version complete but as I've said I'm focusing on getting the code done on an AGA machine first, and adapting later. I'm not averse to receiving work intended for ECS but really, it is never going to work without the kind of consideration that's gone into the AGA version, which you're going to have a hard time realising if all you're trying to do is 'your own way'.

If you want to help really the best way to do that is by helping the current development for one thing you'll learn about what's really going on and how the development is being approached and be in a better position to tackle all this 16 colour business. This isn't a new project either, it's been ongoing for over 2 years that means for the most part that you need to try and adapt to it, rather than the other way around.

It means helping to convert something to a 5 bitplane graphic and then to 4 utilising everything we have available. As opposed to trying to do the whole thing in 16 colours without the copper.
Yes it looks okay but I can hear the Amiga massive complaining already...

Otherwise the only way this is going to work, is for the current stage sets to be adapted (meaning those that have already been converted). I can provide the gfx. The character palette will need to be considered first, then each stage in turn beginning with stage 1_1. The tiles have also been optimised for these stages. I'd rather be slotting everything in as such than doing all the mapping from scratch.

It seems the best thing to do then would be to cleverly tile the parallax background to be a part of the foreground and optimise. We can put copper colours behind that and it should look pretty good. But I'd like to have the tile sets without the parallax adjoining also just in case...

To be brutally honest, all this recolouring of everything with a converter is all very well and good, and some of the results are very promising but not the best way to fit the requirements of the engine per se, and therefore not entirely helpful. But please, enjoy fighting amongst yourselves if you will.

I could assign you to doing a stage each with the well established current palette, show how we are approaching the mapping and we can see how you do with 16 colours after that =)
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Old 07 January 2015, 17:16   #369
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For the characters, I was meaning only split in the atacks, not when they walk of run.

Ok, tell me what level you want and I will convert to the number of colors you need.

Sorry for the offtopic witn 16 colors OCS/ECS version.
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Old 07 January 2015, 18:27   #370
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Sorry for the offtopic witn 16 colors OCS/ECS version.
Not at all, the thread was already there so to speak when you walked in.
I'll get around to putting something together for upload to the thread.
And really I hate to place demands on willing artists, but it's a must if I am going to cope and not waste anyone's time.

This goes for anyone - if you think you can contribute then let me know what you want to do. You can just dip in and out so to speak - I can't ask for commitment. I'm knee deep in this - but you're free to come and go.
Work on what I need first, and you can put your own stamp on it along the way. The best way to do it is to make sure anyone helping is working on something different.
We won't make anything on this except maybe friends, and that's gold
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Old 07 January 2015, 19:05   #371
Toni Galvez
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Not at all, the thread was already there so to speak when you walked in.
I'll get around to putting something together for upload to the thread.
And really I hate to place demands on willing artists, but it's a must if I am going to cope and not waste anyone's time.

This goes for anyone - if you think you can contribute then let me know what you want to do. You can just dip in and out so to speak - I can't ask for commitment. I'm knee deep in this - but you're free to come and go.
Work on what I need first, and you can put your own stamp on it along the way. The best way to do it is to make sure anyone helping is working on something different.
We won't make anything on this except maybe friends, and that's gold
Ok, I understand my friend, you can count on me for some backgrounds.
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Old 07 January 2015, 19:50   #372
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Toni, what the hell is Haggar doing in your last 2 screenshots? It looks like he's dancing or something

I prefer Nobody's pallete, though it's hard to be sure without looking at some enemies too. But Toni's work is pretty good too.

Edit: And I could do it with Nobody's pallete an no copper effect at all, just plain blue at the sky. It would be no problem IMO if using the copper there would lead to any problems. Dunno if using that copper effect is any easy with Blitz Basic.
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Old 07 January 2015, 20:04   #373
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Haggar is beggining his special attack.

@Nobody, no ofense was intended, I am here to help

Is wonderfull that we finally will have a good Final Fight port.
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Old 07 January 2015, 20:20   #374
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No problem. Colors you choose are too ST-like for me, I prefer softer colors not so saturated. It's a matter of taste. About doing graphics I read in other page that Steve_T is making them or not.
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Old 07 January 2015, 20:22   #375
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Just shows what a job Richard had
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Old 07 January 2015, 20:53   #376
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No problem. Colors you choose are too ST-like for me, I prefer softer colors not so saturated. It's a matter of taste. About doing graphics I read in other page that Steve_T is making them or not.
I just got myself into making the bonus round, regretted it ever since, and worked with Paul on a little rework of the character palette... That shouldn't stop anyone else contributing as I haven't committed to working on anything else for FFAGA.

I'm sure there's plenty to do, any potential contributors should coordinate with Paul before diving in, to make sure it fits with the project goals, platform restrictions, that you aren't duplicating something etc.
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Old 07 January 2015, 23:12   #377
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http://lostinthefens.com/uploads/FFAGA%20GFX.zip

There's a read me file here to explain what's in the directories, what needs to be done regarding AGA and some ideas if you just have to take the ECS route already. Hopefully it will be enough to help you figure it all out - I can appreciate the copper is an awkward business but there is some guide within the read me and rough examples.
Communicate what your doing so that you're not working on the same thing - the best of luck to you, and thank you.
Turri, if you don't want someone to help with the re-colouring of 4_1 say so - but I thought it would help you get on with the mapping. =)

@ Shatterhand. Copper colour is no problem in Blitz - sprites as yet is another matter. Any news on that 4 goon ECS speed?
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Old 07 January 2015, 23:57   #378
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I would love to see this game as full aga version not only in title.
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Old 08 January 2015, 00:58   #379
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I've just played the ECS version of it.

It's friggin awesome. Its eons better than the oficial port, when this gets completed, it will be the best game of its genre on Amiga.

The music is fantastic on level 1 (On level 2 it had some weird cracks on it), the sound effects are perfect...

Goddamn it, I've been thinking about learning Blitz Basic 2 so I could code for Amiga.. if that's the kind of stuff its possible to do with it, I am *very* into learning it now. This is amazing work mate. I can see the slowdowns, it would be better if the game was a little faster , but I am not complaining. A game like this working 100% back at the time would get rave reviews.

EDIT: Please, consider finishing this ECS 7mhz version at some point. I understand you wanting to focus on the AGA version, but I do know a few people who has no AGA machine (myself included, hehe). This would be a killer-app on an A600

Last edited by Shatterhand; 08 January 2015 at 01:16.
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Old 08 January 2015, 11:54   #380
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I see that you have a palette already so all you need to do is just recolor/remap the graphics, maybe some touches here and there too and that's all about it.
It's very easy to do with a couple of programs on Windows and then with Personal Paint on the Amiga.
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