English Amiga Board


Go Back   English Amiga Board > News

 
 
Thread Tools
Old 24 October 2010, 14:58   #221
MarkONE
Registered User
MarkONE's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Manchester, UK
Posts: 44
Send a message via ICQ to MarkONE
Maybe it is time to ask? Should I write a email? Or is he active in the board as well? I mean it should not cost anything to ask, and we can see if he would be interested to build some when we get enough preorder's in place?
MarkONE is offline  
AdSense AdSense  
Old 24 October 2010, 21:40   #222
Predseda
Puttymoon inhabitant
Predseda's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: The City of Townsville
Age: 39
Posts: 4,517
Quote:
Maybe we should do a count? I have two, one plane and one with SX32 Pro

Summarising of CD32 units: I set a new topic. Go here: http://eab.abime.net/showthread.php?t=55974
Predseda is offline  
Old 25 October 2010, 12:07   #223
phipscube
WipEout Fanboi
phipscube's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Hiller°d / Denmark
Age: 42
Posts: 262
Quote:
Originally Posted by MarkONE View Post
I wished there would be something available for the CD32 ... But saying that, I assume there are hardly any users left ;(
Well I don't currently own a CD32 but its on my list to get when i'm back home in January.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cammy View Post
I'd spend money on a CD32 accelerator before I spend it on one for the A600 or A1200. I have all these Amigas but the one I'd love to boost the speed of the most is definitely the CD32!
I agree exactly! My A1200 is maxxed out already, and my sons A600 is fine at stock level for his use, but I had ideas on buying a second A1200 and putting an 030 in it just for WHDLoad games... but then I thought, hang on, a CD32 with a 030 would be perfect for that job actually being a games machine that can natively play all the CD32 games too. installed with something like the upcoming X-Bench WHDload OS it would be awesome!
phipscube is offline  
Old 27 October 2010, 21:03   #224
Oliver_A
Soldering Ironman
Oliver_A's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Germany, NRW
Posts: 79
Work in progress

ADoom Shareware in 1024x768 256 colours on Indivision ECS and the upcoming ACA630.



I'm currently adding Indivision GFX support to ADoom and I thought you might be interested in comparing some performance figures. First, ADoom using etra halfbrite chunky 2 planar routine in 320x200, 64 colours:



One frame takes 71731 us to render. Now compare this to the Indivision GFX direct chunky graphics mode in 320x200, 256 colours:



Wow, rendering time is only 24000 us per frame, almost three times faster than using the ECS chipset! Reason for this is the maximum chip ram write speed of the ACA630 (3.5MB/s) to the SDRAM chunky framebuffer of the Indivision ECS flickerfixer. It's as close as one can get having an Amiga 3000 with a Zorro II graphics card in the tiny Amiga 600 case.

Result:
Adoom is very playable in 1x1 graphics mode in 320x200 in 256 colours on Indivision ECS and ACA630.

More details will follow soon.
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	bild1.jpg
Views:	3172
Size:	179.7 KB
ID:	26825   Click image for larger version

Name:	bild2.jpg
Views:	3017
Size:	138.9 KB
ID:	26826   Click image for larger version

Name:	bild3.jpg
Views:	2985
Size:	134.6 KB
ID:	26827  

Last edited by Oliver_A; 27 October 2010 at 21:37.
Oliver_A is offline  
Old 27 October 2010, 21:37   #225
FOL
PSPUAE DEV

FOL's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Barry / UK
Age: 39
Posts: 5,591
Send a message via MSN to FOL Send a message via Skype™ to FOL
Quote:
Originally Posted by Oliver_A View Post
Work in progress

Adoom Shareware in 1024x768 256 colours on Indivision ECS and the upcoming ACA630.



I'm currently adding Indivision GFX support to ADoom and I though you might be interested in comparing some performance figures. First, ADoom using etra halfbrite chunky 2 planar routine in 320x200, 64 colours:



One frame takes 71731 us to render. Now compare this to the Indivision GFX mode in 320x200, 256 colours:



Wow, rendering time is only 24000 us per frame, almost three times faster than using the ECS chipset! Reason for this is the maximum chip ram write speed of the ACA630 (3.5MB/s) to the SDRAM chunky framebuffer of the Indivision ECS flickerfixer. It's as close as one can get having an Amiga 3000 with a Zorro II graphics card in the tiny Amiga 600 case.

Result:
Adoom is very playable in 1x1 graphics mode in 320x200 in 256 colours on Indivision ECS and ACA630.

