English Amiga Board


Go Back   English Amiga Board > Main > Amiga scene

 
 
Thread Tools
Old 04 April 2011, 00:28   #21
gilgamesh
Linux snob

gilgamesh's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Monkey Island
Posts: 997
If CUSA charges you just the usual price for such generic underpowered hardware, then it's fine with me. (Although slapping Commodore or Amiga stickers on it is a little bit like slapping Ferrari stickers on a Fiat Panda. Panda isn't a bad car for its price, but...
gilgamesh is offline  
AdSense AdSense  
Old 04 April 2011, 00:39   #22
frank_b
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Boston USA
Posts: 332
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr B View Post
Selecting the hardware that goes into the box you put your sticker on, and taking in to account the time those who designed that hardware spent on the design, and the research spent on developing the bits the hardware is built on, i'd say the new flavor has a lot more time under it's belt then the original C64. Claiming time spent on engineering to be a factor in all of this, is just not a working argument. Commodore didn't exactly spent the time developing every bit of the C64, they took what they could off the shelves, and slapped something together with the least effort they could.

The above is not a statement saying that i think this is a good product, i have no idea. I'm not getting one, thats for sure. I'm just commenting on what i see as a flawed argument.
B!
What? Custom video chip, custom ROM and SID(!) You think selecting a PC mobo, applying a Commodore badge and sticking it in a custom case is equivalent to the engineering that made the C64 and its ancestors? Seriously? Custom ICs 30 years ago vs a molded case? Even the embedded software on the C64 would have cost serious in house time, effort and money. I bet the hardware and software engineering team at Commodore weren't cheap.

Frank

Last edited by frank_b; 04 April 2011 at 00:58.
frank_b is offline  
Old 04 April 2011, 02:33   #23
prolife
 
Posts: n/a
in short who are cusa and why the animosity?
 
Old 04 April 2011, 02:45   #24
Paul_s
needs more ice cream

Paul_s's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Amigaville
Age: 39
Posts: 3,162
Quote:
Originally Posted by prolife View Post
in short who are cusa and why the animosity?
CUSA profile;

Managing Director - Barry Altman
Age - late 40's/50's

Profile -

1) A know villan in the Commodore/Amiga community.
2) Likes to stick Commodore/Amiga logos on cheap tat from China.
3) Builds furniture as another business.
4) Thinks being a partner with Disney will mean he can go up against the MCP.
5) Employs Umpa-Lumpas to build his new line of Commodore Amigas and fake Wonka bars.

--report ends, stack overflow error.
Paul_s is offline  
Old 04 April 2011, 02:52   #25
prolife
 
Posts: n/a
oh, i think i heard that name a few years ago... how the hell then is he involved with disney?
 
Old 04 April 2011, 05:26   #26
ChrisUnionNJ
Amibay Mod/Staff

ChrisUnionNJ's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Union NJ
Age: 55
Posts: 191
I am just tired of all the smoke and mirrors they have had more then enough
time to start selling a product and all the info about commodore like there
the real deal in the end it's put up or shut up..
Also in the end of all this The only real product they will be making is the retro 64 case everything else is
just re brand trash..

Chris

Last edited by ChrisUnionNJ; 04 April 2011 at 05:31. Reason: added more
ChrisUnionNJ is offline  
Old 04 April 2011, 11:26   #27
gilgamesh
Linux snob

gilgamesh's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Monkey Island
Posts: 997
CUSA has a (not exactly secret) agenda to take over the high tech business world with super advanced Amigas. First step will be total subjugation of Apple. Barry has a habit of trolling the Aros community and sending copy pasted cease and desists to the press.

I still wish CUSA best of luck, because they are funny where others are just sad.
gilgamesh is offline  
Old 04 April 2011, 12:01   #28
Mr B
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Sweden
Posts: 740
Quote:
Originally Posted by frank_b View Post
What? Custom video chip, custom ROM and SID(!) You think selecting a PC mobo, applying a Commodore badge and sticking it in a custom case is equivalent to the engineering that made the C64 and its ancestors? Seriously? Custom ICs 30 years ago vs a molded case? Even the embedded software on the C64 would have cost serious in house time, effort and money. I bet the hardware and software engineering team at Commodore weren't cheap.
I think you read my text, and just didn't understand it.
Was the SID a standalone, from the ground up, new product? No, it was one of the (at the time) latest SID's, developed to follow some specs. Was it more advanced, or more expensive to develop then any of the "Intel High Definition Audio" chips popular in todays computers?