More details will follow soon.
Thats awesome, .
FOL is offline  
Old 27 October 2010, 21:55   #226
gulliver
BoingBagged

 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: The South of nowhere
Age: 39
Posts: 1,498
@Oliver_A
Wow!
Could you please upload a youtube video of those setups running Adoom?
gulliver is offline  
Old 27 October 2010, 22:24   #227
cv643d
Registered User
cv643d's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Stockholm/Sweden
Age: 39
Posts: 726
Oliver: is it possible to add 256 color mode to WB also?

Great work, nice pictures. Refreshing to see products and product maker keeping community up to date. Danke sch÷n...
cv643d is offline  
Old 28 October 2010, 00:12   #228
imstarryeyed
 
Posts: n/a
Just pinging in that I would be in for 2 CD32 accellerator boards if there were any. I do however plan to buy one of the A1200 and A600 boards.. I do plan to buy those systems in the not too distant future..
 
Old 28 October 2010, 00:16   #229
Paul_s
needs more ice cream

Paul_s's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Amigaville
Age: 39
Posts: 3,162
Jens has done great work here. It's comparable to Jesus turning water to wine!
Paul_s is offline  
Old 28 October 2010, 00:42   #230
Ratte
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Germany
Posts: 314
@Oliver_A:
Using display and blitter-dma at the same time?
Is this newstyle (framebuffer-mode) or graffiti-style generated (with higher resolutions)?
Ratte is offline  
Old 28 October 2010, 00:56   #231
FOL
PSPUAE DEV

FOL's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Barry / UK
Age: 39
Posts: 5,591
Send a message via MSN to FOL Send a message via Skype™ to FOL
Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul_s View Post
Jens has done great work here. It's comparable to Jesus turning water to wine!
LMFAO, your comments always make me laugh,
FOL is offline  
Old 28 October 2010, 01:31   #232
NovaCoder
Registered User
NovaCoder's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Melbourne/Australia
Posts: 3,444
Quote:
Originally Posted by Oliver_A View Post
Work in progress

ADoom Shareware in 1024x768 256 colours on Indivision ECS and the upcoming ACA630.



I'm currently adding Indivision GFX support to ADoom and I thought you might be interested in comparing some performance figures. First, ADoom using etra halfbrite chunky 2 planar routine in 320x200, 64 colours:



One frame takes 71731 us to render. Now compare this to the Indivision GFX direct chunky graphics mode in 320x200, 256 colours:

Hiya Oliver,

This is very interesting. Can you tell us more about this. Is this going to be a new native chunky screen mode? If so are you going to patch the OS API's to use it (eg writeChunkyPixels)? In otherwords how to you use it in a game?

Thanks,
Nova
NovaCoder is offline  
Old 28 October 2010, 13:00   #233
Oliver_A
Soldering Ironman
Oliver_A's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Germany, NRW
Posts: 79
Hi guys!

Thanks for your enthusiastic response! Some valid questions have been brought up here, which I am going to respond to.

How does this mode work? And where is the difference between this and the Grafitti mode?

As some people correctly pointed out, 320x200 in 256 colours is also possible in Grafitti mode. However, there is one very important difference. In order to display a 256 colour picture under Grafitti, one has to open a hires screen in 16 colours. Those, who know a bit how the Amiga chipset works, immediately realize that under OCS/ECS, any 16 colour hires screen causes Agnus to reserve all available memory slots for display DMA. That means, the CPU can only access the Chip Ram during the horizontal and vertical blanking interval, which effectively reduces memory bandwidth from 3.5 MB/s to under >1MB/s. If you have ever wondered why Deluxe Paint was always unbearable slow in hires 16 colours on an A500 without fast ram, this is the answer. The result is that Grafitti mode is not really useful for games on OCS/ECS machines, especially on 68030+ CPUs, where a chunky/planar routine is faster.

The new Indivision GFX mode (which btw. was introduced with V1.0 firmware) works completely different. Here, the Amiga video is completely disabled (as you can see in the first picture). Instead, the CPU writes directly to the 8MB SDRAM chunky framebuffer of the Indivision ECS flickerfixer. Since the Amiga display DMA is completely turned off, we get a 256 colour chunky screen with full 3.5MB/s access to it, exactly like a Zorro II graphics card.

Of course, this method has certain restrictions since the 8MB SDRAM is not memory mapped. Instead, you can only access it by setting up a write address and writing the data directly to a register, while the FPGA autoincrements the video address.

That means, in any case, where a game or application renders its display in fast ram, and then copies the result into the graphics memory of the graphics card, Indivision ECS is an equivalent replacement to a Zorro II graphics card. Whether I do a move.l (ax)+,(ay)+ or a move.l (ax)+,(ay) is completely irrelevant since it's the same speed. So, 3D games with software rendering can have the same speed on Indivision ECS than on a graphics card. Which is especially important on small Amigas without slots, like the A600. The upcoming ACA630 has a very fast interface to fast ram and chip ram.

Is there any API available? Is it possible to add native RTG support?


Currently, there is no API available. Since the framebuffer is not directly mapped into the Amiga memory map, a context-independent implementation is quite challenging. Any RTG driver would first have to render all pixel operations to fast ram, and then copy it into the SDRAM framebuffer. The only way I can imagine how this could be fast enough would be to copy only the display areas, where something has changed. One could imagine a graphics driver using the MMU to split the memory into segments. This is how some Shapeshifter video drivers work. Realistically, this would be a quite ambitious project, far exceeding the amount of work implementing support for Indivision ECS in various games. We'll see about that. At least, I already implemented a hardware sprite for a mouse pointer in the Indivision GFX core.

Last edited by Oliver_A; 28 October 2010 at 13:13.
Oliver_A is offline  
Old 28 October 2010, 13:23   #234
chiark
Needs a life

chiark's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: England
Posts: 1,621
Wow. Excellent work! That is quite astonishing

The RTG driver would have to effectively blit the changes across to the framebuffer... However, your buffer isn't memory mapped so you'd have to render the whole frame unless you add appropriate calls to get to the right framebuffer location?
chiark is online now  
Old 28 October 2010, 13:24   #235
fitzsteve
Professional slacker!
fitzsteve's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Kent, UK
Age: 38
Posts: 6,342
Send a message via MSN to fitzsteve
@chiark

There's a buy back option on your Apollo 620 when these are released
fitzsteve is offline  
Old 29 October 2010, 03:34   #236
Akira
Registered User

Akira's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2001
Location: New York
Posts: 18,304
IN-fucking-credible.
I am totally down for the A600 accel!
Akira is offline  
Old 29 October 2010, 07:45   #237
Cosmos
Banned
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: France
Posts: 655
>The new Indivision GFX mode (which btw. was introduced with V1.0 firmware) works completely different. Here, the Amiga video is completely disabled (as you can see in the first picture). Instead, the CPU writes directly
>to the 8MB SDRAM chunky framebuffer of the Indivision ECS flickerfixer. Since the Amiga display DMA is completely turned off, we get a 256 colour chunky screen with full 3.5MB/s access to it, exactly like a Zorro II graphics card

Will works with the Indivision AGA ??
Cosmos is offline  
Old 29 October 2010, 09:50   #238
Cosmos
Banned
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: France
Posts: 655
And for the new Indivision AGA, please add an Akiko replica !

Thanks a lot !
Cosmos is offline  
Old 30 October 2010, 12:10   #239
Schoenfeld
electricky.
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: out in the wild
Posts: 1,243
Cosmos,

this thread is about the accelerators, not Indivision.

Unfortunately, Indivision ECS is substantially different from any other flickerfixer, even Indivision AGA. While Indivision AGA takes it's input from the Lisa output, Indivision ECS takes it's input directly from the chip bus, bypassing the Denise. This gives us the unique opportunity to also talk to the flickerfixer's infrastructure directly with the CPU. This data path does not exist on the AGA models, so neither C2P, nor direct Framebuffer access can be done. All gfx data has to take the re-route through chipmem. However, the new FPGA of Indivision AGA MK2 is most probably large enough for Graffiti emulation, so a chunky screen with 256 colours maintaining 7MB/s access speed to chipmem is more than possible.

Jens
Schoenfeld is offline  
Old 01 November 2010, 22:19   #240
solaris104
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Czechia
Posts: 63
Schoenfeld: Do you plan highend turbo boards with MC68060FE133?
solaris104 is offline  
AdSense AdSense  
 


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Santa's come early... A new scandoubler from Individual Computers NovaCoder News 708 18 October 2016 23:43
Details for the next generation of Flickerfixers from Individual Computers MarkONE News 2438 01 February 2016 13:04
A600 board versions and accelerator cards LePiaf support.Hardware 9 03 September 2012 13:49
Individual Computers Silver Sponsor of the Revision gibs Amiga scene 1 22 April 2011 17:43
New products by individual Computers Paul News 0 30 November 2004 16:58

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT +2. The time now is 15:02.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Page generated in 0.43343 seconds with 12 queries