Todays computer / electronics industrial development has come far enough that it has little to do with chip development, and all to do with going through specs defining what you need and putting it together. Your still paying for development, but your paying less, since you share this development cost with others.
Funny how that works... The SID, was used for a few different things then the C64. Just like everyone else, MOS technology was trying to bring home some profit to make up for the development costs.
Buying inhouse, or buying from a external developer, it's the same thing, your still just buying a product that fits your specs.

As far as i can tell, the motherboard stuck inside the "new and improved C64" isn't a generic PC motherboard, but something that has been targeted at this system from the start. Mainly due to space constraints. But, admittedly, i haven't seen one, so i ain't going to swear on that.

This whole thing with "everything isn't created on commodores own plant" is just silly, it never was that way, and today, nobody works that way, not even Intel. The largest competitor Intel has, doesn't even make there own CPU's. They have someone else make them for them. Times have changed, and the way you build electronics have changed with them. There isn't necessary better or worse, as both methods obviously works. One thing is for sure tho. The way it's done today is cheaper for the end costumer, and hence we actually see new "C64" machines on the market, as compared to the old days, when that just wouldn't have happened.

I'm still not buying one, but i'm more tempted then ever by these 'conversations'.
B!
Mr B is offline  
Old 04 April 2011, 12:50   #29
Hewitson
Registered User
Hewitson's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Melbourne, Australia
Age: 35
Posts: 2,235
Wtf..

The SID was a brand new product, designed from the ground up by Bob Yannes exclusively for the Commodore 64. It being used in any other products is news to me, please name some.
Hewitson is offline  
Old 04 April 2011, 12:52   #30
gilgamesh
Linux snob

gilgamesh's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Monkey Island
Posts: 997
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr B View Post
As far as i can tell, the motherboard stuck inside the "new and improved C64" isn't a generic PC motherboard, but something that has been targeted at this system from the start. Mainly due to space constraints. But, admittedly, i haven't seen one, so i ain't going to swear on that.
Sounds a bit far fetched to me. It probably is one of those small form factor boards.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr B View Post
I'm still not buying one, but i'm more tempted then ever by these 'conversations'.
gilgamesh is offline  
Old 04 April 2011, 15:35   #31
Brenry
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: nowhere / no.
Posts: 10
Relying on emulation is such a joke. The whole "Home Theatre Media PC" community has gone on for years about how movies use that precise 23.978 fps. That screen judder for even the untrained eye can clearly see frame skips from 48fps on a 60hz ntsc display.

And they are trying to bank on NTSC land with this when c64 and Amiga is the WORST to try and get smooth scrolling text since pretty much everything out there is 50 FPS PAL, and forcing a 50hz display causes really bad flicker on many ntsc displays.

They are in one heck of a bumpy road when it comes to calls flooding in asking how they can load their pre-existing disk collection in. They say buy em again on the app store? What about old stuff like geneology, art files, letters, etc.

It's gonna be a train wreck.
Brenry is offline  
Old 04 April 2011, 16:40   #32
khph_re
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Northampton/UK
Posts: 245
Have to wait and see if he actually gets permission for these game packs. He certainly put peoples artwork and trademarks on his site without permission.

Iv'e mentioned it on 'the chaos engine' website, a private members forum for pro video games industry developers only. There's a lot of C64 vets on there, some now high up the corporate ladder or with their own companies. He'll have to play this fair unless he wants a lot of litigation.
khph_re is offline  
Old 04 April 2011, 18:22   #33
frank_b
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Boston USA
Posts: 332
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hewitson View Post
Wtf..

The SID was a brand new product, designed from the ground up by Bob Yannes exclusively for the Commodore 64. It being used in any other products is news to me, please name some.
That was kind of my point. I understand that nowadays there is more integration of third party chips (I worked on an LTE chip project this year but comparing selecting PC components with the the development of SID is insane IMHO. I'm saying this as an embedded software engineer.

If he wants to buy one more power to him but this is a standard mini ITX board I'd bet. Choosing what graphics card to plug into your PC doesn't make someone a hardware engineer! The comments he made about SID are funny.
I hope the astroturfing hasn't started? This is sad rebadging crap. It's not worthy of the Commodore name.

Frank
frank_b is offline  
Old 04 April 2011, 18:30   #34
Heavy Stylus
CD32 Fanboi
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Exeter, UK
Age: 39
Posts: 523
The thing I don't get is this; if CUSA are a real, professional hardware company, then why does their website look like something an undergraduate threw together in a drunken afternoon, and why are the 'gallery' images all mockups?

I wager that nothing will come from this - there just isn't the market at the moment for overpriced, underpowered novelty hardware - and as stated above already, I reckon about 90% of the C= enthusiasts out there will be totally offended by this bogus use of the Commodore brand name.
Heavy Stylus is offline  
Old 04 April 2011, 18:49   #35
TCD
Registered User

TCD's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Germany
Age: 39
Posts: 24,032
Keep 'em coming guys, maybe you can get Mr B to buy one of those new C64s
TCD is offline  
Old 04 April 2011, 20:25   #36
gilgamesh
Linux snob

gilgamesh's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Monkey Island
Posts: 997
There are pictures of the mobo.
http://www.commodoreusa.net/CUSA_C64Prototype.aspx
gilgamesh is offline  
Old 04 April 2011, 20:49   #37
frank_b
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Boston USA
Posts: 332
Quote:
Originally Posted by gilgamesh View Post
I've seen more professional looking mods on miniitx.com
That's bloody hideous!

Frank
frank_b is offline  
Old 05 April 2011, 01:30   #38
Mr B
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Sweden
Posts: 740
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hewitson View Post
The SID was a brand new product, designed from the ground up by Bob Yannes exclusively for the Commodore 64.
Not that i can find the source now, ofcourse, that had been to easy*sigh* so i'll have to say i might be wrong, but i'm fairly sure i read that it was a deriviate design from a previous chip-design. Nothing wrong with that, thats the way everyone does it. Take the good bits, replace them with something new, and try to get a better end result.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hewitson View Post
It being used in any other products is news to me, please name some.
Elektron's SidStation?

Actually, left over stockpiles of the SID chips were used for a LOT of things, heck, even Jens made a box that use the chip for it's soundqualities, if my memory isn't all wired wrong. (you have to find/install the SID yourself tho. No stock)
B!
Mr B is offline  
Old 05 April 2011, 01:45   #39
Retro-Nerd
Missile Command Champion

Retro-Nerd's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Germany
Age: 45
Posts: 10,745
Quote:
but i'm fairly sure i read that it was a deriviate design from a previous chip-design. Nothing wrong with that, thats the way everyone does it. Take the good bits, replace them with something new, and try to get a better end result.
Any reliable sources? I don't think so.
Retro-Nerd is offline  
Old 05 April 2011, 01:47   #40
Mr B
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Sweden
Posts: 740
Quote:
Originally Posted by Retro-Nerd View Post
Any sources? I don't think so.
Funny, you cant read? I just said i couldn't find any right now, but that i was fairly certain i read them earlier today. I would actually bother to try and find them again tomorrow, seeing as it's well past midnight here, and i'm not quite at my A-game, but seeing as you cant read, whats the point?
B!
Mr B is offline  
AdSense AdSense  
 


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Morton Strikes Back AGA AlexJ request.Old Rare Games 107 07 July 2015 21:48
The (one and only) CUSA thread Retrofan Amiga websites reviews 613 06 December 2013 21:22
Morton Strikes Back Kitty Games images which need to be WHDified 28 22 March 2013 23:51
Chaos Strikes Back wrong! Macca project.TOSEC (amiga only) 5 12 August 2010 20:25
Chaos Strikes Back cheat Macca support.Games 11 15 June 2007 00:34

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT +2. The time now is 09:25.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Page generated in 0.31186 seconds with 12 queries